Thom's theory is certainly a possibility but given the republican revulsion for anything, "Obama," I think the chance of cooperation is slim to none. These right wing scoundrels know the media will spin the illusion they really care about jobs, no matter how much ECONOMIC VANDALISM they commit.
President Obama's speech was filled with good tone although I have the same concerns about payroll tax cuts as Kassandra, #12.
Why not go epic in economic rescue at this point though? The President has to shake off that current republican stink of....cut, cut, cut and instead spend like the Reagan and the Bush kingdoms did, except spend on peace and prosperity, no more war and share the wealth this time.
Quite honestly, i haven't seen anything positive that resulted from 9/11 other than the demise of Ben Laden. The entire nation has crumbled in part due to the 9/11 event and mostly due to George Bush.
I was just returning from an early morning bike ride the morning of September 11, 2001 when I felt an invisible needle like sensation over my bare arms somewhat the way small pellets of hale can feel. Just as I was trying to make sense of this strange sensation some one yelled from a window that a plaine had crashed into the Trade Center Building. I was a block away from the Brooklyn Red Hook piers where I knew I would be able to see downtown Mahattan clearly as I've seen that view a million times. I turned the corner onto VanBrunt street that runs along the Brooklyn side of the east river and was nearly knocked off my bike by the site of a gaping smoldering hole spanning several floors on the east side of the first tower. I can still feel the eeriness of the silence as I stood staring at something I couldn't comprehend. No screams heard ,no emergency sirens, just gray smoldering smoke quietly escaping the deep void of the first fatal wound to the heart of the America that I had grown up in, the America that I was educatied in, and am a veteran of, that would in the ten years to follow that terrorfying morning would be struggling to survive.
I raced to the roof top of my friends building with a clear view of the skyline only to see as I climbed up out of the hatch onto the roof the second plane appearing out of the blue making an abrupt turn preparing for it's deadly strike. We stood there confussed, screaming, holding on to eachother not knowing how to comprehend what we where seeing. There was nothing for us to draw reference from, no previous source for our brains to grasp. Shock, sobbing, numb we stood frozen in time. Soon to follow was the sight of sparkling confetti flyiing up and floading along in the now bellowing smoke eminateling out of these two wounded giants. The wind blew towards Brooklyn and soon the smoke was passing over us and pieces of the sparkling confettie began to rain down landing at our feet....no longer sparkling but identifyable as burnt notes and papers and family pictures scorched around the edges, smiling faces looking up at us unaware of what had taken place.
Ten years later the wounds unhealed festering with infection scabs yanked off for political abuse. The Havoc of the Bush/Cheney war, the war of Empire, has dworfed the horror of that morning. We have been robbed of our right to morn our dead and most importantly robbed of the right to the truth. We have been dragged down into a firey pit thanks to the arrogance, greed, lies, and betrayal of those who stole the governemnt out from under a people too stunned to grasp the demensions of what was to follow. Even for the millions of us who marched in the streets against the Bush envasion fell silent with a sense of defeat and exhaustion.
What I identify as "good" that has come out of this long saga is to get to know the enemy within our boarders. Not the Muslims, nor the Mexican illegals who we are told are our enemies, but the Traitors to our constitution. Those Republican foxes who dressed in sheeps clothing to gain entry into the HenHouse. All the effort and fear mongering about the dangers of foreign envasion diverting us from the real enemies of America, like the Koch brothers and their gang of multi-national thugs who want to bring down our government, tearing to shreats our sitting President and getting away with it. The huge propaganda machine set in motion with Fox no-news the most loathsome of all. The five rouge judges that thrust a knife into the back of our Democracy buy giving corporations the same rights as flesh and blood human beings.
Unlike the morning of 9/11 when the unfolding tragedy had no source of reference for us to identify what it was that we where witnessing We do have historical references to the fate of envading armies and the hard murderous grasp of Empire. The real tradgedy is not in the collapse of the towers but in the fall of our country.
They already have their money. They just want all of yours and mine too. It seems the Congress is trying to create a form of economic slavery. The irrational, nation-destroying actions of Congress speak more loudly than the President's words.
