The "Occupy" protests are failing, its time to regroup...

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The "Occupy" protests are failing, its time to regroup...

On the third Saturday in September, the Occupy Wall Street movement began in Zuccotti Park in New York City. The basic goal was to, via mass protests, bring attention and hopefully fundamental change to how the financial industry, with its political mistresses of all ideological stripes does business.

The protests grew over the coming weeks, with some impressive numbers in various marches/encampments all around the Country. There's also been some participation in several cities around the world. The abuses of Wall Street and the buffoonish behavior of politicians and Presidents in dealing with said abuses leaves many of us feeling exploited, wronged and to some degree, generally screwed over.

The growing income disparity is real, not imagined and should be a topic for serious discussion and policy work.

The core issues are worthy of serious thought. The organisation or lack of it with these protests are leading to its failure. The sideshows of civil disobedience, outright law breaking and anti-social behavior are hurting the Occupy cause much more than helping it. All Occupy encampments should close up shop immediately, clean up your areas to match or exceed how they looked before you took those spaces over. While I certainly don't believe everything I see or read about the off the chain behavior of a few whack-jobs, someone in this movement needs to realize your message has been tainted terribly by the images and reports regarding many of these Occupy sites.

I say scrap the occupation mentality totally and come back next time with something a little smarter, a little more reasonable and a lot more accessible for most Americans to understand, support and condone.

Want to know why the Tea Party protests have been mostly without controversy...

Click here to continue...

Bill in Dayton
Joined:
Jul. 18, 2010 4:32 pm

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No they need to regroup !!!!

Banks Versus the American Dream

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atmVLBrON60

The Money Masters.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936&q=The+money+changers&ei=Zd4QSMjvB47YqAKQtJmzBA

They angry but now they need to get educated !!!!!

Ron Paul in 2012 !!!!!!!!!!

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elgiabo
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Oct. 8, 2011 1:29 pm

There is only one reason and one reason only negative elements could overwhelm the movement: lack of participation by the "good" people. There is only one reason the "good" people would allow this to happen: they are cowards looking for an excuse to back out of something much bigger and harder than they were capable of realizing when they began. They realize that civil disobedience is the only way the movement can grow, because marches are not effective. They realize that some sort of active non-violent form of demonstrations and even tactical action must take place until grassroots organizing is capable of generating an effective mass-movement; but they don't want to be the ones who are awake at 1am dealing with a shouting mentally-ill veteran who may or may not be part of a deliberate attempt to disrupt the camp. I'm not tooting my own horn here. There are those who have been working diligently all along on the front lines who want to see this movement thrive. They live and work at the occupations regularly. They see the good side of the majority of the people living there. For example, bringing to american culture something that has been lost by us but has been the staple of humanity for millenia: people gathering and singing and dancing and playing music. Talking, visiting with each other, living a life of freedom and adventure, maintaining a social fabric which stretches across continents and thrives in the squats, camps, mountains, beaches, and forests of the world. Its not how little of the garbage you believe, its how much of the non-garbage you are able to see. I don't give a rat's ass what anyone else has to say about it.

nimblecivet's picture
nimblecivet
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

Very well put! Thank you! OWS was street was evicted by the very people whose salaries are being paid for by the 99%! Rather than to evict them the police should have done their jobs and protected them. The police in Philly were doing just that. OWS will not fail and they are getting the message out there and the more they succeed the harder the 1% will work to attempt to shut them up, but OWS will only continue to grow stronger. "Get Up Stand Up For Your Rights!" Bob Marley

webbleslie's picture
webbleslie
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Nov. 15, 2011 7:27 pm

The fact that OWS has made a splash in the major news cycles should be considered a victory. This is a long term movement that doesn't end just as soon as a few protesters get kicked out of a park. There's a never ending list of places to occupy out there.

Tea Party Events were less controversial because they were less meaningful. They are over. Occupy will continue on for far longer than the Tea Party ever could because it has meaningful and lasting value.

