Striking Union using non-union minimum wage picketers

30 posts / 0 new

Shocking! $8.25/hr. How is that considered a "living wage"?

"For a lot of our members, it's really difficult to have them come out, either because of parking or something else," explains Vincente Garcia, a union representative who is supervising the picketing.
What a beautiful sentiment.

Of the protesters, he said, "I don't blame them--they need the money, but they look like they are drunk or something."
I wonder if he's referring to the strikers for hire, or the union guys?

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2010/07/revealed-preference/59886/

slabmaster
Joined:
Apr. 1, 2010 10:12 am

Comments

Why would any of this irritate a righty?

kwikfix
Joined:
Apr. 9, 2010 12:51 pm

Right now, anything that creates a job gets the cons' panties in a bunch. Can't have anybody's life getting any better while a Dem is in the Oval Office...Gets in the way of the power grab.

drew013's picture
drew013
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm

You may be correct. This is the same strategy used by the Democrats in 2006 and 2008 to gain power. It could be that the Republicans are just good students and returning the favor.

Tweedle Dee and Tweetle Dum may set aside party politics long enough to accomplish something for the good of the country, but I doubt I will live to see it.

Paleo-con
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
This is the same strategy used by the Democrats in 2006 and 2008 to gain power.
What are you talking about?

Art's picture
Art
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
Quote drew013:

Right now, anything that creates a job gets the cons' panties in a bunch. Can't have anybody's life getting any better while a Dem is in the Oval Office...Gets in the way of the power grab.

Calling a strike, sending workers home from work and wages, stopping the productivity of the business, and hiring $8.25/hr replacements to picket for them is...... "job creation"?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

THAT could be the greatest liberal claptrap I've ever heard here.

Starts my day off laughing anyways.

slabmaster
Joined:
Apr. 1, 2010 10:12 am
Quote Art:
This is the same strategy used by the Democrats in 2006 and 2008 to gain power.
What are you talking about?

I think some kind of Kool-Aid trip (maybe sour grape flavor?).

drew013's picture
drew013
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm

I'm sorry... I thought you knew something about how unions work. Obviously I was (badly) mistaken. One of the things union dues are used for is to provide a paycheck for striking workers. These guys should be doing their own picketing. Sometimes, however, the company in question seeks (and is granted) an injunction prohibiting striking workers from being within a certain distance of the facility, hence the need to hire picketers. However, this doesn't appear to be the case here. Maybe the money could be better spent getting the striking workers to the site.

This ends today's lesson on basic union function.

And now I'll enjoy my mid-day laugh.

Thank you.

drew013's picture
drew013
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
Quote drew013:

"hence the need to hire picketers. However, this doesn't appear to be the case here."

And now I'll enjoy my mid-day laugh.

Thank you.

Not half as hard as I am.

"How unions work".....thats a good one. Obviously, they hire drunks at minimum wages to represent them on the picket line (which is probably pretty accurate on 2nd thought) during this all so important strike. I wonder what the union members are doing while the drunks representing them at $8.25/hr are sleeping on the sidewalk??

Give a new meaning to Proud to be Union...eh?

Thanks for contributing a non-relevant scenereo to the strikers and their "living wage" replacements and defending the mighty union against the evil tyranical opportunity supplier.

Maybe the drunks would be good replacements for the lazy bastards that can't find the effort to get off of their asses to wander down to their jobsite and strike for the "great cause". It's gotta be tough to hold a sign in the air and stand on a corner. I think I'd hire the drunk stand ins as they have a little more on the ball.

slabmaster
Joined:
Apr. 1, 2010 10:12 am

Maybe unions are becoming the employers of last resort...since government seems to be falling down on the job. If they want to hire someone to picket for them...they want to hire someone to picket for them.....at above minimum wage.

I'd do it. Know of any unions hiring in the Denver area? Would I have to join a Picketers Uniion in order to be hired. Does one exist? I don't think so. They probably have to hire non-unionized picketers.

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

polycarp2
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
Quote slabmaster:
Quote drew013:

"hence the need to hire picketers. However, this doesn't appear to be the case here."

And now I'll enjoy my mid-day laugh.

Thank you.

Not half as hard as I am.

"How unions work".....thats a good one. Obviously, they hire drunks at minimum wages to represent them on the picket line (which is probably pretty accurate on 2nd thought) during this all so important strike. I wonder what the union members are doing while the drunks representing them at $8.25/hr are sleeping on the sidewalk??