Mr. Obama has not stood his ground on any issue to date. He has compromised every position he says he stands for. Republican leaders in Congress say the destruction of the President is their primary goal. Those members of Congress who believe that destroying a President takes precedence over winning the wars or creating jobs, rational health care, and a stable economy at home have dominated the political agenda for years. The President has yet to show he believes in his own rhetoric enough to stand and deliver. It really doesn't matter what he says. Until now the end product is shaped by the opposition, not the President. Mr. Obama has not put up much of a fight on any issue. He simply disappears after his fine rhetorical speeches and does not follow through. He just hasn't shown he is capable of governing.
The fear mongering, the cameras all over the place, no email privacy, no privacy anywhere -- things are MUCH worse and if the right wing takes control will become even worse that what we have now. I have little hope.
Give the President a break sure it is not big enough its going to pass at least its something and the reboblicons they would just laugh off anything else.. And after its said and done maybe somepeople will get to go back to work and some unemployed can keep theirselves fed for awhile.And maybe we can keep a rational person in the Presidency for another 4 yrs and maybe we can get a majority someday, at least at this point in Americas life it seems to be our only hope for survival.I would have to say it is all the man could ask for without gridlocking their dumbasses again!!! I will get a hold of my congress person and vote for Our President again.........plz do the same!!!!!!
I like your comparison of the United States, third largest in population in the world, and multicultural, with three countries not as big as the NY metro area in population, and basically all the same people. Multicultural to them is someone from East Europe. It is probably the dumbest comparison I keep seening here.
President Obama just gave the Republicans their opening to win the next Presidential race. He threw away his argument of a Republican do nothing congress. I was waiting for Preident Obama to declare with the stroke of the pen to require that all government spending be limited to "made in America".
It added fuel to the smoldering racism and prejudice that right wing (alleged) Christians excel at practicing. Hatred in this country has turned neighbor against neighbor driving wedges between our citizens. Thans for nothing W.
9 /11 and US over reaction to it Afghan war was just and should have been over fast . Worst thing was Bush 's insane war on Iraq. Bin laden won in some ways He made US spend untold trillions and almost broke us Maybe he has. We shall see. X ray machines , old folks taking off shoes..fear about flying, public places, large events. bad guys changed US for the worst But yes we will survive this in time. We need better / New ways of dealing with terrorists.. Invading entire countries is obscene
I think the thing that bother me most is the payroll tax cuts. It's a backdoor way for some future moron in the WH to say with all honesty that SS is broke.
Obama is tricksy SOB.
the fact that most low/no information voters still think it's the republicans going after SS/Medicare/Medicaid just show how little one learns watching the TEEVEE propaganda.
I bet most of America doesn't know that there's a Supercongress with no accountability to the American people sitting right now, ready to slash and burn these programs.
We've been had and are going to continue to be had until people spend as much time participating in this democracy as they do watching their favorite TEEVEE shows. And I'll tell you the network have some loolapoloosahs coming up to titillate our hatreds and esp to entrench misogyny:
No, he'll back out again. J ust like he' has done for the last 2/1/2 years. The real problemis what can be done that will make a difference. He continues to defer/comprise to the Republicans so how can you reach him.
The only jobs plan that can work, is one involving setting tarrifs on all imported goods. And the tarrifs have to be high enough to accurately reflect the fact that Asian countries use slave labor, prisoner labor, and peasant labor, have no workers rights, no benefits, no paid vacations, no health care or other insurance, and no environmental laws. The plain truth is that if all of these costs were factored into the cost of imported goods, then goods made in America would be cheaper because goods made in America don't have to be shipped halfway around the world.
I know a foolproof way to get the republicans in congress and the supreme court to agree to creating huge tarrifs. And frankly, it baffles me that no one else seems to have thought of it. Here's what we do: every one of the afore-mentioned republicans will be given $200 million in tax-free cash in exchange for voting in favor of America. Oh, and you'll have to give Pat Robertson $200 million, too, and immediately after receiving the payment, Robertson will have a Divine Revelation that God loves gay people. And Rick Perry will also require an additional recognition of his unique contribution to America: he will need to be given the lifetime position of Porn Czar, overseeing the multi-billion dollar porn industry to make sure that it follows strict Biblical principles. Perry will be given a lifetime supply of vitamin E and ginseng, and charged with personally inspecting all porn actresses. That should shut him up for a very long time.
But that's bribery, you say? Oh come on now, bribery is such a controversial word. Let's just call it, lets see now, it has to have just the right sound to it, let's call it, "Cumshaw Reparations for America's Patriots," or CRAP for short.