Laborisgood's picture
Laborisgood
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

WE ARE STARING INTO THE HEART OF THE LOTUS

Now we see with the ferocious attacks against Occupy Oakland, Occupy Wall Street, Occupy Portland, and all the other occupations, the march against the people is coming out in the open and it ain't pretty. We are up against some deadly dragons and we had better not drop our guard. Learn all we can, be strong, build our alliances. Don't get into petty actions or inter-familial fights. We will have differences and make mistakes. Don't hold on your brothers and sisters, forgive and do better. Remember we have put ourselves in the public eye. Always be aware of the opportunity to educate and open minds to our highest intentions.

Occupy Nashville has had a pretty easy trip. We have survived with grace our preliminary test by fire from the 2 raids by state troopers and Homeland Security. Thanks to the night court magistrate and the Federal judge who threw out the warrants and the Metro judge who expunged all the records, we have won some victories. But make no mistake, we are in the sights of dangerous enemies of democracy and freedom. Lives are at stake. Our lives and freedoms are at stake.

It is good to remember how this global movement was started by the actions of a poor man brought to desperation by oppression of the 1% of a wealthy dictator. He set himself on fire. That spark has set the world afire with nonviolent revolution. We cannot afford to be blown away by the winds of change. At this point we are riding with that wind and it is important that we hold strong to the helm of our movement. We have great potential here in Nashville.

The media continues to harp on the seeming lack of direction by the various occupations. Ignored is the very focused nonviolence toward equality and fairness that is the biggest difference between the OWS and the aggressive, gun toting Tea Party protesters. Corporate financial institutions are upset by the Occupy Wall Street actions that have gone global. They see these actions as being effective toward curbing their power. It has been acknowledged that the Keystone Pipeline XL was, in part, postponed because of the influence from the occupations. Let us not kid ourselves, this is not a game. this is real, and we must not be indulgent with the energy that we have. Pay attention. Be smart, and persevere.

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Eliz77
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

People are having a difficult time connecting the dots with OWS. To a lot of folks it appears as if the OWS crowd sees that the banks have money and they simply want the banks to give them money that they did nothing to earn. Right or wrong, this is the perception.

They could help themselves by being more specific. They could start by doing a few simple things:

Focus: What exactly is the illegal or unethical behaviour? If the bevaviour is unethical but not illegal then stop protesting wall street and start protesting Washington. Because laws need to be changed.

Name names: Pick out a few of the worst offenders, site specific examples of what they did wrong and demand that they answer for it. Name the companies and individuals involved and focus like a laser beam.

Stay on topic: Sometimes liberal demonstrations deteriorate into protests of a thousand topics. All that does is confuse the issue. Work on an issue, drive it out then move on to the next one.

Be Specific: Targeting everyone is no more affective than targeting no one. Connect the dots. Identify the crimes, Make the individual people responsible for their crimes.

What is the end game? What exactly is it you want from wall street? Do you want them to give you some money? Donate more money to the government? Give money away to the homeless? Build a wind farm? What do you want from them?

Don't blame the police: They get their orders from city hall. If you have a beef, blame the government. Go to city hall.

The bottom line is this: You absolutely MUST do more than complain. A general complaint will get you nothing.

rigel1's picture
rigel1
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Jan. 31, 2011 7:49 am

I don't agree with hardly anything on this list. We have focused, specific, targeted debate routinely in the media. I don't think that this is what the movement is about. These suggestions assume that the protestors are interested in convincing people of a point of view. I don't think that's what this movement is about. I don't think the protestors care whether people agree with them about trade agreements or torture or any one of a thousand specific issues. I think that the protestors assume that any rational, civilized and aware citizen understands the sickness in the system and has the understanding to make a choice whose side (s)he wants to be on. I don't think that the protestors feel like they need or want the assistence of people who are still too confused on these issues to know where they stand.

Art's picture
Art
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
Quote Art:

I don't agree with hardly anything on this list.

There is nothing to agree or disagree with. I'm simply telling you the info that me and millions of others will need to understand. The vast majority of people don't get it. Answering the above questions will help. Who have you identified? Give me the names of five people and what you want them to do with their money.

Then there is the hypocrisy. When the OWS folks bring in the 1% to complain about the 1%. Huh? I've seen Alec Baldwin down there. He's complaining about the banks and the 1%. He is in the upper 1% of the 1%. Filthy rich. And HE'S BEING PAID BY THE BANKS!!!

