Daily Topics - Thursday February 11th 2010
By Louise
Quote: Humans remain entirely atmosphere dependent, so there is no choice but to respond to extreme climatic behaviour and its many effects -- Peter Garrett
Hour One - Does Mr. Coleman wish to apologize to Arkansas's holocaust survivors? (stem cell) Curtis Coleman, GOP Candidate for U.S. Senate running against Sen. Blanche Lincoln (D-AR) www.curtiscoleman.com
Hour Two - Isn't using the DC snow storms to debunk global warming the real Snowmagedon? William Yeatman www.cei.org
Plus... Bill McKibben www.350.org - Blizzards and global climate change
Hour Three - Carrie Lukas www.iwf.org - Male domination has brought us 7 years of war, isn't it time to try something else? Norway is demanding 40% of all Corporate Boards be woman and Carrie disagrees.
Plus....Professor Herb Boyd calls in from Haiti where he just met with the President of Haiti Rene Preval www.freespeech.org
Comments
#2
You're right Joe, the earth has been warming since the last ice age, nice talking point.
However, the temperature has been rising far more rapidly over the past few decades. Also it isn't "Global Warming" it's "Climate Change". If you want to pretend it isn't happening, do better than pointing out your preferred Google search for backing your denial.
#3
Stop Calling it Global Warming.Call it a name that mainstreet can understand.Atmospheric Destrution caused by polution. Enough with words used by corporate America to cover their sins.
#4
Nels,
I know that I will not break your faith in the global warming religion, but in fact the earth has been cooling since 1998, and the speed of cooling is accelerating. That cannot be possible if CO2 was the boogyman so many think it is. You can Google search that too if you like...
#5
Gee Joe, if I go to ahead and Google this how many accredited sources will I find vs. a bunch of wingnuts espousing their view. Can you site a credible source? Or are you just able to call upon search engines to find your choir?
#6
Joe,
Specific to the 'cooling since '98, check out;
http://www.youtube.com/user/greenman3610#p/c/029130BFDC78FA33/9/QwnrpwctIh4
Please spend the 8 minutes to listen and come back; do you see anything wrong in the facts presented? Can it not be that that refrain was launched with errors in fact?
This is just one more point that can be cleared up; check out the rest of the series by this fellow; I haven't seen anybody challenge him on facts.. Anybody?
Cheers,
Rick
#7
(without links)
Yes, Joe, Climate change has been denied since the last ice age, and that will continue… At least it feels like that.
The deniers are well organized and funded as with their previous projects like tobacco, but check this series out; no connection other than being glad for a clear, concise de-bunking of the deniers’ talking points; one by one.;
Look on ewe-yube for;
greenman3610#p/c/029130BFDC78FA33
'It's so cold.. '
Did Faux Gnus report the California or Australia bush fires as evidence ‘for’ Climate Change? No, must have got a phone call from the boss; Prince al-Walid-bin-Talal…
Look for the article at world net daily.. lefty press!!
The problem is, those who understand some of the science won’t try to read the daily weather one way or the other. The low-information or misled contingent will jump on and propogate anything they find.
Sad; thought we could bring the troops home from the War on Science..
Rick
#8
Uh-oh Rick, I think Joe might have gone home crying to his mommy (Sara) that we weren't playing nice with him >:-)
#9
Does'nt it seem odd that the solution to global warming is a cap and trade system which will enrich Wall Street, and let industry pollute all they want for a price? By the way, who will be picking up the tab - you guessed right - you and me...
#10
Joe, cap and trade is a solution, certainly not the only solution. I back clean alternative energy sources, such as Solar, Wind and Tidal power. However Cap and Trade has proven to work as a good way to encourage companies that can be productive in a clean way to profit from that practice, which in turn has reduced overall pollution.
You and I will definitely pick up the tab, though I rather prefer the price to be an economic cost, and not a life threatening cost.
#11
Nels,
I welcome this conversation.
I have a comment awaiting moderation right now about 2 you tube video's that you might find interesting. I will close this conversation for tonight by saying that I am for Solar, Wind, and Tidal energy solutions. Have you heard about the wind energy research being spearheaded by Matt Simmons in Maine? WOW, that guy rocks!
#12
Hi Joe,
It's not odd that anything like this can be abused by people to make money off of it. Upping a price is a crude way to decrease use; like taxes on cigarettes.
The real question is, Is your solution to stomp your feet and do absolutely nothing unless and until someone disproves every doubt you have and comes up with a policy solution you like?
Are you proposing that we do nothing?
As to cost, Thom has pointed out, the true cost of your gas from the Saudis includes a whole lot of hidden costs in military and foreign trade accommodations to ensure that supply.
Back to the question; still say things have been 'cooling' since '98?
