Ayn Randian charade coming to a close

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Entitled, greedy, and behaving like the world is an Ayn Randian Utopia: Kalanick to face price fixing charges. Uber will settle for nothing less than regulation free world domination.

(U.S. District Court Judge) Rakoff said the plaintiffs "plausibly alleged a conspiracy" to fix prices in this manner, and could also pursue claims that Kalanick's actions drove out rivals such as Sidecar, enabling Uber to command 80 percent of mobile-app generated ride shares."

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-uber-ceo-must-face-price-fixing-lawsuit...

Boston: Court rules Uber is a taxi service, will regulate accordingly "Scott Solombrino, spokesman for a coalition of taxi and livery industry members, said in an e-mail, “We applaud the court’s decision today in recognizing what we have known all along — that the city of Boston has the authority to regulate Uber and Lyft and should be taking action to level the playing field between these companies and the law abiding taxi and livery industries.”"

http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2016/03/31/boston-ordered-revise-regula...

For more and everything you should know about these people and what they are all about, you can go to my thread at DU.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10027696376

Local2500's picture
Local2500
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Comments

YES!!! We need more regulations to protect entrenched money interests! Crony Capitalism is the way to go!!!

gumball's picture
gumball
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Dec. 12, 2013 11:02 am

I share your outrage regarding companies like Uber, but your thread title is misleading. One company maybe being brought to task for one business practice does not repudiate the entire selfishness as a virtue, greed is good philosophy, nor will it ever.

You can point out the hypocrisy in Ayn Rand or the inherent flaws in Libertarian / Objectivist ideas, but those are just people and labels. Some new champion or label will always come along to replace the one(s) that fell out of fashion. Call it whatever you want, but "greed" is not going away anytime soon.

You're never going to stop people from finding ways to lie, cheat, and steal -- to drill holes in the system or take advantage of people in order to enrich themselves. This has been going on since the dawn of civilization. I do agree that regulation is the only option, but it's dangerous (for the 99%) to believe you can eradicate an idea or concept. Just think of the war on "terror" or the war on "drugs".

Once people get complacent, the greedy and powerful will always seize back any gains we've made, like the Supreme Court and the Voting Rights Act, Citizen's United, etc. That's why I get frustrated when I see people declare victory over the smallest things, which will probably be toothless measures anyway designed to quell public unrest.

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marriott79
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"...but your thread title is misleading. One company maybe being brought to task for one business practice does not repudiate the entire selfishness as a virtue, greed is good philosophy, nor will it ever."

Understood. Though CEO Travis Kalanick is an Ayn Rand devotee, I had to go "stealth" because putting the company's name in the title is a good way to get a thread "disappeared" at this website. Major sponsor, money talks. Me? I'm trying to raise awareness, but it's unwelcome. So, yeah, that was an intentional omission.

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Local2500
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@gumball
Instead of doing your Uber searches for 50 cents, you should read about the people paying you pennies per post. I've addressed everything that's written on your script and more. You guys are ubiquitous but (like Thom) uniformed.

Local2500's picture
Local2500
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One thing is true, the main theme of Atlas Shrugged was a screed against crony capitalism.

The government protected cab industry is now facing competition from UBER and yet government is not coming to their rescue with regulations to keep their competitors away. Why? Because people (voters) vastly prefer Uber over cabs.

gumball's picture
gumball
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Quote Local2500:

I had to go "stealth" because putting the company's name in the title is a good way to get a thread "disappeared" at this website. Major sponsor, money talks. Me? I'm trying to raise awareness, but it's unwelcome. So, yeah, that was an intentional omission.

There are numerous threads here on this subject.

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gumball
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Dec. 12, 2013 11:02 am
Quote Local2500:

@gumball
Instead of doing your Uber searches for 50 cents, you should read about the people paying you pennies per post. I've addressed everything that's written on your script and more. You guys are ubiquitous but (like Thom) uniformed.

Ummm, I have been active in these forums since before Uber became a household name.

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gumball
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Dec. 12, 2013 11:02 am

None that I started. Sorry to say, they're gone. I just reposted the thing in DU because I know Thom reads DU daily. I figured he's more likely to read up on Uber there than on his own website.

