"Five myths about Obama’s stimulus"

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This opinion piece by Michael Grunwald in The Washington Post sets the record straight on 5 myths about President Obama's 2009 stimulus bill, the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act. The one that caught my eye affirms an argument that I have been making for years, that republicans can't complain about the stimulus being too small because their own members made it stay under $800 billion :

The bill needed 60 votes in the Senate to overcome a Republican filibuster, and the three GOP moderates who supported it insisted that it couldn’t exceed $800 billion. So did at least half a dozen centrist Democrats, including Ben Nelson (Neb.), Mark Begich (Alaska) and Mary Landrieu (La.). Everyone involved in the negotiations — including liberals who favored a larger stimulus — agrees that Obama got as much as he could get.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/five-myths-about-obamas-stimulus/2012/08/10/7935341e-e176-11e1-ae7f-d2a13e249eb2_story.html

miksilvr
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Jul. 7, 2011 12:13 pm

Comments

Conservatives complain that the stimulus was too small?

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WorkerBee
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Apr. 28, 2012 12:22 pm

Yes they do, and they say the infrastructure spending was too small, without taking the credit (i.e. blame) for that also when they should.

miksilvr
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Jul. 7, 2011 12:13 pm

I can't imangine any conservatives who complained that the stimulas was too small. Do you have any names? Examples?

Thanks, just curious

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Mauiman2
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Jul. 27, 2012 7:24 am

You don't have to imagine it, they are real ... google it if you don't believe it.

miksilvr
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Jul. 7, 2011 12:13 pm

Googled it and could not find any examples.

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WorkerBee
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Apr. 28, 2012 12:22 pm

2. The stimulus was full of waste, pork and fraud.

Most of the Recovery Act consisted of straightforward aid to states and to the vulnerable, infrastructure spending, and tax cuts. Critics may call it “porkulus,” but the stimulus was also the first modern spending bill with no official legislative earmarks, the usual definition of “pork.” And after experts warned that 5 to 7 percent of the money could be lost to fraud, investigators documented only $7.2 million in losses through 2011, about 0.001 percent.

Of course, waste is in the eye of the beholder. But it’s telling that most Republican examples of stimulus boondoggles were either removed from the bill (sod on the Mall, smoking cessation), never in the package (mob museums, levitating trains to Disneyland) or wild distortions (The new Department of Homeland Security headquarters is not “government furniture”).

Yes, there was Solyndra, but its $535 million default represented only about 1 percent of the Recovery Act’s clean-energy loan portfolio, and independent reviewers have found that the overall portfolio is in fine shape. And Republican investigators have found no evidence that cronyism drove the Solyndra loan.

I didn't know that republicans investigated and found no cronyism. They must have kept it a secret from the public and from their sycophants. Did they even tell their own members? .

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douglaslee
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
Quote miksilvr:You don't have to imagine it, they are real ... google it if you don't believe it.

Apparently, we have to concede that you are a much better researcher than us. I also, could not find the examples of conservatives that wanted it bigger.

So given your superior abilities, we beg you to enlighten us with the links that will show us the error in our misaligned thinking.

Paleo-con
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

This is just one of many examples I have heard where the republican politicians or conservative media knock the stimulus as not being big enough ... which in most cases was said tounge-in-cheek, or insincerely, since they really did not want it to be bigger anyhow. They are just looking for an excuse to knock the bill, to have it reflect negatively on the administration.

There are others, but I think you can find them, with a little more practice (if you really do want to find them , I'm sure you have the ability).

Huntsman in 2009: Stimulus "Probably Wasn't Big Enough"

One month later, once the stimulus was passed over the opposition of every House Republican:

CAVUTO: Were you against the stimulus , Governor?