Give a new meaning to Proud to be Union...eh?

Thanks for contributing a non-relevant scenereo to the strikers and their "living wage" replacements and defending the mighty union against the evil tyranical opportunity supplier.

Maybe the drunks would be good replacements for the lazy bastards that can't find the effort to get off of their asses to wander down to their jobsite and strike for the "great cause". It's gotta be tough to hold a sign in the air and stand on a corner. I think I'd hire the drunk stand ins as they have a little more on the ball.

And now for my mid-afternoon laugh. More evidence of your "vast knowledge" of how unions work.

I would have quit while I was still ahead.

Your head seems to be stuck so far in the sand on this issue that people probably think you're surveying for oil the hard way.

drew013's picture
drew013
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm

i gotta say, as a liberal minded person, i think its ludicrous that any institution would have to hire people outside their industry to picket for them. regardless of why they are put in that position, if the anger isn't sufficient enough within the ranks of the industry being harmed, then picketing shouldn't occur. i would like Americans to march on DC in opposition to corporate control of our government, but i sure wouldn't hire a bunch of illegal immigrants to do it for us. that doesn't send a very strong message. i mean shit, if the people who are being harmed can't get enough of their own together then how can you say that people feel cheated??? i don't have a problem with picketers being paid, but i do have a problem with those paid picketers not being workers within the industry they are picketing for.

Barbazza's picture
Barbazza
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
Quote Barbazza:

i gotta say, as a liberal minded person, i think its ludicrous that any institution would have to hire people outside their industry to picket for them. regardless of why they are put in that position, if the anger isn't sufficient enough within the ranks of the industry being harmed, then picketing shouldn't occur. i would like Americans to march on DC in opposition to corporate control of our government, but i sure wouldn't hire a bunch of illegal immigrants to do it for us. that doesn't send a very strong message. i mean shit, if the people who are being harmed can't get enough of their own together then how can you say that people feel cheated??? i don't have a problem with picketers being paid, but i do have a problem with those paid picketers not being workers within the industry they are picketing for.

Ding ding!!

You sir, are the winner!!

It is an example of the hypocricy laden union brainwash. The defense of it is proof it has it's claws sunk in to the feeble minded and easly led.

One of your statements makes me wonder, should the border patrol union hire illegals to picket for them as it could be to hard on them to show to their own picket line?

slabmaster
Joined:
Apr. 1, 2010 10:12 am
Quote polycarp2:

Maybe unions are becoming the employers of last resort...since government seems to be falling down on the job. If they want to hire someone to picket for them...they want to hire someone to picket for them.....at above minimum wage.

I'd do it. Know of any unions hiring in the Denver area? Would I have to join a Picketers Uniion in order to be hired. Does one exist? I don't think so. They probably have to hire non-unionized picketers.

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

http://denver.craigslist.org/search/trd?query=union&catAbb=jjj&srchType=A

A 30 second search for a job with "union" as a key word in Denver only shows...53 job openings listed. I have no idea what you are capable of doing for a living Poly, but someone out there must need ya!

slabmaster
Joined:
Apr. 1, 2010 10:12 am
Quote slabmaster:

[quote=polycarp2]

A 30 second search for a job with "union" as a key word in Denver only shows...53 job openings listed.

That's because Bush and sick Dick Cheney destroyed the Union movement.

kwikfix
Joined:
Apr. 9, 2010 12:51 pm
Quote polycarp2:

I'd do it. Know of any unions hiring in the Denver area? Would I have to join a Picketers Uniion in order to be hired. Does one exist? I don't think so. They probably have to hire non-unionized picketers.

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

Poly,

as your employment counceler, I did another 30 second search and found a position right up you ally. Seriously, hangin out on college campuses for what pencils out to $11.42/hr + benifits! and blabbing about activism. No more hassles with medical, food at the cafeteria, associate with young fertile minds, etc...

You probably wouldn't have to even deal with stupid unions either!

"Campus Organizer - Training the Next Generation of Activists (Denver)"

http://denver.craigslist.org/npo/1805216880.html

slabmaster
Joined:
Apr. 1, 2010 10:12 am

Unions suck, period. People shouldn't be paid $30/hr to screw in a bolt that someone else could do for minimum wage. Or better yet, for $10 a week and be THRILLED with the job. If you want a higher paying job, get an education and WORK for it.

