I understand that Bernie has said that he will support the Democratic nominee.

But Bernie has more importantly said, continuously, that we cannot fix a corrupt political system from inside that system alone. It takes a popular uprisisng, a political revolution to fix that system.

So, I am followiing Bernie's words when I say as a long-time Independent voter and relatively new Democrat (since '08), I will not support a Democratic establishment candidate. Not one who only proposes to work within the corruption of the system and who has embraced, wholeheartedly, that same corruprtion to win the nomination.

I think other Democratic supporters of Bernie should listen to his words, join the political revolution all in, and not cast your vote for the symbolic leader of a corrupt political system. If Republicans win the White House, I expect and will even demand the same sort of obstruction from the Democratic leadership in Congress that Republicans have shown in recent years. That can extend to blocking any Supreme Court and all lower court judge nominees they bring as well. Lord knows, there is precedent for that.

I am not saying this out of sour grapes or some sort of unsportsmanlike conduct. I believe this is a form of "tough love" that the Democratic leadership needs. They have to be made to understand that they are part of the problem. They are in part responsible for, and must be held accountable for the fact that the majority of American people do not believe that there is any difference between the two political parties, and that their voices and votes no longer matter.

What Clinton can say to me is "be part of our political revolution." Let's do this work together. Join me in Washington to protest on the Capital steps for "Medicare for All." If you can't make it to Washington, protest in your town and we will simulcast it in Washington. Light up the switchboards of Congress with (Bernie) dialer technology. That kind of rhetoric might turn my head. She will never say that though and we all know why.

(Note: Additionally, Hillary Clinton will not ask Elizabeth Warren to run with her and probably is not even thinking of that possibility.)

- Joe in Bronx, New York, watching FreeSpeechTV on Dish Network


turn_left_@_the _light's picture
turn_left_@_the... 3 years 40 weeks ago

Amen! You are preaching to the choir. Sadly, there are far too many people in this country (AKA the Blue Shirts) who will take the moral low ground and vote for EVILlary because - and only because - she is a democrat.

Blithe ignorance be not proud.

#BernieOrBust 2016

ronsears 3 years 40 weeks ago

Sooo, if you had Choice B to save 3,000 lives, or Choice A to prove a point that you could have saved 5,000 lives IF ONLY you had the option of making Choice A, you would go with Choice A? I suggest such a decision would be both highly immoral and "stamp your feet" silly, especially when you consider you have a third option to soldier on and win the real fight over the next few years.

Please, please hold your nose (tightly I admit) and vote for Hillary in the November election if she is the candidate, because that is clearly the best thing to do for our Progressive movement (least evil, least harm compared to Trump, or Cruz, or Kasich, or Ryan). At the same time, you can keep supporting Bernie with money and phone calls, etc. through to the end of the Primary, building up his political power more than the establishment Democratic party could have ever dreamed. Ask yourself why David Plouffe just tried to brand Bernie's campaign as fraud because he continues to ask for support despite how unlikely it may be that he will win the primary. If he stands no chance to actually win sufficient delegates, why would they waste effort trying to blacken his name now and push him to abandon the primary race?

I tell you, these walking dead establishment Dems are scared to death of the unfettered political clout Bernie is building for Progressives both inside and Independents outside the Democratic Party. That political clout means Hillary will be forced to include more and more Progressive planks in her Democratic Platform, dispite what her financial backers have paid the establishment Democratic Party to do.

Bernie is now the undisputed conscience of the Democratic Party, and will lead its Progressive evolution whether they like it or not. He is now the single most politically powerful individual in the Democratic Party and they know it. As a humble Vermont Senator after the primary he can simply e-mail his Progressive army and greatly reward or severely punish any other politician depending on their actual support of real Progressive issues, and there is absolutely nothing the Democratic establishment can do about it!

Sooo, vote Hillary when you have to, but follow Bernie into our Progressive future. After all, how many times has Bernie said: It's not about him, it's about a revolution to change American politics?"

