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Thom, I consider you a national treasure. I rarely, if ever, disagree with you. In this instance, though, I disagree with you in one, small, but significant detail. I don't think that these people, Sarah Palin, Glenn Beck, etc., intend for heinous, violent acts to result from their "Common Sense" agenda. I think that they have totally miscalculated what their combined messages say to a fragile, frustrated America. When something like Tucson happens, it's an "unintended consequence" of them driving America to the "edge" of what they think will be a peaceful revolution.
I've written an article about it titled, "Beck, Palin, and Limbaugh: The Three Stooges of a 'Peaceful' Insurrection". As one of your other commenters suggested, it's going to be very difficult to convince America that they are doing this with violence as a purposeful goal. I suggest a new argument, something like - "The Buffoons of Unintended Stochastic Terrorism".
As much as I disagree with what the right-wing echo chamber is doing to America, I cannot bring myself to believe that they actually want a "bloody" revolution. They're simply a media machine run amok, a collective of buffoons, leading buffoons to an unintended slaughter.
A favor, Thom? On yesterday's show you played some sound bites of Glenn Beck preaching, something like, America could avoid the "blood in the streets" that will occur (courtesy of God) if only we find the answer "within ourselves". I searched MediaMatters, but was unable to find those transcripts. Could you please post a source?
Thanks, Thom and Louise. Keep up the good works.
You miserable, irresponsible righties blew it, you have proven over and over again that you cannot be trusted or responsible with any right, especially freedom of speech. If lefties were inciting people to violence against you, you would be screaming and crying worse than McConnell and Boner after a round of merlots. Thank your lucky [crony] stars that you've gotten away with it this damn long! Pray you don't get retroactive indictments.
I don't care what it's called, Hate Speech, Right Wing Propaganda, Violence Inducing Rhetoric or Stochastic Terrorism, when the hell are we going to do something about it??? 20 people shot in Arizona, 6 dead!!!
It's been giving people "permission" to kill, bomb or lash out against everything and everybody the Right doesn't approve of (symbolically or directly) since at least the assassination of JFK. And it's getting worse, soon it will be as prevalent as graffiti, hell it might already be. Do we have to wait until we have our own version of the Rwanda Genocide? Just replace "Cockroaches" with Census Workers, Liberals, Abortion Doctors and IRS Buildings and hand out the damn made in China machetes. NO!!!
The indignat cries from the Right Wing provocateurs regarding freedom of speech rights are completely bogus, they abused and lost those rights long ago; and we censor and restrict speech/material that we deem hazardous, indecent and obscene to society, children and the general public all the time ~ ie. sex, pronagraphy, cock fights, etc ~ how the hell did we miss Fox Noise? Is there anything more obscene than Ann Coulter?? Nobody gets violent from watching porn. And their squeals regarding "equal" or "comparable" Hate Speech from the Left is what Rush calls, "Bogus BS Hawg Wash!!" Or what I call, juvenile recrimination. If there was a Left Wing bloviater spewing hate speech and inciting people to stick a sign that read, "Bimbo Opportunist" on Sarah Palin's back, we'd have watched the Shock and Awe military strike on last night's news. The left-right hate speech parity argument reminds of the Union-Corporation campaign contribution argument, laughable, but at least unions do some contributing. The impunity and total absence of responsibility of these rightist propagandists must end!
So when are we going to do something about this long long neglected dangerous, indecent and reprehensible Stochastic Terrorism/domestic terrorism? Hello, aren't we at War with Terrorism??? This is terrorism plain and simple. Let's start with a triple BS label on Glenn Beck's forehead! Censor/restrict right wing hate speech (like we do porn) YESTERDAY!!!
Free Speech !! Next topic please.
I would have to say that I read and post a lot of comments regarding liberal and progressive issues. I also have not heard anyone from the progressive side use the level of vitriol that is currently favored by the right. Even the most vocal of progressives like Mike Malloy I have not heard anyone call for the violent attack of the opposition. This type of hate speech and liturature (if we can call it that) has been abundant from the right. Bill O'Reilly, Rush Limbaugh, Ann Coulter, Glenn Beck and their ilk have all called for violent responses from their viewers and listeners. They would choose to overthrow the government as it now stands. Yet they are called patriots. Beck cries when he says "I love this country." Coulter thinks liberals are traitors and should be put in front of firing squads. We already hear too much about gun toting Sarah Palen and loud mouth Michele Bachmann. Lord save us from these fools. It is typical that conservatives in all arenas see themselves as the victims here. It would have been better if Sarah Palen would have not responded at all. Her advisors must be as half-witted as she is. It is symtomatic of sociopaths and abusers to blame the abused. These media darlings are no different.