I definitely agree with you...........I know that the Democrats tried to repeal the tax cuts given to companies to move their businesses and that was Filibustered.......Unless we get atleast 58-60 Democrats in the Senate, nothing is going to happen - the Repubs will lose the House in 2012..........but, gridlock until the election and who knows what is going to happen after that - Obama needs to get rid of Bill Daly...I think he was brought on to attract the Independents but it hasn't worked..
Re: Not allowing the poor to vote: I think we should not allow rich people to vote. If we let them vote they will elect people who are going to give them more money and we can't afford that.
there's no reason for a real jobs plan to cost anything. let's do this:
1) stop issuing hundreds of thousands of work visas each year to legal immigrants who, in contradiction to the corporate-conservative myth, don't actually have exotic technical skills that can't be found or developed in the unemployed american population. cost: 0$
2) enforce existing laws against companies employing illegal immigrants. cost: 0$ since enforcement costs would be paid by the fines
3) overturn free trade deals with countries that have much lower labor rates and bring back a fair tariff system based on relative labor costs and pollution penalties. cost: 0$
Why do middle class people fear to embrace the New Deal of Roosevelt? Are we afraid. Yes, we are. But, if you ask the average Joe or Jane on the street, they can't tell you exactly what it is they are afraid of. "Fear" has been the product that has been purposely peddled in this country since 9/11. It has emotionally crippled us. We need to get over that and speak up in one loud voice and let our government leaders know that we want a New Deal. The outcome is grounded in history and will be fueled by our hope. Don
I think it is unlikely that any Republicans can support the Presidents plan.
Their message is that government is the problem. That Democrats are the problem.
It is an idealogical fight now. No more illusions.
The Aristocracy has decided that it wants it's money back.
President Obama's plan does not protect our economy and jobs. It merely prolongs the bleeding. Money spent on tax cuts and infrastructure will not return to us the 40,000 manufacturing companies that departed over the past 10 years. Protectionism used to be a patriotic chore.
Thom's theory is certainly a possibility but given the republican revulsion for anything, "Obama," I think the chance of cooperation is slim to none. These right wing scoundrels know the media will spin the illusion they really care about jobs, no matter how much ECONOMIC VANDALISM they commit.
President Obama's speech was filled with good tone although I have the same concerns about payroll tax cuts as Kassandra, #12.
Why not go epic in economic rescue at this point though? The President has to shake off that current republican stink of....cut, cut, cut and instead spend like the Reagan and the Bush kingdoms did, except spend on peace and prosperity, no more war and share the wealth this time.
Quite honestly, i haven't seen anything positive that resulted from 9/11 other than the demise of Ben Laden. The entire nation has crumbled in part due to the 9/11 event and mostly due to George Bush.
I was just returning from an early morning bike ride the morning of September 11, 2001 when I felt an invisible needle like sensation over my bare arms somewhat the way small pellets of hale can feel. Just as I was trying to make sense of this strange sensation some one yelled from a window that a plaine had crashed into the Trade Center Building. I was a block away from the Brooklyn Red Hook piers where I knew I would be able to see downtown Mahattan clearly as I've seen that view a million times. I turned the corner onto VanBrunt street that runs along the Brooklyn side of the east river and was nearly knocked off my bike by the site of a gaping smoldering hole spanning several floors on the east side of the first tower. I can still feel the eeriness of the silence as I stood staring at something I couldn't comprehend. No screams heard ,no emergency sirens, just gray smoldering smoke quietly escaping the deep void of the first fatal wound to the heart of the America that I had grown up in, the America that I was educatied in, and am a veteran of, that would in the ten years to follow that terrorfying morning would be struggling to survive.
I raced to the roof top of my friends building with a clear view of the skyline only to see as I climbed up out of the hatch onto the roof the second plane appearing out of the blue making an abrupt turn preparing for it's deadly strike. We stood there confussed, screaming, holding on to eachother not knowing how to comprehend what we where seeing. There was nothing for us to draw reference from, no previous source for our brains to grasp. Shock, sobbing, numb we stood frozen in time. Soon to follow was the sight of sparkling confetti flyiing up and floading along in the now bellowing smoke eminateling out of these two wounded giants. The wind blew towards Brooklyn and soon the smoke was passing over us and pieces of the sparkling confettie began to rain down landing at our feet....no longer sparkling but identifyable as burnt notes and papers and family pictures scorched around the edges, smiling faces looking up at us unaware of what had taken place.
