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I'm beginning to have serious doubts about Obama. Either he is being cowed by powers we don't know of, or he's gone off the deep end, power-wise. This is outrageous! And the people that operate these drones have absolutely no skin in the game. They're in snug, well-protected bunkers here in the good ol' US of A. To them, it's no different from a video game.
HEY...YOU...GUYS!!!
Listen to the song "Kinky Sex" from the album Give me Convenience or Give Me Death...by the Dead Kennedys. Seriously..give it a listen you won't be disappointed...Well at least not for listening.
It's sad how fitting the songs meaning is still to this day (timeless)...Jello Biafra's (singer) lyrics always tackled the sociopolitical concerns of the Reagan era with distinct satire and a morbid sense of humor.
Sorry KEND (and Global) but there is just no deniing that where we are today economically, as a country, "started" with Reagan...And was furthered by every adminastration that followed. That's the way the Puppet Masters want it.
I suggest you stay in Canada where it is safe and you have good jobs, Universal Healthcare, Naked News, and well mannered people.
Don't come here you'll get shot or worse become a U.S. Citizen...And you don't want that, it ain't as great as you've been told.
Ahh Hypocracy!!! It's the American way, OUTBACK...An ideology if you will. A "do as I say and not as I do" and if you don't...Well I'm sure you get the point.
"...where will it end?"
Im' not so sure DOWDOTICA as to "where" it will end...But I can say; It will end when We the People stop acting like damn fools, get off these useless blogs where everyone bitches about how "bad" everything is, stop acting like spoiled bratts, and get active, get organized, and take back our country from the Corporate Robber Barrons!
Sorry if that sounds like REVOLT, but the water is a boil'in and our goose will soon be cooked if we don't!
Woops! I think I just made "the list"!!!
Nonviolent Revolution is easier than reform, and it works.
How can an administration, the establishment or the public for that matter "cluck cluck" and "tut tut" gun violence domestically, then turn around and sanction the remote killing of US citizens without due process? For that matter, how can we tolerate decades of arbitrary war, killing literally hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians in Iraq alone while preaching gun control here at home? This is the very definition of hypocrisy. (My kingdom for a spell checker on this site....)
How do We counter the HeIsABadGuy Propaganda? MostAmericans think he deserved Assasination bcuz he was "AlQueda"!!!! We are, for the majority, Completely Brainwashed!
Terrorist – Terrorist, I’m sick and tired of hearing that word. One man's terrorist is another’s hero. George Washington was a terrorist - Every Prime minister of the early state of Israel was a terrorist, according to the British; today the are model citizens. As for drones there seems to be more collateral victims than actual real targets that end up feeling the sting of the drones. For every innocent and [in our sight only] guilty individual that dies as a result of a drone strike, there will spring ten more martyrs with justifiable hate in their hearts for - ‘The Good Old USA’. Also, these killings are a breach of our own values of justice. There is no court review, no trial, some where some bureaucrat is judge and executioner with no responsibility for their actions, except that some day the chickens will be coming home to roust. Some day a lot of innocent American citizens will feel the sting from some martyr whose brother, father or son died from a USA drone.
Yes Mike-C, but any Monetary cost is nothing compared to the cost in our Nation's Integrity and the solvency of our Constitution. Some depts are easier to pay off than others.
Wow! Before they used to bring in a James Bond type guy to eliminate traitors using a low cost bullet or blow their car up, or fix their plane to crash. Then came drug overdoses or drug induced heart attacks. Using these million dollar drones is getting way out of hand on assassination costs, isn't it?
Seeing drones flying over a target and attacking reminds me of films I've seen of the WWII blitz over London w/ German rockets. Where are we headed with the current mindset of a police state, lack of privacy in a dozen different forms from drones to cameras on the street corner to internet data collection? What good is new WIFI technology if it's used to keep tabs on everyone? We have a double standard of "droning" innocents in the name of security, while feeling horrified by mass shootings in schools. We have far too many double standards recently. I think we need to get our priorities straight somewhere.
Global, you amaze me!
First, you said: " Mark, GW was not my boy, is Norm Chomsky your boy?" Don't talk like a pompous wealthy slave owner unless you intend to come out of the closet.
Secondly, what could you possibly have against Norm Chomsky? Could you please elaborate?
Third, will you drop the issue of Health Care? To answer your question though. NO! I don't trust Obama care. He originally campaigned on Single Payer and that is all any of us what. Anything else is a betrayal and stinks. Are you happy? Can we drop that target now and focus on Murder?
Raggaemon, no one is above the law. Yeah, every President I've seen in my life time has "acted" above the law. That doesn't make it right. I really don't care what the President's Intelligence briefings said. We have a little saying in this country, 'You are presumed innocent until proven guilty.' Everyone is entitled to due process. It is the Law of this Land. The President knows that very well. His uses of deadly force against these men was nothing less than cold-blooded, premeditated Murder of innocent people--by the Constitutional definition of Law. Open and shut case. The intelligence report is no more than here-say now because the victims were denied their right to be confronted with the evidence against them. They will remain innocent victims now because a trial is impossible.