In Cincinnati, Jesse Jackson is dropping by to whine about the 1%. I wonder if he carries a mirror with him.

Gazillionaire Nancy Pelosi supports OWS and the war on the 1%. Is she too stupid to realize that she has declared war on herself?

rigel1's picture
rigel1
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Jan. 31, 2011 7:49 am
Quote rigel1:

People are having a difficult time connecting the dots with OWS. To a lot of folks it appears as if the OWS crowd sees that the banks have money and they simply want the banks to give them money that they did nothing to earn. Right or wrong, this is the perception.

They could help themselves by being more specific. They could start by doing a few simple things:

Focus: What exactly is the illegal or unethical behaviour? If the bevaviour is unethical but not illegal then stop protesting wall street and start protesting Washington. Because laws need to be changed.

Name names: Pick out a few of the worst offenders, site specific examples of what they did wrong and demand that they answer for it. Name the companies and individuals involved and focus like a laser beam.

Stay on topic: Sometimes liberal demonstrations deteriorate into protests of a thousand topics. All that does is confuse the issue. Work on an issue, drive it out then move on to the next one.

Be Specific: Targeting everyone is no more affective than targeting no one. Connect the dots. Identify the crimes, Make the individual people responsible for their crimes.

What is the end game? What exactly is it you want from wall street? Do you want them to give you some money? Donate more money to the government? Give money away to the homeless? Build a wind farm? What do you want from them?

Don't blame the police: They get their orders from city hall. If you have a beef, blame the government. Go to city hall.

The bottom line is this: You absolutely MUST do more than complain. A general complaint will get you nothing.

Your points are valid, in spite of your blame the gov't for all ills and transparent "no crimes have been commited" defense. Many in the gov't are complicit in the legal crimes of stacking the decks in favor of the banks and corporations. In fact, a majority of the Democrats are guilty along with 100% of the GOP. That gets lost on many of the disgruntled protesters when they fall into the same old Left vs Right meme. Left vs Right is a waste of time. Bottom vs Top is where it's at.

You appear to have good grasp on the shortcomings of the movement Rigel. Get your protest sign out and show 'em how it should be done!

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Laborisgood
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

Laborisgood, I fear that rigel may have a better insight into the faults of OWS than to its assets and strengths. His "prescription" may be what is needed in the process, in the fullness of time. It is not what OWS needs to do now at the expense of the dynamics of conversation and consensus building and engagement. This is a Great Awakening bubbling up from the reality at the ground. It is not something that needs too much management. It is happening and the trick is how to be in alignment with the process, not how to write the script.

rigel's posts indicate something far more partisan Ron Paulish than Progressive, and while there is much to agree with in some areas, the general theme is "how naive Liberals are." Were it not wrapped in Libertarian certainty, it might have more value as criticism. We can see what is wrong with the cons better than what is wrong with ourselves. But we are not ideologues. We do alter our ideas to conform to evidence and experience. For the ideologue, reality must bend to belief.

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DRC
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

We're sort of in a revolutionary time -frame. There will either be revolutionary political/economic change...or a building and impending collapse will force it. OWS is merely an indicator of that. It's the beginning of a national conversation that has to take place if we're to avoid a tremendous amount of national and personal suffering not too far down the line..

The global financial melt-down is on-going...with each new band aid quickly rotting and needing replaced. Global and U.S. austerity measures as the solution of last resort will simply collapse economies right along with the meltown.

We're in the brief calm before the storm. It isn't a time for complacency.

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

polycarp2
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
I'm simply telling you the info that me and millions of others will need to understand.

Like I said:

I don't think that the protestors feel like they need or want the assistence of people who are still too confused on these issues to know where they stand.

If you don't know whose side your on, then you are not really invited.

Art's picture
Art
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
Quote DRC:

rigel's posts indicate something far more partisan Ron Paulish than Progressive, and while there is much to agree with in some areas, the general theme is "how naive Liberals are." Were it not wrapped in Libertarian certainty, it might have more value as criticism. We can see what is wrong with the cons better than what is wrong with ourselves. But we are not ideologues. We do alter our ideas to conform to evidence and experience. For the ideologue, reality must bend to belief.