Jimmy Dean's picture
Jimmy Dean 3 years 40 weeks ago

You have a lot to learn about politics & life in general, son.

I think the stupid is strong in this one, Yoda.

Instant-RunOff-... 3 years 40 weeks ago

No don't vote for Hillary. Vote for a third party. This is an opportunity to end the totally corrupted two party system. This Duolopoly is idiotic, disgraceful, totally undemocratic, so open to corruption, horrendously inefficient and now both parties are dying from the inside out. Like the Soviet Communist party did.

Break that system, go third party, no better chance then now. And support instant run-off or ranked ballet voting. That would be the nail in the coffin for the duolopoly.

With ranked ballet voting you could vote for your preferred candidate and still vote for a 2nd or 3rd choice. Vote splitting would not work, and third parties would get a chance to break open this hideous duolopoly. And negative campaigning would be self-defeating.



Bernie Sanders endorses IRV:



Right now this is a succinct graphic what the American pseudo-democracy really is:

The March of Tyranny Graphic, by Ben Garrison:


turn_left_@_the _light's picture
turn_left_@_the... 3 years 40 weeks ago

Thank you Instant-RunOff, you are armed with the facts and the sources to back them up.

turn_left_@_the _light's picture
turn_left_@_the... 3 years 40 weeks ago

Jimmy Dean,
Spoken like a true chump.

#BernieOrBust 2016

marriott79's picture
marriott79 3 years 40 weeks ago

I'm sorry but the "half a loaf vs nothing" argument is really getting tired. If you went to a carnival and found out the ball toss game is rigged, would you still lay your money down to play in the hopes that one day there'd be a change in management? Voting for Jill Stein, for example, is NOT voting for a Republican; it's voting for Jill Stein. The progressive voters are not responsible for the poor decisions that Al From, Bill Clinton, and the third way have made. If they refuse to run a decent candidate or fail to rally the base, then that's THEIR problem. Don't blame the victim.

Obama cannot preach hope and change and then slam the door in our faces and then expect we'll still be there in four or eight years. This IS the party that is STILL pushing TPP by the way -- a corporate giveaway under the guise of "free" trade that's the economic equivalent of the tsunami that hit Japan. Oh, but we can sell more caviar, camels, and skis in Vietnam! And this is the party you want to prop up from collapsing under it's own greedy weight?????????

Oh sure, putting the Republicans in charge is like giving the keys to the Russian Mafia. You won't hear me argue there. But the average worker is screwed either way. It's just a question of whether you want to be crushed quickly or slowly. Personally, if I'm going to go down, then I'm at least going to stop playing the game, like I don't know any better. I mean people like the Koch Brothers must laugh their asses off watching all of us little people skip to the polls and stand in five hour line-ups to vote for the people they picked for us. I mean Clinton or Trump or Cruz? Either way the billionaires and elite can't lose. Clinton isn't going to go after the big banks. CEOs aren't going to go to jail.

And sorry, but I have to say one of the few things I disagree with Bernie on, and completely agree with Chris Hedges and Ralph Nader, is that Bernie NEVER should have given an unequivocal pledge to endorse Hillary if she's the nominee. He should have used his bargaining power to say that he would only support her if she met certain conditions that satisfied the progressive movement that he embodied. It is wrong for Bernie to ask us to support her without her firm commitment from her to embrace his positions.

Some people aren't going to be happy with me saying this, but if Bernie isn't the nominee, the movement he's building will ultimately fade away like Occupy Wall Street. Not completely gone, but effectively so. The mainstream media has not and will not cover it, and there currently isn't a name for it or a direction beyond his candidacy, unless pushing us all to become avid Hillary supporters is somehow a direction. However, I would liken that to taking something out of the freezer and tossing it into a pot of boiling water.