One could further argue that in violating the Constitutional rights of these victims, The President is also guilty of a violation of his oath of office to protect and defend the Constitution of the United States. That's Treason!
Funny, all i can think of is 9-11. America the land of the free, home of the brave? More like mass histeria and paranoia...where will it all end?
Another thing Mark, I don't see it as a leap when you have this administration acting like thugs with drone attacks on our own citizens yet you expect them to be the benevolent compassionate masterminds when it comes to your health care. Seems a bit naive. You are a man of philosophy, how do you reconcile that?
Any high-school kid using R/C model-airplane technology could build a drone -- this is a no-brainer, has been for decades. And yes every attack on foreign soil just increases hostilities, enemies and the likelyhood of more ongoing war (-profits).
I don't understand your admiration for this so called constitutional professor which I don't think he was actually. He does not care a bit about our constitution, as he has said it is full of negative rights. He governs more to work around it and has the " catch me if you can " style. Mark, GW was not my boy, is Norm Chomsky your boy?
I don't know how to talk to Fox News viewers. They are so out of it. The disingenuousness is yours, trying to blame Obama for Bush and Reagan's initiatives when a Republican Congress obstructs any attempt at reversal.
How is health coverage for everyone something to fear? Unless, of course, you are one of the ionvested elkites - whom you've just GOT TO be shilling for.
There was a US kid (from Virginia?) living and working with Afghani's in an Afghan village somewhere. Long before the US Invasion, Peace Corps, USAID and other NGOs were active and welcome in Afghanistan. We had the "hearts and minds of the people" we worked well together back then. He was not Peace Corps, but he was doing similar volunteer work. When his village was attacked by some (illegal?) special US forces he stood with his neighbors against that attack. After capture, his defense of his home with his neighbors was interpreted as "an attack upon the US&A." -- and he was brought back to the US for persecution.
Best I know, he is still imprisoned. I forget his name; but always thought, "There but for the grace of circumstance, go I."
Meant to type, "margin of error for THIS president"
It seems to me that this is precisely why us liberals always get labeled as being weak on issues of national security, we can be counted on get bogged down in the complex nuanses, here we go again.
Who believes it's an easy balancing act to set a top priority of protecting the nation from foreign & domestic threats, while working at it within the "spirit of the law" ? There seems to me that the thought process for some liberals is one of absolutes when in fact these matters are not as easy to pigeon hole. What would any of YOU do ( including Thom who I admire ) ? you're gonna tell me that you'll haggle over definitions while the best intel we have is saying they have known terror suspects in their sights ? you gonna send the cops to handcuff these guys and bring them back here for a trial ?
Let's not forget those presidential daily briefings that warned the Bush admin. of immenent threats, do we know if these threats were in fact immenent ?, NO, but what is the margin for THIS president ? What if God forbid there is an attack and folks learn later that Mr. Obama had intelligence that was not acted on ? you want that on your shoulders ? Republicans went nuts over the Benghazi attack, wht on earth would you expect of them if they could actually show that the man they already vilify chose to ignore even remote threats ? IMPEACH HIM, is what they'd say, and that would be just the start.
I don't give a rats buttocks if an American who's involved in active plots to do harm to the citizens of this country is treated as if he/she is any other enemy, why do we make their citizenship more the issue ?
i would prefer the drone attack to sending our men and women overseas to take care of a terrorist.
im not for killing people, but if it is someone who will try and attack the American people, i prefer we keep our soldiers out of harms way.
The Mexican drone scenario is implausible because the U.S. would work with Mexico to find the drug lord and extradite him. So the excuse for drone strikes in Afghanistan must be based on not being able to trust the Afghan government to do the same with al-Qaeda operatives.
However, I think the scenario is useful in demonstrating why Afghans aren't turning into friends.
How would we feel if US had another 9/ 11 attack ? Perhaps in a school , mall or Disneyland / Super Bowl ? Thats a real possibly.
War is very ugly and innocents die But we would ALL be outraged IF US has another 9 /11 attack and we would be first to blame the Obama administartion ! Drone attacks have killed mamy AL Quada who 's only mission is to KILL AS MANY AMERICANS AS THEY CAN
Okay, it would appear everyone is looking at this from one perspective. Here is mine for what it's worth...
When it comes to the president of the U.S.,Inc. I have no dog in that fight but let's look at this in another light, shall we?
What if all of the U.S.,Inc.-born members of the cabal, or elite oligarchal banking families realize that their days of controlling us all like hamsters on a wheel, or harvesting our energy like billions of duracells...are over?
What if these evil puppetmasters have fled the country, and the only way to bring them to justice is to be able to LEGALLY and most importantly Lawfully seek them, and if they don't give themselves up peacefully...eliminate them?
Never forget that the one you call "your" president (he's merely no different than the president of Walmart or Sears, Inc.) is a former constitutional attorney who gave up his BAR card...