I'd never accuse Rigel of progressivism (perhaps regressivism), but I would like to see his protest sign. The Left seeing wrong in the Right better than true introspection is much of what keeps us from moving forward. The Dems need a serious wake up call. Not Right v Left, but Top v Bottom will more swiftly bring about the change that is already on it's way. The lack of bending to belief by the Top will only expedite the matter. As Poly said, "it's no time for complacency". Chop, chop!

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Laborisgood
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

The Occupy decivilization cult showed a lack of intelligence & rational thinking from the beginning, so its implosion & alienation of the American people would have happened regardless. The Gods of the Copybook Headings win yet again.

Meanwhile, the nation's Strict Fathers and their families will enjoy their Thanksgiving feasts in warmth & comfort next week. Thanksgiving might have had religious origins, but in practice it celebrates man's ability to produce, and to enjoy the fruits of his efforts, so I find the holiday defensible & enjoyable for secular reasons.

What could qualify as about the exact opposite holiday, that punishes man's ability to produce and deprives him of the fruits of his efforts? Probably April 15, after progressives got into government and perverted the purposes of taxation.

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MrAdvancedAtheist
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Nov. 17, 2011 8:09 am
Quote Art:
I'm simply telling you the info that me and millions of others will need to understand.

Like I said:

I don't think that the protestors feel like they need or want the assistence of people who are still too confused on these issues to know where they stand.

If you don't know whose side your on, then you are not really invited.

I'm just saying that if OWS does not bother to take the time to educate the masses, then the effort will fail miserably. They have already seen a significant loss of support .That trend will continue. They offer complaints but no solutions. I see a lot of "tax the rich signs." Congress levies taxes not wall street. Why are they not occupying congress? There are a lot of very smart people who believe that OWS is being sneaky. They may have a hidden agena. If they are asked questions such as the ones that I have presented, they need to answer them. Otherwise they will be seen as untrustworthy and they will surely fail.

rigel1's picture
rigel1
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Jan. 31, 2011 7:49 am
They have already seen a significant loss of support .That trend will continue.

I haven't seen anything in the news that even hints at this being true. Only that the movement continues on despite controversy.

It's sad that many people still don't know where they stand on the big issues. I don't think the protestors are much interested in educating people about issues that have been discussed in the media for years now.

Your point about whether Congress or Wall Street levies taxes tells us that you are probably on the other side. OK then. There we are.

Art's picture
Art
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
Quote Laborisgood:
Quote rigel1:

People are having a difficult time connecting the dots with OWS. To a lot of folks it appears as if the OWS crowd sees that the banks have money and they simply want the banks to give them money that they did nothing to earn. Right or wrong, this is the perception.

They could help themselves by being more specific. They could start by doing a few simple things:

Focus: What exactly is the illegal or unethical behaviour? If the bevaviour is unethical but not illegal then stop protesting wall street and start protesting Washington. Because laws need to be changed.

Name names: Pick out a few of the worst offenders, site specific examples of what they did wrong and demand that they answer for it. Name the companies and individuals involved and focus like a laser beam.

Stay on topic: Sometimes liberal demonstrations deteriorate into protests of a thousand topics. All that does is confuse the issue. Work on an issue, drive it out then move on to the next one.

Be Specific: Targeting everyone is no more affective than targeting no one. Connect the dots. Identify the crimes, Make the individual people responsible for their crimes.

What is the end game? What exactly is it you want from wall street? Do you want them to give you some money? Donate more money to the government? Give money away to the homeless? Build a wind farm? What do you want from them?

Don't blame the police: They get their orders from city hall. If you have a beef, blame the government. Go to city hall.

The bottom line is this: You absolutely MUST do more than complain. A general complaint will get you nothing.

You appear to have good grasp on the shortcomings of the movement Rigel. Get your protest sign out and show 'em how it should be done!

I can't. I gotta work. I'm in the 53% that is pulling the wagon for the other 47%.

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rigel1
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Jan. 31, 2011 7:49 am

Now there you go again. Sorry, the analysis is incorrect. Nein, nein, nein!

