July 8th 2009 - Wednesday

school-bus-imagesQuote: "Education's purpose is to replace an empty mind with an open one." Malcolm Forbes

Hour One - Dan Gainor -  Is the capital gains school program good school policy or is it "government bribery?"
Also...Could legalizing Marijuana cure California's budget problems?
Hour Two - Matt Taibbi www.rollingstone.com Topic: Has Goldman Sachs taken over the economy of the United States and used it to screw us?
Hour Three - "Everything You Know is Wrong" Jeff Sharlet www.jeffsharlet.com Topic: Is there a secret society of Christian crazies and is Mark Sanford a member?


Quark (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

B Roll,

Interesting take on Obama's "election email list." (I'm on it, too.) It certainly seems to explain his recent comments...

brian a. hayes (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

to quark; right on, strong middle class is the key. the key for everthing poverty, education hunger....

DRichards (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

ProgressiveMews & B Roll

Thanks! I learned something new.

That would explain why (if I am correct) one can not grow hemp for rope, ect. in this country.

Trevor Seitz (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

If the Coprporate people have the same rights as Human People then there should not be Limited liability Corporations or you should be able to give birth to a limited liability person...

B Roll (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago


Give them enough rope and they'll hang themselves. Give them enough hemp and they'll stone themselves.

brian a. hayes (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

to fight corps and work to create a strong middle class this is the battle.

DRichards (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago


Good point!

And why are corporations not given the death sentence when they are responsible for killing people?

ProgressiveMews (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

brian a. hayes & Quark:

Censure seems to do very little, especially when you look at the last one that comes to my mind - Sanford. It appears to be little more than a slap on the hand!

I think an effort to push Congress to regulate the NYSE would be far more effective, as they are the ones now changing the rules to enable and protect Sachs' destructive behavior!

“Taibbi: NYSE ends transparency to protect Goldman Sachs”


Quark (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

Baloney Detection Kit

Scientific American columnist Michael Shermer offers a ten point kit to tell BS from the real thing. It is a concise and comprehensive take on rational, skeptical thought. 'Might be a valuable resource in our schools:


Quark (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

To anyone interested in a MN progressive forum featuring info. on a variety of issues plus a political calendar of events, here's a great new website:


Trevor Seitz (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

Further more...

If Corporate people have the same rights as Human People, then crimes against them and by them need to be treated the same as crimes by Human People against Human People are treated.

If a Human kills (bankrupts) a Corporation then that is Murder...

and if a Corporation OWNS another Corporation then that is Slavery and needs to be punished!

If a Corporation injures or harms or invades the rights of a Human then they need to be Prosecuted - You can't put a Corporation in jail, but you can say they and their executive can not do business of any sort for 5 years...

No more separate but equal Human People need to be treated as equals to Corporate people and vice versa

Quark (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

Anyone interested in a MN progressive forum featuring info. on a variety of issues plus a political calendar of events, here's a great new website:


Quark (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

MN progressive forum featuring info. on a variety of issues plus a political calendar of events, here's a great new website:


ProgressiveMews (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago


There are some incredible things hemp can be used for, and in unbelievable variety of ways too!

Thom often mentions he drinks hemp milk. Paper (the Constitution is on hemp paper), and rope as you mentioned as well as parachutes (the fabric) were made of hemp and used by our military up until it was made illegal too - because hemp is actually MUCH stronger than what we use today.

PLUS, the seeds can be used to make meal for bead (like wheat) and they also have oil in them that can be used for fuel (amongst other things)!!!

The list is almost endless:


Not sure, but I think there are two or three states where it's legal to grow it..

B Roll (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

The problem with our political system isn't that getting the Dems to do what their constituents want isn't like herding cats. The problem is that both parties are herded by the fat cats.

mathboy (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

It's amazing how, when the subject is education, we seem to get the worst spelling, punctuation and grammar in the comments. Just an observation.

Dave (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

Campaign Finance Reform

Our "representative's" are beholden to the "power" of our corporations; be it in finance or healthcare. As best as I can tell, the "power" of our corporation's come's from their money, not from their ideas.

We need to figure out a way to level the playing field so that idea's reign, not how much money one has. Our political system, as it currently is, disenfranchises our vote.

Once we rectify this inequity, the 3/4th's of the american populous who desires a single-payer or "public option" healthcare system will have a fair chance at having their will heard.

ProgressiveMews (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

B Roll:

"Give them enough rope and they’ll hang themselves. Give them enough hemp and they’ll stone themselves."

Hemp does NOT have THC in it, at least not enough to get stoned, that's for SURE! It would be like trying to get high off smoking catnip, more likely to get a raging headache than anything else.

It's a different strain of the plant all together.

B Roll (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago


Today has an unusually high number of posts (over 60). That kind of volume is usually reserved for days on which the topic is gay rights or religion. Since most of the posts are from the regulars, it may be that people were posting at a frenetic pace and doing less proofreading.

I'm not in a position to criticize today, because I just discovered that my first post, question the Gaia theory began with "Yesterday, Tuesday, June 9, 2009", but today is Wednesday, June 8. Bad on me.

My observation about this blog is that the number of posts has gone up since they started selecting a "member of the day" and awarding that person a gift. That may be an argument in favor of paying children for good grades.

moonbat666 (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

I agree that parenting is not the end all solution. Middle children, ages 6-11 are more influenced by their peer goups. Their devlopment in cognitive, emotional, and social acceptance comes from their peer groups: ie classmates or any other children that the child interacts with. Parenting in early infancy usually involves reward and punishment, a smile versus a frown. The reward and punishment does not need to be used forever. There are always exceptions. Parents still should be involved, but with both parents working to survive because of jerks like Ronnie and W it's tough for most parents today.

