Why Does The GOP Want To Sabotage Debt Paydown?

20 posts / 0 new

Even before a unified surplus first appeared in FY98 and finally an on-budget surplus finally appeared in FY99, the GOP was trying to sabotage even the possibility of a Surplus. Leaving aside the fact that they were adamantly against the Clinton tax hike of 1993 which is almost entirely responsible for the Clinton Surplus, Dole ran in 96 proposing a 15% across the board tax cut. There was a small tax cut in 1997. Newt proposed tax cuts in FY98 and a huge $800 tax cut in 1999. Those last two were vetoed by Clinton who wanted to pay down debt. Bush in 2000 ran on a tax cut but promised to preserve the surplus and pay down debt. We know that was never true. Even as the deficits mounted, the GOP accelerated their tax cuts.

So with such a clear historical record of fiscal irresponsibility and REPEATED attempts to sabotage debt paydown, why should ANYONE trust the GOP now? We can't write this off to some inability to do simple math. What's the deeper pathology?

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm

Comments

What? Somebody is trying to pay down the debt? Can you please provide the names of a few of these people and their proposals for debt reduction?

rigel1's picture
rigel1
Joined:
Jan. 31, 2011 7:49 am
Quote rigel1:

What? Somebody is trying to pay down the debt? Can you please provide the names of a few of these people and their proposals for debt reduction?

I think both Parties have given up on the idea. But the GOP is the only party that now has 30 year record of actually trying to sabotage debt paydown.

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm

Speaking of Owellian revisionist history.....

Capital.0's picture
Capital.0
Joined:
May. 22, 2012 3:21 pm

There's no debt to pay down.

Bush_Wacker's picture
Bush_Wacker
Joined:
Jun. 25, 2011 7:53 am

Quote Capital.0:

Speaking of Owellian revisionist history.....

Cap tries again to make some sort of point... and fails. Gee Fluffy, pray tell.. just what did I get wrong? That the GOP opposed the Clinton budget plan in 1993? That Dole did NOT propose a 15% tax cut in 96? That there was NO small tax cut in 97? That the GOP did NOT propose tax cuts in 98 and 99? That Bush did NOT propose a tax cut but to also preserve the Clinton Surplus to pay down debt? That the GOP did NOT pass a massive tax cut in 01 and later accelerated the schedule?

Cap, if you don't know or respect truth but live in a world of lies and half-truths, then you're the LAST person that should be accusing someone else of being Orwellian

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm

Quote Capital.0:

Speaking of Owellian revisionist history.....

OH!!!! Perhaps you mean Paul Ryan's "plan" to cut taxes even more. But his is a revenue neutral budget. I believe he claims the debt will disappear by 2080!! LOL Ya, such projections work like charms, don't they. In 2000 Bush propose a massive tax cut based on projections of future surpluses... which a mere year later proved to be wrong. Even the GOP proposals for a balanced budget amendment are a farce because we can NOT pay down debt merely balancing the budget... even the on-budget side. You need an on-budget SURPLUS... like the one Clinton left to Bush who then made sure he drove a stake into.

So let's see if I grasp what's probably your amusing argument… we're to IGNORE all the times in real life the GOP TRIED TO SABOTAGE the surplus just in the past 15 years, and exonerate them. We're to IGNORE Ryan's irresponsible tax cuts which some estimates say will add 10 trillion more to the debt in the next decade. The ONLY thing we should focus on is Ryan's claim he can make the debt disappear in 2080!!!! Therefore all the REAL actions and REAL proposals of the GOP should be ignored and we should instead believe their wild CLAIMS!!!

Ya, that sound like the kind of insane argument you'd make.

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm
Quote Bush_Wacker:

There's no debt to pay down.

I'm sure the tax Cut Psychos in the GOP will be happy to hear you've exonerated them from any and all wrongdoing as well as lying the the American People. With your Free Lunch theory that we can just print more money, then no one has to be fiscally responsible about anything ever again! After all, it worked like a charm for Germany in the 20s! I'll be sure to buy a new wheelbarrow while I can still afford one. I'll need it to carry the cash needed for a loaf of bread.