Were the "53%" really "pulling the wagon for the other 47," there would be no OWS. The problem is who is pulling the wagons for themselves and keeping all the goods as well. It is not as if the "53" has been taking care of the country or the infrastructure. It is not as if they have been investing in the prosperity of their fellow citizens or endowing the means of social health. Nope, they have been lining their own pockets and living with oblivious disregard to the homeless, the abandoned, the poor and the hopeless.

About 52% of you have been working for the 1% while getting relative peanuts for your efforts. Yup, you do live in McMansions and drive big cars. You can afford to send your kids to college but barely. The Middle has been priced out of much of higher education and comes out with indentured servitude instead of careers. You may not have noticed that while you have been doing ok, but not really getting any richer, the middle and the poor have dropped away from your "staff to the rich" jobs and residences. The workers are being foreclosed out of the Middle Class.

What really sucks is the resentment. If you have a job and a decent income, try to understand that most of those out of work want what you have. They don't want "your" job if they can have their jobs. And some remember when we had careers instead of jobs. The value loss from career to job is significant even were the pay equal.

Were we willing to invest in our fellow citizens and their opportunity, we would have free education through college, universal health care, also free, and other social supports to guarantee freedom from economic enclosure. It is called a birthright, not a dole. What OWS is all about is the former, not some begging for welfare alone. That we recognize that abandoning people is wrong and too expensive as well is essential if we are to respond to the lost dream and democratic reality. This is about people feeling that they do not participate in the power of their society. That is a classic definition of freedom, participation in power, and it is enough to know that you are not part of the power to speak up.

DRC's picture
DRC
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
Quote DRC:

This is about people feeling that they do not participate in the power of their society. That is a classic definition of freedom, participation in power, and it is enough to know that you are not part of the power to speak up.

Righties love to use the words like freedom and liberty as excuses to be selfish and greedy because they refuse to acknowledge the freedoms and liberties of ALL in their society. Liberty is a very interesting word that can be interpreted as license to get yours or a dictate to provide for all. Is securing the liberties for one person which requires a loss of liberty for 99 others acceptable? I'm all for fairness, but if the liberties of 99 Americans on the lower end of the economic spectrum requires a loss of liberties for one on the top, I can live with that. I have a hard time accepting the opposite.

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Laborisgood
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
Liberty is a very interesting word that can be interpreted as license to get yours or a dictate to provide for all

Liberty, for Conservatives, is applicable in only one context. They only insist on liberty in how they are allowed to make their money. That's the only thing that is relevant in the Conservative world.

Art's picture
Art
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

It should be fairly easy to encapsulate into something like this:
"Whereas the instruments of financial capital have been used to overwhelm the political institutions of this country and thwart the will of the people to fulfill the vision of freedom and prosperity which they wish to bequeth to their children, We, the Occupiers, declare that our Occupation shall grow and expand in its efforts and strategies until the following have been accomplished:

1) reform of the political system> Reform the filibuster to eliminate the need for a "supermajority" in the Senate. Make the voting process open and transparent to ensure fairness and accuracy.

2) adequately regulate the financial system> Re-impose Glass-Steagal. Repeal the Commodities Exchange Modernization Act. Nationalize "the Fed."

3) end corporate personhood> Pass a constitutional amendment declaring that constitutional rights apply only to natural persons.

Occupy SF has a lot of work to do focusing its message. I don't know if the process has gotten bogged down over consensus and differences of opinion. One of the working groups is going to persue more autonomy in printing and distributing fliers, etc. We will say they are printed by the "Occupy SF Outreach Committee" instead of just "Occupy SF." That way we won't get mired in getting approval for everything we do from the General Assembly or the other working groups.

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nimblecivet
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

While the details of your proposals are all fine, they do not "rally" the people as they define issues. They only make those who do not feel that point feel that they are not of the 99. Or, they reduce the vision to obtainable goals without making those goals mere mileposts on the journey to democracy.

I think Democracy is the issue that confronts Americans. Empires cannot be democracies or republics for that matter. Governing ourselves instead of being ruled by authoritarians whether domestic or foreign is the American Dream. How it works out economically is the product of a democratic vision, not how we get to democracy. Obviously, democracies require a greater economic equality than do plantation and sweatshop societies.

