From The global conversation.

Our weakness derives from our immaturity as a Species .

It is that immaturity that has caused our entire species to have never stopped oppressing each other. We’ve never allowed ourselves as a species to experience “power with” – only “power over.” THIS has been the blind spot of humanity. This has been the weakness of our civilization. This has been the core issue from the beginning. And until we resolve this issue, there will always be the Oppressors and the Oppressed.

We are like animals. Like insects. Like every life form that exemplifies and demonstrates behaviors establishing Survival of the Fittest as the highest and best measure of effective and efficient conduct. And the difficulty with trying to change all of this one social issue or one offender at a time is that it will take decades to even make a dent in the number of individuals who we’ve alleged to have been oppressors, and by doing so to change collective behaviors. And we don’t have that kind of time.

Our society is unraveling. Our world is on the brink of nuclear war. Our environment is degrading. Our political frameworks are crumbling. Our economic structures are collapsing. Our spiritual communities are colliding. Our global systems, ladies and gentlemen, are falling apart.

We are seeing that our civilization is not civilized. We are seeing that all lives matter, that all grievances need now to be given fair hearing, and that all of us can play a role in not allowing assault, harassment, and misconduct to continue in ANY area of life without the course correction that our intelligence as a species is telling us is so long overdue.

What is the solution here? Is it really to focus on one issue at a time and all the individual offenders we can find? Or is it to undertake an overhaul of the entire human experience by challenging and changing the fundamental beliefs of our species, and the group behaviors that emerge from them?

Comments

Alberto Ceras 2's picture
Alberto Ceras 2 1 week 21 hours ago
#1
Quote humanitys team:

We are like animals.

No, not "are like" - we are animals. Read this review, get the book. Fascinating.

https://www.lrb.co.uk/v39/n23/steven-mithen/why-did-we-start-farming

Why did we start farming?

Steven Mithen

Against the Grain: A Deep History of the Earliest States by James C. Scott
Yale, 336 pp, £20.00, September, ISBN 978 0 300 18291 0

Amazon has it:

https://www.amazon.com/Against-Grain-History-Earliest-States/dp/0300182910

******

Yes, we do seem to be getting dumber. Some think that the cell phone will speed up our dumbing down. But then, if Stephen Hawking is correct, we only have a hundred or so more years anyway.

Coalage3 1 week 19 hours ago
#2

Practically every doomsday prediction of the end of the world, or the end of humanity, has turned out to be wrong. And most have been terribly wrong.

Hawking will join that list.

Alberto Ceras 2's picture
Alberto Ceras 2 6 days 12 hours ago
#3
Quote Coalage3:

Practically every doomsday prediction of the end of the world, or the end of humanity, has turned out to be wrong. And most have been terribly wrong.

Hawking will join that list.

Whatever makes you feel good, Coalage3. Hawking comes closest to Einstien's equal in today's world so I take him seriously. There's also ample and mounting evidence in support of his claim. You need to read your comment carefully, Coalage3 - "practically" would seem to indicate that some turned out to be true. Think before you make an ass of yourself.

Coalage3 5 days 23 hours ago
#4

Yes he is a smart guy, but some of Hawking's work has been refuted and proven wrong by other physicists. There is more evidence to suggest that he will be proven horribly wrong much just like the doomsday predictors before him.

Alberto Ceras 2's picture
Alberto Ceras 2 5 days 21 hours ago
#5
Quote Coalage3:

Yes he is a smart guy, but some of Hawking's work has been refuted and proven wrong by other physicists. There is more evidence to suggest that he will be proven horribly wrong much just like the doomsday predictors before him.

Please provide some examples of Hawking's work that has been refuted and proven wrong as well as the names of those "other physicists" who have proven him wrong.

Coalage3 5 days 19 hours ago
#6

Google Susskind

Coalage3 5 days 19 hours ago
#7

Actually, I saw a very interesting show about the "feud" between Susskind and Hawking, It might have been on NOVA. If I'm not mistaken, even some of Einstein's work has been refuted.

How about you name me a "doomsday" prediction that has been proven correct? Be careful, you are starting to sound like a Bible thumping Christian with your predictions of the end of the world.