B Roll (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago


That's mews to me!

Of course, you're right of course. From now on, I'll consider having my jokes peer reviewed before posting them so that they can maintain the high level of accuracy that is the standard on this blog.

mjlilly (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

Today Thom mentioned the idea of "Gross National Happiness" and credited it to the King of Nepal. Just a note to correct that point, the promotion of "Gross National Happiness" is the official policy of the King of Bhutan.


Linda (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

Dear Thom,
I still disagree with you about paying kids for learning. I called today on your show, Linda, from Missoula. I have found that it is common for youth to end up expecting to get paid for everything when money is used as a motivational tool from too young an age. When the only motivation is to get paid, when do children have a chance to develop their own potential, creativity, kindness, concern and altruism as motivation for life?
At the end of your show you were talking about the desire to live in a society that is more than consumer based…. Is that a contradiction when talking about paying children to do well in school? There are lots of ways to earn money as a kid and rewarding a good report card every few months is where I’ll compromise, but paying a child for ongoing study and learning is not the way we should be motivating our youth. I understand that it works sometimes. Money is motivating, but that is not the direction we need our society to go. The big money systems are falling because they are out of balance with natural law. Money is part of the world, it should not rule the world; it tried to for a while, and look at the mess we are in.
Right after I hung up the phone with you, a dear friend called and shared about his current wind generation projects he is helping to develop on Native lands as a means for sustainable energy and income for Native peoples in the PNW. He ended his story with “ If I don’t get paid a cent for this project I am grateful just to be part of it for the good of the whole.” We need more members of society to think like that, not how much will I get paid to get and A. I teach students to discover their personal potential. I urge you to examine your own thoughts on this as you influence so many Americans. Essentially you host a nation wide discussion in defining American values. Lets speak out to enhance the values of creativity, critical thought and empowering the human potential, not paying our kids to learn.
Thanks for the conversation,

Quark (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

B Roll,

Re: "Today has an unusually high number of posts (over 60)."

Yes, "Member of the Day" may be the catalyst that produces all these posts. (We all like a pat on the head.) However, I really enjoy our exhuberant blog "community" and, even tho I sometimes "talk" too much, I love and value the ideas and the exchange. I really value our daily "meetings," with Thom as our motivator and facilitator.

The jokes and puns are "frosting."

Mark S (not verified) 13 years 38 weeks ago

We don't send students to school for themselves. We send them for the good of society. If they learn something at school that they can use to benefit society, what is wrong with paying them to achieve?
I would disagree with paying them to achieve well on a standardized test; but, if they learn basic skills like how to balance a checkbook or business ledger, how to read a credit card statement or balance sheet or even to understand a mortgage agreement, they will be better suited to survive and contribute to society than they are if they can score well on standardized questions that most of them will never work with again.
I am a substitute teacher who has watched the morale of teachers go down since the standardized tests that grew out of a failed policy in Texas have taken over the schools.
You do not pay for the education of today's students. You pay back for the education that you received. Nobody gets a free ride. If your parents decided to send you to a private school, they paid for your education as well as the education of the students of their generation who went to public schools.

wiserleo (not verified) 13 years 37 weeks ago

This site is way too complicated...

This is coming from someone who probably has a learning disability, and thats why I wanted to write-in...certainly not getting through the phone lines (for 6months).

I never felt like I was able to really preform in school or real sponge-like learning until I was in my 20's. Now there's no way to tell for sure, but I don't think I would have done any better by being incentivised with cash. I probably would've made me way more pissed off at society than I already am. I think its a slippery slope and doesn't really solve the problem of different people learning different ways...Just my 2 cents, and its probably misspelled, GA public schools!

sccottpot (not verified) 13 years 37 weeks ago

Can you get an expert on the effects and uses of marijuana?Listening to non-users opine on the dangers of marijuana is infuriating.So is referring to users
as dead-enders.

sccottpot (not verified) 13 years 37 weeks ago

If campaign money is treated as free speech ,why are there limits to political contributions? I thought McCain /Feingold reformed campaign finance.

sccottpot (not verified) 13 years 37 weeks ago

If we increase the life-span of Americans , won*t that bankrupt Social Security?
300 million Americans multiply by $10,000 = 3 trillion dollars.

sccottpot (not verified) 13 years 37 weeks ago

Marijuana makes the user less interested in materialism---bad for greed.

Harry (not verified) 13 years 37 weeks ago

Did Thom quote RFK today on GDP? I found this:
Too much and for too long, we seemed to have surrendered personal excellence and community values in the mere accumulation of material things. Our Gross National Product, now, is over $800 billion dollars a year, but that Gross National Product - if we judge the United States of America by that - that Gross National Product counts air pollution and cigarette advertising, and ambulances to clear our highways of carnage. It counts special locks for our doors and the jails for the people who break them. It counts the destruction of the redwood and the loss of our natural wonder in chaotic sprawl. It counts napalm and counts nuclear warheads and armored cars for the police to fight the riots in our cities. It counts Whitman’s rifle and Speck’s knife. And the television programs which glorify violence in order to sell toys to our children. Yet the gross national product does not allow for the health of our children, the quality of their education or the joy of their play. It does not include the beauty of our poetry or the strength of our marriages, the intelligence of our public debate or the integrity of our public officials. It measures neither our wit nor our courage, neither our wisdom nor our learning, neither our compassion nor our devotion to our country, it measures everything in short, except that which makes life worthwhile. And it can tell us everything about America except why we are proud that we are Americans.

Thom's Blog Is On the Move

Hello All

Thom's blog in this space and moving to a new home.

Please follow us across to hartmannreport.com - this will be the only place going forward to read Thom's blog posts and articles.

From Unequal Protection, 2nd Edition:
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