Respecting the process is the right strategy. The energy for OWS is coming up from the people, not because somebody has preached the organizing sermon or proclaimed the universal vision. It is about people connecting their own stories with others in the 99. There is a lot of diversity. There are people in the 99 who have some reason to resent others in the 99. The homeless and mentally ill came to the occupation camps and were too much for the OWS to handle. That is not a failure for OWS unless we had decided to take on the problem of homeless and mentally ill discarded people as the mission of the movement. Some may, but the civil leaders have ignored these people and are now "concerned" about bad things happening at the encampments. Did they think people did not die or have medical crises "out there" on the streets at night without OWS? Are they pledging to deal with the neglected as they close the camps?

It is not about holding territory. It is about holding the narrative. Just have lots of events, particularly fun gigs where ridicule and satire are the themes rather than "anger." We support the homeless, but our 99 complaints include a lot of people who have some money including the Millionaires for Tax Increases. We have honorary memberships in the 99 for human beings with 1% wealth.

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DRC
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

"Occupy" is being shown live around the world on twitter from many major U.S. cities right along with the over-reaction of police forces attempting to silence legitimate, Constitutional dissent. I've been watching it myself. from time to time during the day.

Probably pepper-spraying an 84 year old woman won't win the police or their 1% lackey bosses a whole lot of sympathy. Had she been swinging a cane, maybe. She wasn't.

If peaceful dissent and voicing of grievances isn't allowed, it could turn nasty.

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

polycarp2
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

What is the connection between goals/vision and strategy?

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nimblecivet
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

Bill in Dayton, you have fallen right into the trap that FOX News et.al. set for you. They don't show the thousands who came out to hear Robert Reich speak or discuss the fact that occupiers have stepped up to feed homeless people and help homeowners facing eviction. Instead they talk about "flea ridden" hippies and local businesses being affected. Shame on you!

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mdhess
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Apr. 9, 2010 11:43 pm

I had someone approach me during out local occupy rally yesterday asking what the point was. Geez, did they have earplugs and blinders on? The signs and folks on the bullhorns were eliciting many points. There IS no one central point unless you just want to say "the economy has been screwed and we want to fix it (and not let the rich do it their way)."

I also told them as long as the movement remains amorphous about goals the establishment can't quash it and the movement will continue to grow. She also thought that it was mainly a movement about disgruntled unemployed people but I would bet many there were employed. I do contract software development, work at home and make my own schedule so I was able to make this protest and even just walk to it as it was a couple blocks away from my home. Certainly there were unemployed in the crowd and many retirees concerned about losing their benefits.

We also need to check back with the 53% a year from now to see if they are still employed.

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captbebops
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

Maybe the prime message is allowing people to see their personal conditions aren't their fault...it's the system itself.

QUOTE: ""I think that the Occupy Wall Street movement, at least here in New York, is like what has occurred in Greece and also in the Arab Spring. People are coming together, and at first they may simply watch what’s going on. Onlookers may come by to see what it’s all about. But then they think, “Wait a minute! Other people are having the same problem I’m having. Maybe it is not really my fault.”

"So they begin to see that all these other people who have a similar problem in not being able to pay their debts; they realize that they have been financially crippled by the banks. It is not that they have done something wrong or are sore losers, as Herman Cain says. There’s something radically wrong with the system."

"We are seeing a financial grab for special privilege and for political power to use the government to subsidize the top 1% at the expense of the bottom 99%, "

The government itself has become more indebted, most recently by the $13 trillion in new debt printed and given to the banks to make sure that no financial gambler need suffer a loss.

It is not really radical to resist Wall Street’s financial attack on America. Resistance is natural - Michael Hudson, economist./research professor.

Full article here: http://www.counterpunch.org/2011/11/18/first-steps-in-reforming-the-u-s-financial-and-tax-system/

Politically: "But what I sensed in New York was anger not only at this economic problem, but the fact that the political system is broken. There is no one to vote for as an alternative to pro-bank candidates. So what began as anger has become a gathering awareness that Obama was simply fooling voters instead of leading the change he promised. That’s what politicians do, of course. But people hoped that he might be different. That was the gullibility he played on. He has turned into the nightmare they thought they were voting against."