Local2500's picture
Local2500
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Quote gumball:

One thing is true, the main theme of Atlas Shrugged was a screed against crony capitalism.

The government protected cab industry is now facing competition from UBER and yet government is not coming to their rescue with regulations to keep their competitors away. Why? Because people (voters) vastly prefer Uber over cabs.

I addressed that and more. Like I said, it's like people read from scripts.

8. There's room for both. People who prefer cabs tell cabbies they'd never use Uber because it's likepaying for hitch-hiking. People who prefer Uber have their reasons. Uber is run by slick, Ayn Randians who want world domination, like Amazon. They don't want to give customers choice. They want to take it away.

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Local2500
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I'll add, they don't want competition, either. Competition is the last thing people who talk about competition want. That's why they resort to price fixing and expect to operate unfettered by municipal and tax laws. It's really a reprehensible model and I go into more detail at DU. I just wonder if Thom would rationalize their race-to-the-bottom model as merrily as you...???

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Local2500
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Those pesky regulations to level the playing field. All Uber drivers are being asked to doing is jump through SOME of the hoops cab drivers must jump through.

1. Safety. Interestingly, it happens to be the most aggressively fought by Uber. That means criminal background checks, finger printing, a drug test, a physical exam, and mandated maintenance. (Please explain why Uber customers would oppose safety regulations. Thanks in advance.)

2. No poaching. Other than drop-offs, it's illegal for cabs to operate outside of city limits. The cab industry isn't asking Uber to be restricted similarly. The cab industry is asking Uber drivers who live in a city or state to register their car in that city and state and get a state drivers license. In Chicago, Uber drivers come from everywhere. Plates from Indiana, California, Ontario (Canada), Florida. Just register in Illionois and get an IL drivers license.

3. Don't be a deadbeat, pay your tickets, child support, and municipal bills. Chicagoland Uber and Lyft drivers own the municipalities in excess of $15 million dollars.

4. Use the roads, your passengers use the commons, pay for them. In Chicago, cab drivers MUST collect a $4 tax from airport pickups from passengers. The "McPier" tax pays for events and salaries at Navy Pier and the McCorrmick convention center. Uber has not reimbursed McPier and McPier has to sue Uber to collect what is owed them. That's how Uber rolls. Subsidies and "sue us, we'll settle for less after years of appeals."

Beginning to understand those wretched government regulations are aimed at putting an end to Ayn Randians who rely on subsidies and circumvent paying for the commons?

The commons! Thom's mantra. This is just one reason it's infuriating to listen to him pimp for these middle class job killing (that's another reason), race-to-the-bottom (yet another), libertarian freeloaders. Can't get his attention. I'm spoon feeding to reduce the amount of research he has to do, but he's chosen stick his head in the sand. Louise has even gone so far as to delete my threads and account. I joined the message board in 2007 but as you can see, I'm a new member and these are my first posts. gumball is correct, there have been threads about Uber here. In fact, no doubt he and I sparred in the two I created before they were discovered and deleted along with my account.

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Local2500
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Superior service or safe haven for predators?

Uber Says It's Not Liable for Drivers' Misdeeds By MARIA DINZEO ShareThis

SAN FRANCISCO (CN) - A lawyer for Uber told a federal judge Friday that the ride-hailing company isn't responsible for the actions of two of its drivers, whom two women claim raped them on separate occasions.
"The job being performed has nothing to do with the act," Uber attorney Josh Cohen said, arguing that the sexual assaults alleged by two Jane Does occurred for the "personal gratification" of the drivers and were in no way connected to their jobs.
The two women sued Uber this past October, claiming they were sexually assaulted by drivers in Boston and South Carolina despite a corporate marketing campaign that promotes Uber as one of the safest options for getting home after a night of drinking.
Does' lawsuit blames Uber's deficient background checks, which have allowed people convicted of murder, kidnapping, assault, robbery, identity theft and sexually exploiting children to pass through Uber's screening process Another lawsuit filed by district attorneys in San Francisco and Los Angeles makes similar accusations...

http://www.courthousenews.com/2016/04/01/uber-says-its-not-liable-for-drivers-misdeeds.htm

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Local2500
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Do you know who your Uber driver is?