As for Bernie going back to the senate and having more power... what power? The power to do what? Don't get me wrong, I love Bernie, but why do you think they're going to listen to him. The public and the media have very short attention spans -- heck the media has blocked this guy so much that half the country still doesn't know who he is. Why would the establishment suddenly elevate a guy who threatens their power, when they know the media isn't going to bring Bernie's message and struggles to light? Most people are going to go back to their jobs, their mortgages, their student loans and focus on the day to day grind to survive, as we all move towards competing with labor in China and Vietnam. You think it's an accident and not a coordinated effort?

Yes, I agree with Thom that people are being empowered by Bernie's message, and a new generation of Bernies has been born. In generations to come we will see them gain power and things will change. But right now, if Hillary becomes president, she will not be held any more accountable than Obama is now. Why should things be any different? I know people forget this fact because he doesn't act like one, but there is a Democratic president in the White House right now! Why not just push him to the left now? Why? Because people are busy struggling to survive in a bad economy (that's only going to get worse), and the corporate owned media doesn't want to see or showcase progressive change that would threaten their power and profitability.

So please, let's be realistic about what's going to happen in the next four to eight years. If you vote for a conservative (Democrat or Republican), you will get conservative policies. If the Supreme Court is so important, and I agree it is, then Obama absolutely has to get someone progressive onto the bench while he's still in office; otherwise, that whole argument is moot, because Republicans will simply continue to obstruct any nomination left of Mussolini in the future.

friendly_universe's picture
friendly_universe 3 years 40 weeks ago

Thanks for your replies everyone. Even the ones calling me stupid. I think that towing the Democratic Party line will only ensure that there will be another Trump coming back in 4 or 8 years, even stronger than the old Trump. Like it or not, the majority of the American people believe that there is absolutely no difference between the two parties and it does not matter which way you vote. That is why only the most extreme voices like Trump's resonate with them.

friendly_universe's picture
friendly_universe 3 years 40 weeks ago

Sign these petitions to have Bernie continue his run as an independent. There is hard evidence that he has drawn many Republicans to his rallies that will only take away from Trump's support. He obviously dominates with Independents. I am watching on FreeSpeechTV and all I am hearing is about how many voters he will take away from Clinton. There is absolutely no evidence that the amount of voters he will take away from Trump, added to the all of the Independent vote he will draw cannot beat Clinton.

I understand that Bernie has said he will endorse Clinton. This is about continuing the movement that he has built. I think we all owe it to him to show him the degree to which his words have resonated with us. 100,000 signatures will show him that the political revlution is not dead.



turn_left_@_the _light's picture
turn_left_@_the... 3 years 39 weeks ago

I signed both petitions, as should every *true* Progressive here in this community.
AND whatever you do people, keep making donations to Bernie's campaign. Let him know that we are NOT giving up on him or the movement.

#BernieOrBust 2016

baby88 3 years 39 weeks ago

3 things about holding your nose and voting for Hillary:

1) I did not sign a pledge. I will only support the Democratic Party when they act and legislate according to the democratic principles and they haven't for arguably decades as is evident by the activities of the candidate they have adorned.

2) I voted and supported the real liberal in this race, I did my part for real change......I did what I thought was right for the liberal cause.

3) If Hillary doesn't win against the Republican candidate then that is the Democratic Party's fault for not paying attention to the mood of the people and for being so out of touch with reality....and that is not my fault. It is at this point that they will get the tough love that they deserve.

I have voted democratic for every president since Carter, this nonsense has to stop NOW, no more holding one's nose....no more enabling!

Ante Bellum's picture
Ante Bellum 3 years 39 weeks ago

Why Bother

I wish you the best

I do not care that much becuse I will be dead

But really I won't take the good becuse I only want the best!!

Like you can't work to get the best and live for now under the good.

Instead you want to live under the bad as you work for the best

Heck go on Who cares?

No One What you want is not going to happen.

You do know that right?

There is exactly one Socialist in the US Congress.

The green party after several decades has about 150 elected members across the country so I say Go on Vote Green. But you know it’s a wasted vote because we do not have coalition governments in the USA

You can show everyone how Pure you are and how you do not compromise ~ oh isn't that the same problem we have with tea party folk.