"Moving to the right of the Republicans, he started his administration by appointing the Simpson-Bowles Commission staffed by opponents of Social Security. He recently followed that up by appointing the Congressional Super-committee of Twelve to come out with an even more anti-Social Security, anti-Medicaid and anti-minority position" - Hudson

Hudson's solutions to growing economic serfdom may be found on the link above. They include a write-off of public/private debt. Debt fraudulently owed to the financial class that the economy will never be able to pay. A clean slate.

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

polycarp2
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

I think we commit an injustice when we frame this movement in a national context because this awakening is global. Sure, we're Americans and OWS gets its name from the street here in the states, but the movement was inspired by the Arab Spring, wasn't it?

A "clean slate" would be nice, but if that happened would we just return to more of our unsustainable ways drunk with an illusion of victory? We'd all be able to afford to burn more fossil fuels and buy more worthless crap.

Golly, I sure am cheerful today

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MEJ
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

The Occupiers have shown for 2 months that they are here to stay - and this was important first step. Now time for 3 things:

1. Strategy for end game

2. Focusing on legislation to "de-person" corporations and get the corporate money out of Congressional campaigns

3. A leader with political clout to emerge who can make #1 and #2 happen.

As for flailing, I don't think so if what is reported here is true.

Let's stay the course, we the People!

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aml1954
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

The N.Y. Times reported that 1/3 of Americans are now living in poverty or near poverty. The hammer of austerity soon to fall should increase that considerably.

Rather than waiting for the hammer to strike their own households, Americans should get involved in seeking real change rather than promised change that somehow never seems to materialize...In part, that's what OWS is about.

Wall Street and the claims of financiers and bankers are close to exceeding the entire world's global economic output. Costs of bailing bankster gambling debts can't be paid out of that.

Bailing Greece and Italy is bailing the banksters of France, Germany and ultimately those of the U.S.whose dealings are intermingled with European Banksters. Next up are Spain and Portugal.

The bailouts are being paid out of the pockets of ordinary citizens...with wage reductions, pension reductions and reductions in government services. Taxes paying off banksters for their self-induced, on-going crises instead of paying teachers and repairing crumbling bridges is probably stupid..

As long as international finance is running governments....that's what will be done. This isn't just an "American" thing. It's worldwide..Removing capital controls under the umbrella of "free trade" opened the door to that.on the international level. De-regulating finance in individual countries opened the door to building an international Casino.

The growing debts can't be re-paid...no matter how much austerity is imposed. They will soon exceed the globe's total economic output. The only real solution is to write them off and create a new financial system from scratch. Since finance controls governments, that probably won't be done.

Finance is about generating monetary claims on productive wealth...real wealth....stuff. Those claims nearly exceed the world's productive capacity. What did finance produce in return for monetary claims on the world's entire economic output? NOTHING

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

polycarp2
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
Quote rigel1:

I'm just saying

bamboo's picture
bamboo
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

The power of silence that caller Caroline mentioned.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8775ZmNGFY8&feature=youtu.be

bamboo's picture
bamboo
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

The only way they will fail is if the collectivists take them over.

The Animosity towards the FED & banks is far to great to be de-railed now !!!!!

Banks Versus the American Dream

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atmVLBrON60

The Money Masters.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936&q=The+money+changers&ei=Zd4QSMjvB47YqAKQtJmzBA

"A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated. The growth of the nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated governments in the civilized world. No longer a government by free opinion, no longer a government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominant men."
-Woodrow Wilson, (1856-1924) 28th US President, passed the Federal Reserve Act

"If all the bank loans were paid up, no one would have a bank deposit, and there would not be a dollar of currency or coin in circulation. This is a staggering thought. We are completely dependent on the commercial Banks. Someone has to borrow every dollar we have in circulation, cash or credit. If the Banks create ample synthetic money we are prosperous; if not, we starve. We are absolutely without a permanent money system. When one gets a complete grasp of the picture, the tragic absurdity of our hopeless position is almost incredible, but there it is. It is the most important subject intelligent persons can investigate and reflect upon. It is so important that our present civilization may collapse unless it becomes widely understood and the defects remedied very soon."
-Robert Hemphill, Credit Manager of Federal Reserve Bank, Atlanta, Ga.