Alberto Ceras 2's picture
Alberto Ceras 2 5 days 18 hours ago
#8
Quote Coalage3:

How about you name me a "doomsday" prediction that has been proven correct? Be careful, you are starting to sound like a Bible thumping Christian with your predictions of the end of the world.

I've made no such predictions, Coalage3 nor would it be possible in any event for anyone to prove a doomsday prediction correct. Hawking has postulated the end to be around 100 years from now. Neither you, nor I, nor Hawking will be around at that time.

Some at TH might like to follow this. Some possible starting places:

http://www.unitaryflow.com/2013/09/bh-paradox-1-susskind-vs-hawking.html

[Quote]

Sunday, September 29, 2013

Black Hole Information Paradox 1. Susskind vs. Hawking

******

When making his proposal, it seems that Hawking was not aware neither that he was the "evil side" in a black hole war, nor that Susskind defeat(ed) him. Recently, at the Fuzzorfire workshop, Hawking asked for the definition of the stretch horizon, to which Susskind replied that he already told the definition 20 years ago, then left (minute 45).

I think that, when Hawking raised the problem of information loss, he did a great job. This is a very good problem indeed, and fueled plenty of research. In following posts, I will argue that in this process, Susskind did an excellent job too, by finding something very important, in my opinion, but then he lost it, by inventing the black hole complementarity principle. Next, in Stretched Complementarity, I will explain why I don't buy Susskind's solution.

Posted by Cristi Stoica at 6:28 PM

[Unquote]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_hole_information_paradox#Black_hole_war

http://www.math.columbia.edu/~woit/wordpress/?p=703

[Quote]

But, at a general audience level, Susskind gives a good introduction to lots of topics in physics and to the black hole information paradox in particular. It is livened up with various entertaining color and anecdote, starting with a description of hearing about the paradox from Hawking back in 1983 at a conference held in Werner Erhard’s mansion. He describes discussing black holes with Feynman, approaching him first at a urinal in Pupin, the Columbia physics building, and moving later to the local West End Bar (recently turned into a Cuban restaurant).

He ends not with triumphant claims of victory in his war, but with an appropriate description of the current state of fundamental theory:

Confusion and disorientation reign…. Very likely we are still confused beginners with very wrong mental pictues, and ultimate reality remains far beyond our grasp… The more we discover, the less we seem to know. That’s physics in a nutshell.

It turns out that Susskind is now a fellow blogger, blogging at Susskind’s Blog: Physics for Everyone.

Update: At Backreaction, there’s a new posting explaining what the paradox discussed in Susskind’s book really is, at a level more appropriate for physicists.

Update: Some links to reviews. Paul Davies, Sean Carroll, George Johnson. See here for a review of the Johnson review by John Horgan.

[Unquote]

Coalage3 5 days 17 hours ago
#9

There have been doomsday predictions for hundreds, if not thousands, of years. We are all still here, and flourishing for the most part. You may not have made any yourself, but you obviously place great weight on what Hawking has predicted. I get it. Hawking is a respected man of science. So what he says should be given due consideration.

Obviously the predictions up to now are wrong. The dire warnings about mass starvation and out of control overpopulation have likewise shown to be wrong. Now it is slightly possible that Hawking might be right. After all, I guess one could argue that at least the law of averages is in his favor. But I am guessing that he will be also be wrong

Coalage3 5 days 17 hours ago
#10

Double post

Jonata70's picture
Jonata70 4 days 23 hours ago
#11

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gumball's picture
gumball 4 days 16 hours ago
#12

This is demonstrably absurd.

By what measure is humanity in decline? Over the last few decades, billions have been lifted out of poverty. New technology has enabled global communication on an unimaginable scale. Medical advances have dramatically increased our standards of living. There is far less conflict and oppressive regimes are the exception, not the norm as they were only a few generations ago.

By any measure humanity is flourishing.