Uber driver worked while awaiting trial on 2 rapesChris Villani Saturday, April 02, 2016http://www.bostonherald.com/news/local_coverage/2016/04/weather_advisories_posted_as_fast_moving_snow_storm_looms

Local2500's picture
Local2500
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OK, I was accused, not here but over at DU (for the whole enchilada http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=7696376 ) of having an odd or strange vendetta against Uber. Well, he came to that conclusion because he's lazy and refused to read. But I'm sure this has occured to several of you, as well; what's with this guy and Uber, anyway?

Uber is a symptom of what's really wrong with America, today. I have a vendetta against Wal-Mart and Amazon, too. Yes, I have a vendetta against everything about the businessmen and their libertarian business models far too many Democrats are eager to defend. A Progressive wouldn't view this vendetta as strange at all.

These business models are killing the middle class. You see, my odd vendetta goes beyond Uber. As a Progressive, I fight for middle class wages, workers rights, fair competition, Social Security, and paying for the commons. I am an AFSCME Union member. What do you think the Ubers and Wal-Marts think about:
1. Workers rights?
2. A stable middle class?
3. Fair, not "Free," competition?
4. Social security?
5. Paying income taxes?
6. Paying for the commons?

Yeah, you're right: "How can we AVOID all of this and let someone else pay for us?!" Does that sound like billionaires begging for subsidies to you, too?

But Thom isn't a spokesman for Wal-Mart, and Amazon, well, too late. They destroyed the world and took all the jobs with them. So naturally, Uber is in my crosshairs.

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Local2500
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This story will warm Thom and Louise's hearts.

A few weeks ago, I was at a city council hearing and the spokeswoman for individuals with physical disabilities testified that Uber discriminates against the disabled. They refuse to take people in wheel chairs and (per policy, can) refuse the blind, as well. She then testified that, if you call Uber and ask for wheel chair service, for a fee of $2, they will refer you to a cab company!

Cha ching!

Local2500's picture
Local2500
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Quote Local2500:

Do you know who your Uber driver is?

Uber driver worked while awaiting trial on 2 rapesChris Villani Saturday, April 02, 2016http://www.bostonherald.com/news/local_coverage/2016/04/weather_advisories_posted_as_fast_moving_snow_storm_looms

Do you know who your taxi driver is?

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/taxi-driver-20-years-rapin...
http://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/Taxi-driver-roommate-arrested-for-se...
http://www.wboc.com/story/26346001/taxi-driver-charged-with-raping-victi...

gumball's picture
gumball
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Quote Local2500:

Those pesky regulations to level the playing field. All Uber drivers are being asked to doing is jump through SOME of the hoops cab drivers must jump through.

1. Safety. Interestingly, it happens to be the most aggressively fought by Uber. That means criminal background checks, finger printing, a drug test, a physical exam, and mandated maintenance. (Please explain why Uber customers would oppose safety regulations. Thanks in advance.)

2. No poaching. Other than drop-offs, it's illegal for cabs to operate outside of city limits. The cab industry isn't asking Uber to be restricted similarly. The cab industry is asking Uber drivers who live in a city or state to register their car in that city and state and get a state drivers license. In Chicago, Uber drivers come from everywhere. Plates from Indiana, California, Ontario (Canada), Florida. Just register in Illionois and get an IL drivers license.

3. Don't be a deadbeat, pay your tickets, child support, and municipal bills. Chicagoland Uber and Lyft drivers own the municipalities in excess of $15 million dollars.

4. Use the roads, your passengers use the commons, pay for them. In Chicago, cab drivers MUST collect a $4 tax from airport pickups from passengers. The "McPier" tax pays for events and salaries at Navy Pier and the McCorrmick convention center. Uber has not reimbursed McPier and McPier has to sue Uber to collect what is owed them. That's how Uber rolls. Subsidies and "sue us, we'll settle for less after years of appeals."

Beginning to understand those wretched government regulations are aimed at putting an end to Ayn Randians who rely on subsidies and circumvent paying for the commons?