"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning."
-Henry Ford

"100% of what is collected is absorbed solely by interest on the Federal Debt ... all individual income tax revenues are gone before one nickel is spent on the services taxpayers expect from government."
-Grace Commission (report submitted to President Ronald Reagan on January 15, 1984)

"In the absence of the gold standard, there is no way to protect savings from confiscation through inflation. ... This is the shabby secret of the welfare statists' tirades against gold. Deficit spending is simply a scheme for the confiscation of wealth. Gold stands in the way of this insidious process. It stands as a protector of property rights. If one grasps this, one has no difficulty in understanding the statists' antagonism toward the gold standard."
-Alan Greenspan, Chairman, US Federal Reserve Bank

"In the United States today we have in effect two governments ... We have the duly constituted Government ... Then we have an independent, uncontrolled and uncoordinated government in the Federal Reserve System, operating the money powers which are reserved to Congress by the Constitution."
-Congressman Wright Patman

"We have, in this country, one of the most corrupt institutions the world has ever known. I refer to the Federal Reserve Board. This evil institution has impoverished the people of the United States and has practically bankrupted our government. It has done this through the corrupt practices of the moneyed vultures who control it."
- Congressman Louis T. McFadden in 1932 (Rep. Pa)

"Every effort has been made by the Fed to conceal its power but the truth is, the Fed has usurped the government. It controls everything here and it controls all our foreign relations. It makes and breaks governments at will."
- Congressman Louis T. McFadden

"What is needed here is a return to the Constitution of the United States. We need to have a complete divorce of Bank and State. The old struggle that was fought out here in Jackson's day must be fought over again... The Federal Reserve Act should be repealed and the Federal Reserve Banks, having violated their charters, should be liquidated immediately. Faithless Government officers who have violated their oaths of office should be impeached and brought to trial. Unless this is done by us, I predict that the American people, outraged, robbed, pillaged, insulted, and betrayed as they are in their own land, will rise in their wrath and send a President here who will sweep the money changers out of the temple."
-Louis T. McFadden, (1876-1936) US Congressman (R-PA) (1915-1935)

"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. Already they have raised up a moneyed aristocracy that has set the Government at defiance. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people to whom it properly belongs."
-Thomas Jefferson, (1743-1826), US Founding Father, drafted the Declaration of Independence, 3rd US President

"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their money, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them, will deprive the people of their property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered."
-Thomas Jefferson

"History records that the money-changers have used every form of abuse, intrigue, deceit, and violent plans possible to maintain their control over governments by controlling money, and its issuance."
- James Madison

"The bold effort the present (central) bank had made to control the government ... are but premonitions of the fate that await the American people should they be deluded into a perpetuation of this institution or the establishment of another like it."
-Andrew Jackson, (1767-1845) 7th US President

"Whoever controls the volume of money in any country is absolute master of all industry and commerce."
-James A. Garfield, President of the United States

"Our whole monetary system is dishonest, as it is debt-based... We did not vote for it. It grew upon us gradually but markedly since 1971 when the commodity-based system was abandoned."
-The Earl of Caithness, in a speech to the House of Lords, 1997

"The modern banking system manufactures money out of nothing. The process is perhaps the most astonishing piece of slight of hand ever invented. Banking was conceived in iniquity and born in sin.....Bankers own the Earth. Take it away from them but leave them the power to create money, and, with the flick of a pen, they will create enough money to buy it back again.....Take this great power away from them and all great fortunes like mine will disappear and they ought to disappear, for then this would be a better and happier world to live in.....But, if you want to continue to be the slave of the bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, then let the bankers continue to create money and control credit."
-Sir Josiah Stamp, Director of the Bank of England

"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes the laws."
-Mayer Amschel Rothschild

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elgiabo
Joined:
Oct. 8, 2011 1:29 pm

Yep the info genie is out of the bottle for sure.

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elgiabo
Joined:
Oct. 8, 2011 1:29 pm

Currently Chatting

Time to Rethink the War on Terror

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When Eric Holder eventually steps down as Attorney General, he will leave behind a complicated legacy, some of it tragic, like his decision not to prosecute Wall Street after the financial crisis, and his all-out war on whistleblowers like Edward Snowden.

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