Ten years later the wounds unhealed festering with infection scabs yanked off for political abuse. The Havoc of the Bush/Cheney war, the war of Empire, has dworfed the horror of that morning. We have been robbed of our right to morn our dead and most importantly robbed of the right to the truth. We have been dragged down into a firey pit thanks to the arrogance, greed, lies, and betrayal of those who stole the governemnt out from under a people too stunned to grasp the demensions of what was to follow. Even for the millions of us who marched in the streets against the Bush envasion fell silent with a sense of defeat and exhaustion.
What I identify as "good" that has come out of this long saga is to get to know the enemy within our boarders. Not the Muslims, nor the Mexican illegals who we are told are our enemies, but the Traitors to our constitution. Those Republican foxes who dressed in sheeps clothing to gain entry into the HenHouse. All the effort and fear mongering about the dangers of foreign envasion diverting us from the real enemies of America, like the Koch brothers and their gang of multi-national thugs who want to bring down our government, tearing to shreats our sitting President and getting away with it. The huge propaganda machine set in motion with Fox no-news the most loathsome of all. The five rouge judges that thrust a knife into the back of our Democracy buy giving corporations the same rights as flesh and blood human beings.
Unlike the morning of 9/11 when the unfolding tragedy had no source of reference for us to identify what it was that we where witnessing We do have historical references to the fate of envading armies and the hard murderous grasp of Empire. The real tradgedy is not in the collapse of the towers but in the fall of our country.
They already have their money. They just want all of yours and mine too. It seems the Congress is trying to create a form of economic slavery. The irrational, nation-destroying actions of Congress speak more loudly than the President's words.
Mr. Obama has not stood his ground on any issue to date. He has compromised every position he says he stands for. Republican leaders in Congress say the destruction of the President is their primary goal. Those members of Congress who believe that destroying a President takes precedence over winning the wars or creating jobs, rational health care, and a stable economy at home have dominated the political agenda for years. The President has yet to show he believes in his own rhetoric enough to stand and deliver. It really doesn't matter what he says. Until now the end product is shaped by the opposition, not the President. Mr. Obama has not put up much of a fight on any issue. He simply disappears after his fine rhetorical speeches and does not follow through. He just hasn't shown he is capable of governing.
The fear mongering, the cameras all over the place, no email privacy, no privacy anywhere -- things are MUCH worse and if the right wing takes control will become even worse that what we have now. I have little hope.
Give the President a break sure it is not big enough its going to pass at least its something and the reboblicons they would just laugh off anything else.. And after its said and done maybe somepeople will get to go back to work and some unemployed can keep theirselves fed for awhile.And maybe we can keep a rational person in the Presidency for another 4 yrs and maybe we can get a majority someday, at least at this point in Americas life it seems to be our only hope for survival.I would have to say it is all the man could ask for without gridlocking their dumbasses again!!! I will get a hold of my congress person and vote for Our President again.........plz do the same!!!!!!
Which part of the New Deal did you like best. The disaster of an agricultural plan, or the disaster of an industrial program.
Could the melt down be in any way related to a government policy of putting the unqualified in houses?
I like your comparison of the United States, third largest in population in the world, and multicultural, with three countries not as big as the NY metro area in population, and basically all the same people. Multicultural to them is someone from East Europe. It is probably the dumbest comparison I keep seening here.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Trade_Center_controlled_demolition_co...
Controlled demolition. It was.
President Obama just gave the Republicans their opening to win the next Presidential race. He threw away his argument of a Republican do nothing congress. I was waiting for Preident Obama to declare with the stroke of the pen to require that all government spending be limited to "made in America".
It added fuel to the smoldering racism and prejudice that right wing (alleged) Christians excel at practicing. Hatred in this country has turned neighbor against neighbor driving wedges between our citizens. Thans for nothing W.
NO GOP will not do a thing for jobs GOP vow # 1 is Break Obama Lets be real !!
9 /11 and US over reaction to it Afghan war was just and should have been over fast . Worst thing was Bush 's insane war on Iraq. Bin laden won in some ways He made US spend untold trillions and almost broke us Maybe he has. We shall see. X ray machines , old folks taking off shoes..fear about flying, public places, large events. bad guys changed US for the worst But yes we will survive this in time. We need better / New ways of dealing with terrorists.. Invading entire countries is obscene
I think the thing that bother me most is the payroll tax cuts. It's a backdoor way for some future moron in the WH to say with all honesty that SS is broke.