And you "Union Lovers" wonder why corporations leave the country.

Also you union workers scream STRIKE for higher wages because you want MORE MONEY, yet when your jobs leave the country because the corporation wants to make MORE MONEY you call it corporate greed.

F-ing Hippocrates.

thom71gt's picture
thom71gt
Joined:
Jul. 20, 2010 1:42 pm

I am a Teamster, and as pro-union as possible. I am disgusted by crap like the Carpenters using non-union minimum wage labor as picketers. It is morally wrong, a bad example to union membership and the public. These big construction craft unions have become job trusts, and their lack of solidarity will cause their ruin.

stewartsd's picture
stewartsd
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
Quote stewartsd:

I am a Teamster, and as pro-union as possible. I am disgusted by crap like the Carpenters using non-union minimum wage labor as picketers. It is morally wrong, a bad example to union membership and the public. These big construction craft unions have become job trusts, and their lack of solidarity will cause their ruin.

Though we don't share the union love, I respect your common sense and ability to see what is wrong with this picture. The outright hypocrisy.

I'd think the more disgusting part (as a union guy), would be to watch people defend this action and behavior.

slabmaster
Joined:
Apr. 1, 2010 10:12 am

Slab, why do you hate unions so much? No one is forcing you to use them.

Besides they barely exist anymore in America, they are hardly a threat to anyone.

meljomur's picture
meljomur
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
Unions suck, period. People shouldn't be paid $30/hr to screw in a bolt that someone else could do for minimum wage. Or better yet, for $10 a week and be THRILLED with the job.
Very few people work just for the love of working or out of generosity toward their employer. If that were true, they would work for free. They work for money.
If you want a higher paying job, get an education and WORK for it.
Education is a solution only for an individual. If everybody got a Phd, there would still be the same mix of skilled to unskilled jobs. How many graduate level people are unable to find work commensurate with their education level? France, for awhile, allowed any qualified person to get a medical degree. They ended up with a bunch of MDs driving cabs as a second job. It really has almost nothing to do with education.
And you "Union Lovers" wonder why corporations leave the country.
Nobody wonders why corporations leave the country. They do it for the same reason that people who work do what they do, so that they can make more money.
Also you union workers scream STRIKE for higher wages because you want MORE MONEY, yet when your jobs leave the country because the corporation wants to make MORE MONEY you call it corporate greed.
Not sure what point you're trying to make. Of course they strike because they want more money. Call it "greed" or call it "wanting more money". If that's what's bothering you, it seems pretty petty to me. We can call it all greed if that will make you feel better. It's a competition for money.That's all it is. nothing more, nothing less.
F-ing Hippocrates.
What does an ancient Greek physician have to do with it?

Art's picture
Art
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
Quote Art:
F-ing Hippocrates.
What does an ancient Greek physician have to do with it?

He'll need a modern one for that hole he just shot in his own foot. ;-)

It certainly speaks to his level of knowledge.

drew013's picture
drew013
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
Quote meljomur:

Slab, why do you hate unions so much? No one is forcing you to use them.

Besides they barely exist anymore in America, they are hardly a threat to anyone.

I'm not a fan of any cancer that negatively affects attitudes and productivity. Unions by nature are a cancer in the workplace.

I was a union member for 4 years (eye opener) and managed the same union work force for another 8 years (insanity). That experience forms my opinions of what unions bring to the workforce and business. I left that atmosphere because in this country, we have choices, and employing my own non-union employees was the best choice.

I hope you are right that unions hardly exist in America. They are certainly on the rapid decline. There is a good reason for that and I have great hope in my fellow man that unions will go the way of Small Pox. Eradicated.

slabmaster
Joined:
Apr. 1, 2010 10:12 am

Probably, if employers had volunatarily gone from a 12-16 hour day to an 8 hour day we wouldn't have unions. Had they gone from 6 1/2 day work-week to a 5 day work week, we wouldnt have unions. Probably if employers shared increases in worker productivity with workers, we wouldn't have unions.

Probably, if wages were high enough to purchase what labor produces, we wouldn't have Depressions. Factories wouldn't close their doors when there is an obvious need for their products.

Note even China gets that unions are one means to raise wages...so an economy can become/remain viable.

http://www.thomhartmann.com/forum/2010/07/china-wages-us-wages-down-why

Economies operated by and for a few tend to work really well for a few...until a population driven to greater and greater destitution begins lopping off a few heads. China gets that. Even totalitarians recognize they have fragile necks.