Alberto Ceras 2's picture
Alberto Ceras 2 2 days 20 hours ago
#13

You are a true marvel, gumball. Sitting there in Yemen beside your suffering children who are dying horribly from cholera as u.S. supplied bombs (banned cluster type?) drop on your neighbors yet you can wax eloquent on the wonders of civilization. Please give us a report on Libya's slave trade after you bury your children. Flourishing humanity it is. Why, yes, by any measure. Just ask Bill Gates or Warren Buffet or Jeff Bezos or even the Trumpster himself. Flourishing, all.

gumball's picture
gumball 2 days 17 hours ago
#14
Quote Alberto Ceras 2:

You are a true marvel, gumball. Sitting there in Yemen beside your suffering children who are dying horribly from cholera as u.S. supplied bombs (banned cluster type?) drop on your neighbors yet you can wax eloquent on the wonders of civilization. Please give us a report on Libya's slave trade after you bury your children. Flourishing humanity it is. Why, yes, by any measure. Just ask Bill Gates or Warren Buffet or Jeff Bezos or even the Trumpster himself. Flourishing, all.

You can find misery at every point in Human history, certainly much more than today.

To say today is better than yesterday does not mean that today is perfect.

Alberto Ceras 2's picture
Alberto Ceras 2 2 days 14 hours ago
#15
Quote gumball:

You can find misery at every point in Human history, certainly much more than today.

To say today is better than yesterday does not mean that today is perfect.

Can you provide research and statistics from one of those "every point" points, gumball? Another bunny from the magical gumball hat? "To say" has no legs. Proof - or at least broad concensus - is needed just for a little backup.

Maybe this fictional scenario will sink in, help fill the void.

Suppose Imma Criip just raped your neighbor’s nine year old daughter. You rush over and tell your grieving and distraught neighbor: “Jake, there’re fewer rapes of nine year old daughters today than at any point in history.” What do you think, gumball? Your neighbor is going to thank you, shake your hand, feel mightly relieved? I doubt it. Most likely he’s going to put a great knot on your dumskull.

gumball's picture
gumball 2 days 13 hours ago
#16
Quote Alberto Ceras 2:
Quote gumball:

You can find misery at every point in Human history, certainly much more than today.

To say today is better than yesterday does not mean that today is perfect.

Can you provide research and statistics from one of those "every point" points, gumball? Another bunny from the magical gumball hat? "To say" has no legs. Proof - or at least broad concensus - is needed just for a little backup.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:World_population_living_in_extre...

What point in Human history would you say humanity as a whole was better?

Quote Alberto Ceras 2:

Maybe this fictional scenario will sink in, help fill the void.

Suppose Imma Criip just raped your neighbor’s nine year old daughter. You rush over and tell your grieving and distraught neighbor: “Jake, there’re fewer rapes of nine year old daughters today than at any point in history.” What do you think, gumball? Your neighbor is going to thank you, shake your hand, feel mightly relieved? I doubt it. Most likely he’s going to put a great knot on your dumskull.

OF course not. But the topic is on the state of our civilization, not the state of Jakes daughter.

Alberto Ceras 2's picture
Alberto Ceras 2 2 days 12 hours ago
#17
Quote gumball:

What point in Human history would you say humanity as a whole was better?

OF course not. But the topic is on the state of our civilization, not the state of Jakes daughter.

"point in human history" That's your bag, gumball, not mine. I look at the misery, the inequality, the slaughter in today's world and it depresses me. No comparison to the past will alleviate present suffering that exists in much of our world - right now, this minute.

Jesus on a hatrack. No use expecting you literal minded people to understand simile, metaphor, allegory and such like. It wasn't about Jake's daughter but about empathy or lack of it.

Dr. Pangloss would be proud of you, gumball.

gumball's picture
gumball 17 hours 29 min ago
#18
Quote Alberto Ceras 2:
Quote gumball:

What point in Human history would you say humanity as a whole was better?

OF course not. But the topic is on the state of our civilization, not the state of Jakes daughter.

"point in human history" That's your bag, gumball, not mine. I look at the misery, the inequality, the slaughter in today's world and it depresses me. No comparison to the past will alleviate present suffering that exists in much of our world - right now, this minute.

Jesus on a hatrack. No use expecting you literal minded people to understand simile, metaphor, allegory and such like. It wasn't about Jake's daughter but about empathy or lack of it.

Dr. Pangloss would be proud of you, gumball.

We seem to be talking past each other here. Please read the topic again and you will see the discussion is about the trajectory of human civilization. The author said humanity is in decline. This is demonstrably false.

The level of slaughter and suffering in the present world is magnitudes less than it was in the past. Humanity is becoming more civilized, not less.

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