Stochastic terrorism to WMD. Chicken or the egg. Who sets the example for others to follow here? Lets face it... our government, both Republicans and Democrats (some of the Democrats anyway) are no better than "Stochastic terrorists"...in fact, much worse by hundreds of thousands of times. They wave the flag, frighten us into going along with their criminal actions in illegally invading and occupying other countries, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people (none of which deserved to die any more than the ones in Arizona). And our quid nunc and irresponsible, or perhaps I should say complicit, press never treats the many times more terrible crimes the US has committed in the Middle East, even as much as they have overwhelmed us with the Arizona shooting. Who is worse....a guy who goes berserk because he is being played as a useful idiot for people like Sarah Palin and the other right wing nut jobs too cowardly to pull a trigger for themselves? Or, our government (to be more more precise...those who have the reigns of power at any period of time acting as our government) who knowingly lied about WMD, stired up the fears of the people, and illegally invaded other countries resulting in hundreds of thousands of deaths of men, women, and children who had as much right to live as the Congresswoman, the Judge, and the child. You have been shielded of the very gross atrocities that your (our) government has committed and were not able to see the Iraqi or Afghani children writhing in agony from having their limbs blasted off or their guts ripped out by American high tech weapons. I think Americans need to be paraded past the mass graves of the people our military have murdered over there just like the German citizens were paraded past mass graves of holocaust jews. The US created it's own holocaust in the Middle East and before that in Vietnam.
You should watch the documentary "Vietnam: America's Holocaust" being played on FSTV. And when you eventually learn to open your eyes to the real causes of 911, not the "official conspiracy theory" you might be very upset. Too many people won't even bother, though, to look at all of the inconsistencies that a poorly constructed "official conspiracy theory" (that most people, now, no longer believes) gives us and are already brainwashed by our government to challenge them. Many are more willing to accept a xenophobic lie no matter how full of holes it has. And the real criminals will probably die of old age before most people come to realize that they have been had.
There is no question that the Republican Right tries to foment treasonous actions against our country and its citizens. Each time someone starts wildly making outrageous charges all it takes is for some bigoted, hateful, mentally unbalanced mind to feel that "someone" has to correct this "problem." It amazes me that the Tea Party has filled the void the Republicans have been hoping for, i.e. some dumb Tea Party person who will do the heavy lifting that the top Republicans want to happen. In the beginning the Tea Party's goal was to get less spending, so they could shrink the Federal Government, but they fell prey to what the Republican Party really wants; to roil the waters and make it impossible for Obama to govern effectively. Why the American people fell for this is a head scratcher. Then the Tea Party stretched it's goals, so much so that I think it, and the RepublicanParty, are dealing with treasonous actions. These actions are unconstitutional and are a great example of a Fascist movement taking place in this country, just what we fought against in the 1940s. The Republican Party is playing a dangerous game that will fall apart sooner than later.
thecoloradokid
I really felt this was President Obama's greatest speech. I think it was eloquent, compassionate,
and heart felt. It made me examine my own political agenda and to affirm to consider every remark I make. Weather this tragedy was inspired by hate speech requires validation but beyond that I never want to say anything that would inspire a tragedy like the one that took place. If I were Glenn
Beck, Bill O'reiley, or Sarah Palin I would be more interested in contributing a resolution than defending my actions or denying responsibility. I would never want to inspire a tragedy. This tragedy should be a life altering experience in personal and public responsibility as it is for many citizens. As for Mr Beck, O'reiley, and Ms. Palin I would think this terrible day would inspire more humility than denial. Every one has an agenda.
We should all know them by their agenda.
Hi Tom
This was one of the best shows i have heard the first hour was awesome you were on the top of your intellectual game Tom. I think you made the case in front of the American people just what we have been experiencing from the right wing echo machine. The quest for the lone wolf from the haters from the right wing was never explain better and what the real agenda from the right wing talk show hostess. When i heard Mark Levins sick rat i was horrified to hear such hate and the extent of which this hate speech has gone stochastic terrorism yes Tom that it is. The intent proves that people have and will be killed to further Republican ideology and the Republican party sadly is letting this happen to serve their corporate masters. How sad for this great county of ours. Tom great job on this topic fantastic Analise.
Mark
Sarah Palin will go on and on and on. Her followers are not offended by anything she says, because they agree. She is the female version of W. The billionare republicans need Sarah Palin and her uneducated followers to get what they really want, more money. And they all go along, following each other off the cliff.
I can't believe the crazinest I read in these blogs. I'm no Sarah Palin fan, but all she is doing is defending herself from you crazies. First you accuse her of being resposible for the killings, for putting a target on several congressional districts. A practice Bill Beckel, democratic strategist, has addmitted he has done as well. Second when she responds, to you nuts, she is castigated as being anti-sematic. It's no win for her. Actually it is a win for her, because most people see what is being done to her by a group of "full moon" lefties. The killings were done by a mentally ill individual who appears to have acted alone. The more information released about the killer, the more it is evident. over 60% of Americans agree with me. If I were you folks I would be quiet before the hole your digging for youself becomes your grave. (Can I say grave without you people getting crazier.)