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm
Quote Pierpont:
Quote Bush_Wacker:

There's no debt to pay down.

I'm sure the tax Cut Psychos in the GOP will be happy to hear you've exonerated them from any and all wrongdoing as well as lying the the American People. With your Free Lunch theory that we can just print more money, then no one has to be fiscally responsible about anything ever again! After all, it worked like a charm for Germany in the 20s! I'll be sure to buy a new wheelbarrow while I can still afford one. I'll need it to carry the cash needed for a loaf of bread.

Privately we need to be fiscally responsible. As a nation we are afforded the luxury of printing whatever money we need to for the needs and general welfare of the country. You seem to have no problem with the banks having the ability to loan out money that they don't have and being repaid the principal and interest with real money that we earn from someone else. Why can the banks have that deal but our country not have the same deal? Not only is it fiscally responsible but it's neccessary to the security of our nation. Not to mention it's right there in the Constitution.

Bush_Wacker's picture
Bush_Wacker
Joined:
Jun. 25, 2011 7:53 am

It's all about getting us into debt slavery for the Globalists.

The American Dream Film-Full Length

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tGk5ioEXlIM

The Money Masters.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936&q=The+money+changers&ei=Zd4QSMjvB47YqAKQtJmzBA

They aren't building the drones and the FEMA Camps for nothing !!!!!!!!!

antikakistocrat's picture
antikakistocrat
Joined:
Apr. 18, 2012 3:41 pm
Quote antikakistocrat:They aren't building the drones and the FEMA Camps for nothing !!!!!!!!!

I'm sure that "Constitution" Party of yours will fix everything.

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm

Quote Bush_Wacker:Privately we need to be fiscally responsible. As a nation we are afforded the luxury of printing whatever money we need to for the needs and general welfare of the country. .
Sure, the money supply expands and contracts. But if a central bank is not careful, the value of that money can become worth less and less. That's where your Free Lunch theory lead. You claim there's no debt because we can simply print $16 trillion in new money. Poof! Problem solved. But that amount of money is about the same as the entire GDP of the US. Even if that debt were "paid" off over ten years, the world would be flooded with US dollars. Currency exchanges would devalue the US dollar compared to other currencies... oil prices in dollars might double. Who knows. There's no free lunch.

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm

How bout this you can havetalc hikes when youmake cuts that don't end in "realized over the next ten years" ok ?

CollegeConservative's picture
CollegeConservative
Joined:
May. 4, 2012 2:22 pm
Quote Pierpont:

Quote Bush_Wacker:Privately we need to be fiscally responsible. As a nation we are afforded the luxury of printing whatever money we need to for the needs and general welfare of the country. .
Sure, the money supply expands and contracts. But if a central bank is not careful, the value of that money can become worth less and less. That's where your Free Lunch theory lead. You claim there's no debt because we can simply print $16 trillion in new money. Poof! Problem solved. But that amount of money is about the same as the entire GDP of the US. Even if that debt were "paid" off over ten years, the world would be flooded with US dollars. Currency exchanges would devalue the US dollar compared to other currencies... oil prices in dollars might double. Who knows. There's no free lunch.

No, if the US government decided to print up the 16 trillion it owe's itself it would pay itself. It would not be injected into the economy. It's already been injected into the economy, that's why it shows up as debt. Once again, tell the banks that there's no free lunch. They've been eating one for decades.

Bush_Wacker's picture
Bush_Wacker
Joined:
Jun. 25, 2011 7:53 am

Except that most of it wasn't spent here so it isn't in our economy.

CollegeConservative's picture
CollegeConservative
Joined:
May. 4, 2012 2:22 pm

Again thinking he's profound but only making another of his 4th grade level arguments

Quote CollegeConservative:

How bout this you can havetalc hikes when youmake cuts that don't end in "realized over the next ten years" ok ?