HUNSTMAN: Well, if I were in Congress, I probably would not have voted in favor because it didn't have enough stimulus and probably wasn't big enough to begin with .

http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2011/05/23/huntsman_in_2009_stimulus_probably_wasn_t_big_enough.html

I also find it interesting that you bother to knock my comments, but have said nothing about the 5 points made in article itself ... Why ?

miksilvr
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Jul. 7, 2011 12:13 pm

If the demos don't get a filibuster proof Senate majority, then bring back the old policy of actually having to orate on the Senate floor to filibuster the whole time. See Mr. Smith Goes To Washington.

DynoDon
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Jun. 29, 2012 10:24 am
Quote miksilvr:

I also find it interesting that you bother to knock my comments, but have said nothing about the 5 points made in article itself ... Why ?

Just like the other DNC newsletters; NY Times, Slate, Dailykos, etc, the Washington Post has no credibility. On top of that, it is not even an article, it is just an opinion piece. In a nutshell, nothing in the opinion piece is worthy of comment.

Paleo-con
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

Well, economists outside of the Chicago School of Economics twits who are still in vogue are pretty accurate. Stimulous was about $2 trillion too small. The amount necessary to make up for the loss of wealth within the economy in the financial market meltdown.

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

polycarp2
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
Quote Paleo-con:
Quote miksilvr:

I also find it interesting that you bother to knock my comments, but have said nothing about the 5 points made in article itself ... Why ?

Just like the other DNC newsletters; NY Times, Slate, Dailykos, etc, the Washington Post has no credibility. On top of that, it is not even an article, it is just an opinion piece. In a nutshell, nothing in the opinion piece is worthy of comment.

I find the news sources you say have no credibility to have far more credibility than Murdoch's clowns at Faux news. I also have not heard of the owners of those other news organizations you listed being investigated for possible federal charges such as violations of the "Foreign Corrupt Practices Act", or wiretapping the phones or hacking the cell phones of competitors or celebrities they want to do stories on.

Why do you decide now that nothing in the Post is worth commenting on, after you already had replied several times ?

miksilvr
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Jul. 7, 2011 12:13 pm
Quote miksilvr:

Why do you decide now that nothing in the Post is worth commenting on, after you already had replied several times ?

Your prejudice is astounding, yet some what expected. At what time have I ever used Fox News for reference?

My opinion of the Washington Post is nothing new, I have maintained my position for years on these forums. And yes, I have replied several times, but not on the opinion piece's contents. That was the basis of your question below.

Quote miksilvr:I also find it interesting that you bother to knock my comments, but have said nothing about the 5 points made in article itself ... Why ?
Paleo-con
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
Quote polycarp2:

Well, economists outside of the Chicago School of Economics twits who are still in vogue are pretty accurate. Stimulous was about $2 trillion too small. The amount necessary to make up for the loss of wealth within the economy in the financial market meltdown.

Retired Monk - "Ideology is a disease"

You can see it in the GDP growth during stimulus and after it ended. -8.9% to positive 3.8%, 3.9%,3.8% by quarter or 12 and half percent growth in the economy in the two years it was in place. 3.8% down to 2.4% after it was pulled.

The growth was significant, and it was almost in one year, and before the tea party crashed the economy. 13% gdp growth in 16 months is remarkable and republicans hated it.because it bestowed legitimacy on Keynes, and Obama. But they fixed it in 2010.

http://www.tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp-growth

enter dec 2008, to aug 2012 in the date range. The -8.9% was not in until after the transition was complete.

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douglaslee
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm
Quote Paleo-con:
Quote miksilvr:

Why do you decide now that nothing in the Post is worth commenting on, after you already had replied several times ?

Your prejudice is astounding, yet some what expected. At what time have I ever used Fox News for reference?

My opinion of the Washington Post is nothing new, I have maintained my position for years on these forums. And yes, I have replied several times, but not on the opinion piece's contents. That was the basis of your question below.

Quote miksilvr:I also find it interesting that you bother to knock my comments, but have said nothing about the 5 points made in article itself ... Why ?