The commons! Thom's mantra. This is just one reason it's infuriating to listen to him pimp for these middle class job killing (that's another reason), race-to-the-bottom (yet another), libertarian freeloaders. Can't get his attention. I'm spoon feeding to reduce the amount of research he has to do, but he's chosen stick his head in the sand. Louise has even gone so far as to delete my threads and account. I joined the message board in 2007 but as you can see, I'm a new member and these are my first posts. gumball is correct, there have been threads about Uber here. In fact, no doubt he and I sparred in the two I created before they were discovered and deleted along with my account.

1.With Ubers rating system they have a set up that leads to safe drivers and weeds out the bad. More often than not, in my experience Taxi drivers drive recklessly. I have never felt unsafe in an Uber.

2. That is just a silly regulation designed to shut out competition.

3. Are you telling me there are no cab drivers out there that have unpaid tickets and child support?

4. That is silly too, why should I have to pay the government to have someone pick me up at the airport?

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gumball
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Dec. 12, 2013 11:02 am

gumball, the screening processes escapes you. The safety regulations are designed to weed out those with criminal backgrounds. Uber is the perfect rouse for convicted rapists. To say there are bad people everywhere is an idiotic defense and one easy for men to make. It's pathetic on its face. Women assume a level of safety and when they find out Uber lies about background checks, they're shocked. Men, not so much.

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Local2500
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Apr. 1, 2016 9:52 am

I'm telling you the way of the real world, one that's full of regulations. Like my OP states, the charade is coming to a close. I address everything that will pop into your head over at Thom's favorite website, DU. You all ask the same questions and make the same idiotic challenges. Follow the DU link I provided.

Local2500's picture
Local2500
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Apr. 1, 2016 9:52 am

The Randian fad is one consistently taken up by individuals who are intellectually callow and who haven't been around enough or studied enough history to know that libertarianism has always been around. It has been rejected by modern humanity because all but the callow and the intellectually ignorant have always called it by its actual name: barbarism. It's impossible for any society which is truly civilized to adopt it as a working system, because it's mutully exclusive of true civilization. Those who espouse it are, inevitably, philistines.

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On today's show, Thom discussed the Panama Papers. He said one of two reasons you'd hide your money in the Bahama's is tax avoidance. One of Bernie's mantras is big business and the wealthy must start paying their fair share. Now, listening to Thom's program almost everyday since 2008, I'm inclined to believe he, too, thinks multi-billion dollar companies (Uber is valued at over $80 billion) offshoring their income in tax shelters is a bad thing.

I started this thread because it's clear Thom didn't do his due diligence before becoming a mouthpiece for Uber, one of, if not his biggest sponsor. That being said, I'd love to hear Thom respond to this article.

How Uber plays the tax shell game

http://fortune.com/2015/10/22/uber-tax-shell/

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Local2500
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Quote Local2500:

I'm telling you the way of the real world, one that's full of regulations. Like my OP states, the charade is coming to a close. I address everything that will pop into your head over at Thom's favorite website, DU. You all ask the same questions and make the same idiotic challenges. Follow the DU link I provided.

Regulations designed to limit competition. Crony capitalism at its finest.

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gumball
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Dec. 12, 2013 11:02 am

Tell me which industries aren't regulated.

Tell me which industries don't have barriers to entry.

When mayors open their cities to Uber, an illegal taxi company and tax free shelter, then make big investments in Uber (Emanuel brothers and Bloomberg), that meets your criteria for crony capitalism, your biggest gripe.

Thanks for continuing the dialogue. Every pro-Uber argument (save for customer service to those who prefer Uber, that's a legitimate case for Uber and competition) is indefensible and low hanging fruit. Unfortunately for you, Uber runs away from its superior service claim. That a red flag to an informed and objective consumer.

The whole competition argument is Progressive-fair competition vs Libertaian-"Free" competition. Gumball, you're clearly a Libertarian. That's plain to see to everyone reading your posts.

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Local2500
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You can put whatever political spin you want on this issue but what it comes down to is a formerly protected industry has been turned upside down by inovation and a superior system.

gumball's picture
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Dec. 12, 2013 11:02 am

Not to worry, gumball favors wage suppression under the guise of "competition."

As for taxis one had ridden in them in various cities with no problem at all.