Most likely, the censors on this site will kick me off of it for expressing my opinion. In the words of George Carling, "Who would have thought censorship would come from the left".
The media seems to have turned a blind eye to some of the more compelling points in this story, and once again gives Palin a pass when it comes to the truth.
Jared wrote in his youtube diatribe that terrorist is a person that uses terror as a political weapon , yet the right labels him as apolitical.
They say there is no proof that he paid any attention to politics, but he referred to the number of his congressional district while calling its residents illiterate.
He rails against the expansion of government , treasonous ratification of the constitution, and calls for a return to the gold standard, hardly topics on the mind of a person who is not into politics.
I hear people saying we don't know if he was influenced by talk radio, yet four times in his video he refers to the reader as "listener".
"America must be stronger than the evil we saw displayed last week. We are better than the mindless finger-pointing we endured in the wake of the tragedy." Sarah Palin said this in the conclusion of her speech. The evil she implies is not the shooting, the evil is anyone having the audacity to fault her for creating her hit list. She is truly a psychopath.
quite simply..I agree,Thom...they know there are crazies out there...
I would go further than calling it stochastic terrorism.
What we are seeing here is the systematic erosion of the basic consensus needed to run a democratic society done by a group of people who think they have the "divine right to rule" that the US so rightly rebelled against in its war of independence.
Treason would be a better term.
The media seems to have turned a blind eye to some of the more compelling points in this story, and once again gives Palin a pass when it comes to the truth.
Jared wrote in his youtube diatribe that terrorist is a person that uses terror as a political weapon , yet the right labels him as apolitical.
They say there is no proof that he paid any attention to politics, but he reffered to the number of his congressional district while calling its residents illiterate.
He rails against the expansion of government , treasonus ratification of the constitution, and calls for a return to the gold standard, hardly topics on the mind of a person who is not into politics.
I hear people saying we don't know if he was influenced by talk radio yet three times in his video he refers to the reader as "listener".
"America must be stronger than the evil we saw displayed last week. We are better than the mindless finger-pointing we endured in the wake of the tragedy." Sarah Palin said this in the coclusion of her speech. The evil she implies is not the shooting, the evil is anyone having the audacity to fault her for creating her hit list. She is truly a psychopath.
Any publicity is good publicity! She's loving this attention and her base loves it, too! They want her to be even worse than she is. I really hope she runs because it will be the worst loss in American history and then she'll be gone forever! But don't look for her side to turn on her. Ain't happening!
I think that the idea of stochastic terrorism is an interesting meme. However, I think that it will fail in most people's minds because they will refuse to believe that the Glen Becks of the world are intending the terrorist result.
Instead, I think we need to us this idea minus the motives of the speaker to say that this is the result regardless of the intent of the speaker. Given that we don't want to censor people in this country, the proper response is to point out that the kind of rhetoric being used will likely result in the kinds of acts like the Tucson shooting, without saying that onyone is specifically to blame. In other words publicly appeal to the need to prevent future events such as this by self editing our speech. No laws need to be enacted and the only punishment should be public ridicule and castigation.
Remember when O'Reilly called for al Qaida to bomb Coit Tower -- which is a monument to San Francisco fire fighters?
One thing the people of this country know how to produce on a mass scale is "Stupid." Palin just is one of the producers and demand will remain high no matter what she does. Carroll Jenkins
Keep grasping, soon or later you'll grab a lucky straw.
Regarding Jared Loughner, perhaps his parents were the ones who fueled his political ideology. He may not have expressed overt political leanings but what about his parents? From what I've heard they were very reclusive and anti-social. Just a thought.
Media whore, 'yes!' - Narcissist, 'yes!' - deserving of attention: NO!
Stop the participation in her sad life and show her and the right wing the door during election time. In the meanwhile let all politicians know that you want civility in politics back. This Nation has only begun to prove itself as a minority of the decent - and the minority is getting smaller as our collective narcissism will bring us to darker days ahead. Is anyone really surprised? Our souls have been bought out in more ways than we would individually admit; indifference and greed own the day and have for the last 40 years - and we are shocked by the lunacy that has been born of our own making? We have sucked the breast of this Nation dry, while spitting out common sense and equality upon the memories of her greatest children.
Thank you Mrs. Hartmann!
Unfortunately the Right Doesn't Listen to Us
It doesn't matter what we say or think. They don't listen to us at all. They only tune in to find our soft spot to attack. Not to listen to what we are saying.
Let them who have ears hear.
@Maxrot #1:Palin Attempts to Prove She Can Use 'Blood Libel' in a Sentence
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/andy-borowitz/palin-attempts-to-prove-s_b_...