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

polycarp2
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm

Here is a sign of the times......

I just received a call from a large union contractor requesting our services on one of his projects. (4th jobsite of his in the last 3 weeks.) We do work locally and around the country for this customer and all of his large projects are run using union labor. So far, 4 different PM's have enlisted our help.

I asked on the first one, "why would you hire us, when you have a union work force?" He replied, "we can't sell it or even produce it profitably at the rates we have to charge and frankly, your guys work harder and are a better representitive for us".

We pay more in wages and beni's than union scale, yet our margins are substantially better than the union shop. Expectations and productivity are where the differences lie.

Unions have dug a hole and dumped the lemmings that buy into their BS into it.

I guess I shouldn't complain too much, it's good for our business having the competition suck by design.

slabmaster
Joined:
Apr. 1, 2010 10:12 am

Unions/companies in the U.S. are adversaries....rather than working together jointly for the profitable, equitable functioning of the company.

Probably the German/Norwegian models work better. It's more of a partnership between labor and the company rather than each side attempting to screw the other.

When I workd for a railway, the work rules were screwy...and it was obvious there was a bitter divide between labor/management that had become institutionalized..

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

polycarp2
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm

I must protest this original post.

Your vapid rhetorical question is answered simply by reading the link you posted. It would also be answered if you simply attributed your quotes properly... the second quote is not the Union organizer as your post states

Quote Juan Flores, Can-Am foreman: Juan Flores, Can-Am's foreman, said his nonunionized workers are paid fairly. Of the protesters, he said, "I don't blame them--they need the money, but they look like they are drunk or something."

Union busting usually includes slander and other falsehoods - ho-hum. Mis-quoting an article that you chose to post is bad ju-ju big dog.

You try walking for hours on pavement in mid-summer heat. When you get dizzy and stagger and have to sit or fall down people can pass by and spit on you as a drunk. Heatstroke symptoms are similar to intoxication.

LeMoyne's picture
LeMoyne
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
Quote LeMoyne:

I must protest this original post.

Your vapid rhetorical question is answered simply by reading the link you posted. It would also be answered if you simply attributed your quotes properly... the second quote is not the Union organizer as your post states

Quote Juan Flores, Can-Am foreman: Juan Flores, Can-Am's foreman, said his nonunionized workers are paid fairly. Of the protesters, he said, "I don't blame them--they need the money, but they look like they are drunk or something."

Union busting usually includes slander and other falsehoods - ho-hum. Mis-quoting an article that you chose to post is bad ju-ju big dog.

You try walking for hours on pavement in mid-summer heat. When you get dizzy and stagger and have to sit or fall down people can pass by and spit on you as a drunk. Heatstroke symptoms are similar to intoxication.

What is funny is that in your protest, you butcher the original quotes to create your own, then accuse me of mis-quoting.

I quoted two quotes from the article. Never mis-quoted anyone, just exposed what they said.

You try walking for hours on pavement in mid-summer heat. When you get dizzy and stagger and have to sit or fall down people can pass by and spit on you as a drunk. Heatstroke symptoms are similar to intoxication.
OHHHH....NOOOOOOO!!!!!!! Not walking on pavement!!!!!! NOOOOO!!!!!!!

The union boobs didn't have to worry about those horrible work conditions anyways, did they? It would be too tough for them to protest at their own strike!

I've never sat down and had someone spit on me as a drunk. What's that like anyways?

slabmaster
Joined:
Apr. 1, 2010 10:12 am

I'm really sad at the loss of unions. true, some of them got out of hand (cause the members weren't aware enough/active enough to keep management in line). However, unions have been under attack from the rich forever. Its a tremendous barrier to overcome. Now, there is the added enemy, the corporate controlled media. The union has succumbed, just like democracy, to big money. After the "Citizens United" decision, the richest few percent have even more power, the poor less.

harry ashburn
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm
Quote Slabmaster:I've never sat down and had someone spit on me as a drunk. What's that like anyways!!!
Art's picture
Art
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 3:01 pm

Currently Chatting

The other way we're subsidizing Walmart...

Most of us know how taxpayers subsidize Walmart's low wages with billions of dollars in Medicaid, food stamps, and other financial assistance for workers. But, did you know that we're also subsidizing the retail giant by paying the cost of their environmental destruction.

Powered by Pressflow, an open source content management system