That's for AGAIN proving that all you can do is EVADE tough questions. You're "logic" such as it is, is the GOP should be free to propose and pass ALL the fiscally irresponsible tax cuts they want even we can't afford them. The GOP should be free to sabotage debt paydown. The GOP should be free to LIE to the American People. And no one should EVER criticize what they do... even if they want to do it AGAIN. In CC's world, all the burden of proof lies with those who challenge his precious Orwellian Right insanity.

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm
Quote CollegeConservative:

Except that most of it wasn't spent here so it isn't in our economy.

Put up or shut up CC. I think anyone with an IQ over 47 is sick of your false claims and idiotic logic.

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm

Quote Bush_Wacker:No, if the US government decided to print up the 16 trillion it owe's itself it would pay itself. It would not be injected into the economy. It's already been injected into the economy, that's why it shows up as debt.
No all debt is what government "owes to itself". As of today $11,000,730,870,069.91 is owned to THE PUBLIC which includes foreign nations.

http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np

So Of COURSE paying that down with newly printed money WOULD be injected into the US and world economy. I'd have to think about the consequences of trying to pay off intragovernmental debt by creating money out of thin air.

In the end there's NO FREE LUNCH. There are reasons why nations don't routinely do what you suggest. Aside from domestic inflation and the devaluation of the dollar vis-a-vis other nation's currency, we live in a global financial system that will punish the US making our credit rating Triple Z for trying such a stunt.

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm

http://www.forbes.com/sites/brianwingfield/2011/01/29/making-sense-of-u-...

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/exclusive-feds-600-billion-stealth-bail...

There are two of many examples of our money being spent for the betterment of other countries.If you really believe in kaynsian economics then shouldn't we spew our money here instead of paying for sesamestreet in packastsan?

CollegeConservative's picture
CollegeConservative
Joined:
May. 4, 2012 2:22 pm

Quote CollegeConservative:There are two of many examples of our money being spent for the betterment of other countries.If you really believe in kaynsian economics then shouldn't we spew our money here instead of paying for sesamestreet in packastsan?

Your original response to the matter of our $16 TRILLION debt was

Quote CollegeConservative:

Except that most of it wasn't spent here so it isn't in our economy.

Your second link talks of about 58 billion a year spent on foreign aid. OK, how much of that was NOT spent on things from US companies? Foreign aid is often a backdoor subsidy for US companies. It's like Congress providing aid to expand NATO knowing that old Warsaw Pact nations will have to standardize to western arms systems and buy from US military suppliers.

Second... your third link doesn't work anymore than your first one. Here's the correct link:

http://www.zerohedge.com/article/exclusive-feds-600-billion-stealth-bailout-foreign-banks-continues-expense-domestic-economy-

But whatever the Fed allegedly did does NOT show up in that debt figure. Feel free to prove me wrong.

So how much of our $16 trillion debt have you proved was NOT spend in the US per YOUR claim? At this point NOTHING, though no doubt some US aid was actually spent in those foreign nation.

You realize if this forum were a class in a REAL college, you'd have flunked your first week. Now do you EVER intend to deal with the REAL QUESTION I raised about the GOP's repeated attempts to sabotage debt paydown? Didn't think so. I suspect you're one of those right wingers that just has no idea what the difference is between a million, a billion, and a trillion… yet that never stops you from having an opinion on budgetary matters.

Pierpont's picture
Pierpont
Joined:
Feb. 29, 2012 2:19 pm

Currently Chatting

Who Should an Economy Serve?

The top one percent own half of all the world's assets. In stark contrast, the bottom fifty percent of the world owns less than one percent. According to the 2014 Global Wealth Report from Credit Suisse, global inequality has surged since the 2008 financial collapse. The report explains that while global wealth has more than doubled since the year 2000, the vast majority of overall growth has gone to those who were already wealthy.

Powered by Pressflow, an open source content management system