My prejudice ?

miksilvr
Joined:
Jul. 7, 2011 12:13 pm

In their passion to find something wrong with Obama, cons have both criticized the "stimulus" as a useful approach and for being too small to solve anything. It is why the "stimulus has failed" has some existential ring of truth even though the why has been smogged. The GOPimps also insisted that a lot of useless and costly tax breaks be part of the "stimulus." Just lost revenue again as the 'job crushers' pocket their bribes and smile about the 'uncertainty' of investing in America.

The Transportation Bill ought to have been a bipartisan no-brainer. The Debt Ceiling Fiasco is pure GOPimp Tea Party expenses for the Tea and favors. There is no honorable explanation for the GOPimp voting record in either branch of Congress under Obama in the White House. Before then, there wasn't even an issue to the official corruption. There was no concern about spending. No socialism coming under Bush and Cheney. Just immense corruption and deficits.

Clearly, if the conservatives had to run on the record of their politicians or the theories they have put into practice, they would get a big thumbs down. Even short-term memory loss cannot wipe away the experience of being shafted, again and again. The Big Dreams look very empty and bloody now. So, double-down on fear of the Left. Do not let facts get in your way, just play the old lines over and over and pretend that you don't know better.

drc2
Joined:
Apr. 26, 2012 12:15 pm
Quote miksilvr:
Quote Paleo-con:Your prejudice is astounding, yet some what expected. At what time have I ever used Fox News for reference?

My opinion of the Washington Post is nothing new, I have maintained my position for years on these forums. And yes, I have replied several times, but not on the opinion piece's contents. That was the basis of your question below.

Quote miksilvr:I also find it interesting that you bother to knock my comments, but have said nothing about the 5 points made in article itself ... Why ?
My prejudice ?

Prejudice = an unfavorable opinion or feeling formed before hand or without knowledge, thought, or reason. To prejudge something or someone.

You made some association between me and Fox News where there was none, and then disparaged me for this made up association. I was prejudged.

Paleo-con
Joined:
Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

Agreed, your Paleo was formed before there was a FAUX formation. If we confuse some of the things you say now with what FAUX has also pushed, please appreciate that it is hard to look backwards and see all the subtle differences in the sediment. Please repudiate fully anything FAUX so we can find the real Paleo as you wish.

drc2
Joined:
Apr. 26, 2012 12:15 pm
Quote miksilvr:
Quote Paleo-con:
Quote miksilvr:

I also find it interesting that you bother to knock my comments, but have said nothing about the 5 points made in article itself ... Why ?

Just like the other DNC newsletters; NY Times, Slate, Dailykos, etc, the Washington Post has no credibility. On top of that, it is not even an article, it is just an opinion piece. In a nutshell, nothing in the opinion piece is worthy of comment.

I find the news sources you say have no credibility to have far more credibility than Murdoch's clowns at Faux news. I also have not heard of the owners of those other news organizations you listed being investigated for possible federal charges such as violations of the "Foreign Corrupt Practices Act", or wiretapping the phones or hacking the cell phones of competitors or celebrities they want to do stories on.

Why do you decide now that nothing in the Post is worth commenting on, after you already had replied several times ?

I said nothing about you being a Faux news viewer, you brought that possibility up yourself. I just said that I find the news sources you say have no credibility to have far more credibility than Murdoch's clowns at Faux news. Oh, does the shoe fit ? And you still have not commented on the 5 points in the Post "opinion" piece that I linked to ... why, because you have not read it .... because you are prejudiced against the Post ?

And you call me prejudiced ?

miksilvr
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Jul. 7, 2011 12:13 pm

The endless 'debate' rages on with the Manchurian Americans conservative 'thought' created.

Please pass the mercury, the nitrates in these dogs are awesome, bro'!!

anonymous green
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Jan. 5, 2012 11:47 am

What do you mean by "Manchurian Americans"?

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WorkerBee
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Apr. 28, 2012 12:22 pm

A new book by Time Mag Author. 'The New New Deal'

extolls the success both short and long term of the stimulus. Had it been the proper size we would be at the beginning of the next 50 year expnansion.[but republicans would be out again, can't have that, crash the economy again and wait]

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douglaslee
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

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