I don't know if you understand but not everyone in this country is a progressive and Why do you think imposing an agenda on them without considering their views at all.

My way or the highway Yeah if you are four may seem like the route to take but really we all need to live together Conservative, Centrist and Liberal.

There is no need for a political revolution it’s a silly idea in the USA.

You don't want huge political contributions pass a constructional amendment ~ If you can get most people to agree then go out get the votes and do it. That is the point go get the votes and you can do anything you want but if you sit around in drum circles, say no one can speak for you, act like fools by shouting “Mic Check” “Mic Check” most sane people do not want to be assonated with you.

Do what you want like I said I am old and will be dead soon You will have to live with a eight to one SCOTUS all more ridiculous that Scalia ever was but hay go on till my dying day I can say I had my dirty finger in the dike holding back as best I can the onslaught of Scalia type justices. You can tell everyone how you were to pure to help keep the barbarians out. Why because Clinton is not perfect or better yet she is part of the establishment. The evil democratic party establishment the people who brought you Title 9, The voting rights act, the Equal Rights Act, Medicare, Social Security, gosh those terrible Democratic Establishment Leaders what do they know after decades of dealing with the opposition! I am twenty I Know Everything, I am so just plane Pure and Right!! Those “Establishment Types” are just like the Catholic Church and Hay We follow Martin Luther. Yeah She voted on the wrong side of something 16, 20, 30 years ago.

I say go ahead write in Bernie, Vote Green but know what you have done and Don’t Try and hid from what you did because if you are voting anything other than for the Democratic Party Candidate you are voting for the Republican. If you demand Honesty from Other the least You can Do is be Honest with yourself.

Queenbeethatsme's picture
Queenbeethatsme 3 years 38 weeks ago

Ante Bellum, very well said. The present generation whether Republican or Democrat appear not only self centered and immature but petulant.

I am watching in amazement as Liberals (like Republicans )actually believe they know how Indies vote or that their party has the lion's share of the Independent vote.

First off... THERE IS NO INDEPENDENT PARTY OR PLATFORM. What Indies want can be as different as each independent so there is no way to truly quantify a subjective vote for millions of parties of ONE.

Trump supporters think they have the Indie vote... Bernie supporters think they have it... You both may be wrong.

I know at least 20 Indies who will not support Bernie and I know many who like Trump or Hilary.

My amazement is that in a year when the Presidency is a Democratic race to lose the party appears ready to self sabotage and join the GOP in political seppuku.

How childish .. Petulance masquerading as a principled choice. If Bernie does not become the candidate, they will BOYCOTT Hilary.. It is as if the GOP self immolation hysteria has spilled over to the Democrats, of Cruz and the GOP prayer line is being answered.

So they destroy having the white house to make a point to the party. There is a phrase for that:

"Cutting off your nose to spite your own face". Trump could not have asked for better if he had infiltrated the Democratic party with neocon shills.

What short sighted unity..and after this.. The same party fracturing and angry as the GOP hot mess..BROUGHT TO Dems courtesy of ill bred children who want their way...or else. Lol

ronsears 3 years 38 weeks ago

Twenty years, an entire generation, of a Supreme Court dominated by Koch / Oligarchs? Legal defeat of environmental efforts? Futher legalization of unlimited bribes and gerrymandering? On and on. That's what you are GUARANTEED to get if you don't end all this political purity nonsense, get real, and vote for Hillary if we are stuck with her as the Democratic candidate. The is no such thing as "purity" in politics. Never has been. There are only a ragged series of steps, some times backwards, but mostly forwards into a better world for our kids. Waste your vote on a third party, split the vote for the Democratic candidate, stay angry and not vote or vote for the Republican in protest? That simply nuts. The paid trolls wandering the internet and stoking this absolutist "Bernie of Bust" infighting are laughing their butts off and collecting their bounty checks.

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