Obama is tricksy SOB.
the fact that most low/no information voters still think it's the republicans going after SS/Medicare/Medicaid just show how little one learns watching the TEEVEE propaganda.
I bet most of America doesn't know that there's a Supercongress with no accountability to the American people sitting right now, ready to slash and burn these programs.
We've been had and are going to continue to be had until people spend as much time participating in this democracy as they do watching their favorite TEEVEE shows. And I'll tell you the network have some loolapoloosahs coming up to titillate our hatreds and esp to entrench misogyny:
10 Revolting TV Shows That Need to DieTelevision influences our culture and mental health. Here are shows that we need to kill like a virus.
No, he'll back out again. J ust like he' has done for the last 2/1/2 years. The real problemis what can be done that will make a difference. He continues to defer/comprise to the Republicans so how can you reach him.
The only jobs plan that can work, is one involving setting tarrifs on all imported goods. And the tarrifs have to be high enough to accurately reflect the fact that Asian countries use slave labor, prisoner labor, and peasant labor, have no workers rights, no benefits, no paid vacations, no health care or other insurance, and no environmental laws. The plain truth is that if all of these costs were factored into the cost of imported goods, then goods made in America would be cheaper because goods made in America don't have to be shipped halfway around the world.
I know a foolproof way to get the republicans in congress and the supreme court to agree to creating huge tarrifs. And frankly, it baffles me that no one else seems to have thought of it. Here's what we do: every one of the afore-mentioned republicans will be given $200 million in tax-free cash in exchange for voting in favor of America. Oh, and you'll have to give Pat Robertson $200 million, too, and immediately after receiving the payment, Robertson will have a Divine Revelation that God loves gay people. And Rick Perry will also require an additional recognition of his unique contribution to America: he will need to be given the lifetime position of Porn Czar, overseeing the multi-billion dollar porn industry to make sure that it follows strict Biblical principles. Perry will be given a lifetime supply of vitamin E and ginseng, and charged with personally inspecting all porn actresses. That should shut him up for a very long time.
But that's bribery, you say? Oh come on now, bribery is such a controversial word. Let's just call it, lets see now, it has to have just the right sound to it, let's call it, "Cumshaw Reparations for America's Patriots," or CRAP for short.
I definitely agree with you...........I know that the Democrats tried to repeal the tax cuts given to companies to move their businesses and that was Filibustered.......Unless we get atleast 58-60 Democrats in the Senate, nothing is going to happen - the Repubs will lose the House in 2012..........but, gridlock until the election and who knows what is going to happen after that - Obama needs to get rid of Bill Daly...I think he was brought on to attract the Independents but it hasn't worked..
Enact the entire "Make It in America" legislative package.
Re: Not allowing the poor to vote: I think we should not allow rich people to vote. If we let them vote they will elect people who are going to give them more money and we can't afford that.
there's no reason for a real jobs plan to cost anything. let's do this:
1) stop issuing hundreds of thousands of work visas each year to legal immigrants who, in contradiction to the corporate-conservative myth, don't actually have exotic technical skills that can't be found or developed in the unemployed american population. cost: 0$
2) enforce existing laws against companies employing illegal immigrants. cost: 0$ since enforcement costs would be paid by the fines
3) overturn free trade deals with countries that have much lower labor rates and bring back a fair tariff system based on relative labor costs and pollution penalties. cost: 0$
Why do middle class people fear to embrace the New Deal of Roosevelt? Are we afraid. Yes, we are. But, if you ask the average Joe or Jane on the street, they can't tell you exactly what it is they are afraid of. "Fear" has been the product that has been purposely peddled in this country since 9/11. It has emotionally crippled us. We need to get over that and speak up in one loud voice and let our government leaders know that we want a New Deal. The outcome is grounded in history and will be fueled by our hope. Don
I think it is unlikely that any Republicans can support the Presidents plan.
Their message is that government is the problem. That Democrats are the problem.
It is an idealogical fight now. No more illusions.
The Aristocracy has decided that it wants it's money back.
President Obama's plan does not protect our economy and jobs. It merely prolongs the bleeding. Money spent on tax cuts and infrastructure will not return to us the 40,000 manufacturing companies that departed over the past 10 years. Protectionism used to be a patriotic chore.