Cheers,
Rick
#13
Hi Joe,
Cool, we can agree on plenty.
I'll look those up. Of course no single alternative will replace fossil fuels but a few percent here and there will add up, hopefully to at least what we have to import now..
On the Wind, Solar and Tidal; the problem always seemed to be how energy could be stored for the heavy demands; this is a good explanation of how a plug-in car fleet could minimize the need for new power plants; conventional or alternative..
Ewe-tube; greenman3610, plug-in hybrids..
A nuclear plant is going to be a long term build; I'd rather see a natural gas plant for current use.. realistically sensible conservation and things like smart power grids will save us more and much more quickly.
It will be a combination of a lot of things but they can all make sense on their own in other aspects without having to fit into a 'philosophy'..
Cheers,
Rick
#14
Rick,
Even your own video says there has been no warming for 10 years, so that discussion is over.
Matt Simons wind project in Maine is about building huge, really huge, windmills off shore (out of sight), and have them not only generate electricicy, but also ammonia, that can be used for fuel in cars (yes cars can burn ammonia). This can potentially solve the energy storage problem.
A more honest approach to reduce our dependence on foreign oil would be to set a minimum price for a barrel of oil (say $80 per barrel) and tax imports up to that price if the world price should become temporarily lower. This would give alternative fuel providers the confidence that they would not be wiped out by a temporary drop in oil prices.
I would do this not for global warming, but to build a domestic renewable power infrastructure. Cap and trade is a scam plain and simple.
#15
Thom, thank you for putting Prophet on hold so you could talk. It is important for some of these callers to listen.
We are a nation that talks family values but we will not spend money to help women and their babies. If we offered women better health services, better adoption services, better social services, and better child care services, there would be more women having the fetus live to full term.
#16
Joe,
You didn't watch the video.. or you just missed the good part.
It shows the graph where yes, you can draw a line between the high in '98 and the lower value in '08. Look at it and tell me about the long-term slope.
Go to the 4-minute point and it is explained.
'98 was the largest El Nino year on record, along with high solar activity (no, that doesn't mean it is all the sun..) bosting that year. Following that, the cycle of water temperature reversed and temperatures dropped; up and down until cooler water temps that dropped numbers for 2008, still the 9th warmest on record.
The key is, pick two points on the graph, a peak and a low, and you can show an up or down slope over a few years.
We have things like water temperature cycles that will bounce the values up and down; ie weather; you need to look over a longer time period for the over-all change. Sounds simple but it really isn't.
The averages, over more years, through numerous El Nino cycles, still show increase. It is dishonest cherry picking to claim things like the '98 bull theory.
Even the hired gun in the think tank warned them about hanging their hat on this. Discussion not over.
Yup, in the end, we may end up doing some good things for whatever reasons.. Better we are scammed doing something positive..
Maybe we can all unite against the real scammers. There's no reason we shouldn't be able to be self-sufficient in energy.
Cheers,
Rick
#17
Maybe we can unite against the real scammers...
Amen Brother
Cheers,
Joe
Thom's Blog Is On the Move
By webmaster
Hello All
Thom's blog in this space and moving to a new home.
Please follow us across to hartmannreport.com - this will be the only place going forward to read Thom's blog posts and articles.
Images of Thom
At Mondragon - both the mountain and the cooperative city - in Spain (written about in "Threshold" book)
From Screwed:
"I think many of us recognize that for all but the wealthiest, life in America is getting increasingly hard. Screwed explores why, showing how this is no accidental process, but rather the product of conscious political choices, choices we can change with enough courage and commitment. Like all of Thom’s great work, it helps show us the way forward."
From Cracking the Code:
"Thom Hartmann ought to be bronzed. His new book sets off from the same high plane as the last and offers explicit tools and how-to advice that will allow you to see, hear, and feel propaganda when it's directed at you and use the same techniques to refute it. His book would make a deaf-mute a better communicator. I want him on my reading table every day, and if you try one of his books, so will you."
From Cracking the Code:
"No one communicates more thoughtfully or effectively on the radio airwaves than Thom Hartmann. He gets inside the arguments and helps people to think them through—to understand how to respond when they’re talking about public issues with coworkers, neighbors, and friends. This book explores some of the key perspectives behind his approach, teaching us not just how to find the facts, but to talk about what they mean in a way that people will hear."
The issue is not the reality of global warming, the earth has been warming since the last ice age. The issue is whether CO2 is the cause, and if buring fossil fuels is the problem.
The fact is, CO2 is such an insignificant player in the global warming calculus, to focus on it is just ridiculus.
As to the propaganda that the glaciers and the Arctic sea ice are melting, this is just lies and propoganda. Just Google "Climategate" to see how this "scientific evidence" was just created out of thin air to further globalist policies.