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big bird
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Jul. 31, 2007 4:01 pm

The title of this post is not fitting to the discussion. All uttering the name Ayn Rand must first read 'The Virtue of Selfishness'. Simple court cases are not typically best described as "Randian".

Ayn Rand was the anti-Christ.

Greed is obviously one of the worst attributes a human can decide to value above all other capacities and to chose to foster in society. Not all Libertarians are sociopaths, but all sociopaths are Libertarians. This is true by definition.

Lastly, it is the concept of Capitalism that creates and maintains scarcity, encourages greed as well as laziness.

It is greed, Capitalism and the associated rationalizations such as Libertarianism that pathologically attempt to justify evil, and not altruism, that is the greatest immorality.

This mentality has proven the most dangerous and destructive philosophy the world has ever known. It is pure evil. All human development, both personal and sociological is movement away from such philosophies. Never trust someone that calls themselves a libertarian, and if they have flat affect, run.

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Atheists don't bother me at all; neither do religious people, if they practice what they preach. Hypocrites, conversely, are intolerable. Anybody claiming to be both a Christian and a Lib is a hypocrite because the Randian doctrine of greed is directly at odds with the Biblical listing of gluttony (greed) as one of the seven deadly sins. Bullshit talks and action walks; nominal Christians can neither countenance Libertarianism nor remain adherents without being hypocrites, whether they want to admit that or not.

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Court slaps Uber with additional $10 millions to February's $28 million fine for lying to and charging customers for fake background checks.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-uber-background-checks-settlem...

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Local2500
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In response to regulations, Uber's tactic is clear: freak out Uber customers by promulgating propaganda that cities are trying to put Uber out of business. That's an effective tactic, because their customers are freaking out, but it couldn't be further from the truth. The taxi industry is fighting to put an end to Uber's free ride. Again, a Libertarian concept. The taxi industry is saying: let's compete! But fair competition requires a level playing field. Progressives know that "Free Trade" is a Libertairan profit driven, race-to-the-bottom mantra (this is why I'm calling out Thom).

There are 2 distinct classes of customers, but Uber wants you to believe there is only one because, like Amazon, they seek world domination. Any cab driver will tell you that 5 out of 10 customers want their opinion on Uber. Any cab driver will also tell you that their passengers say they think Uber is paying for hitch hiking. They think it's not safe to get in a complete stranger's car. Any cab driver will tell you that when their passengers learn that Uber has not only lied about background checks for years, they've charged customers for fake background checks, their passengers are appalled. Any cab driver will tell you that their passengers think it's wrong that Uber is subsidized and unregulated.

Then there's the Uber class of customer. They like Uber and couldn't care less about fair competition and middle class jobs and what not.

The the crux of the matter is, Uber has convinced it's customers that fair competition means no more Uber. Let me translate that for you, fair competition means one thing: fair competition cuts into their bottom line. Of course Uber is screaming bloody murder. They're run by petulant, entitled, libertarian billionaire brats who demand they get everything they want, including subsidies.

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This matter is bigger than American short sightedness

Uber and the sharing/gig company are symptoms of everything that's wrong in America. Democrats are supposed to fight for middle class jobs, living wages, ending tax avoidance, and all the Libertarian race-to-the bottom practices. In other words, Linertairian Progressives (oxymoron) are voting with their wallets against their best interest.

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Local2500
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Uber and Lyft drivers in San Francisco will have to register for a business permit if they want to continue earning money from giving and sharing rides. City Treasurer Jose Cisneros has begun sending out letters to 37,018 drivers in the city letting them know of the new requirement, according to SFGate. It's unclear how Cisneros got a hold of their names and why he's suddenly decided to enforce a new rule. But SFGate notes that the city is basically telling the companies that if they refuse to recognize their drivers as employees, then they have to require them to get business permits as contractors. Also, if every driver applies for one, which costs $91 a year for those who make $100,000 or less in gross receipts, then the city will make $3.37 million a year.

http://www.engadget.com/2016/04/15/uber-lyft-drivers-san-francisco-busin...

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Local2500
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Mayor James' Floor Speech Regarding KCMO Vehicle for Hire Ordinance

http://youtu.be/fHjJUJW0Jt4

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Local2500
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