Daily Topics - Thursday March 4th 2010

healthcare is right imagesQuote:  “Liberalism is trust of the people tempered by prudence. Conservatism is distrust of the people tempered by fear.” -- William E. Gladstone

Hour One - If going to college turns you liberal should we ban them? Dr. Richard Brake, Director of University Stewardship at The Intercollegiate Studies Institute (ISI) www.isi.org

Hour Two - "A Cracking of the Heart" David Horowitz, Conservative Activist, Founder David Horowitz Freedom Center http://frontpagemag.com

Hour Three - Why do the right wing crazies think that Obamacare is going to kill them? Peter Ferrara www.theacru.org

Upcoming Events with Thom Hartmann:

Friday, March 19th, 6-8pm AM 1600 WWRL, Demos and the New York Law School Chapter of the American Constitution Society present an evening with Thom Hartmann on "When Corporations Became People" and his updated book "Unequal Protection: The Rise of Corporate Dominance and the Theft of Human Rights"...event is at New York Law School Auditorium, 185 W Broadway, New York, NY...free tickets atwww.demos.org (click on events)

Comments

Mark K (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#1

When I was in the Army, I was amazed at all the new hardware being built. Ronald Reagan had declared that he was going to restore the prestige the military had lost after Vietnam, and instituted a crash construction frenzy that included the M-1 tank, the Bradley fighting vehicle, the Patriot missile system, the Black Hawk and Apache helicopters. Meanwhile, back home my dad lost his job when the Caterpillar tractor plant in Milwaukee shut down. There was a time when I thought that massive military spending on hardware made-up for losses in domestic manufacturing—although it was not necessarily a good thing, since the market for military hardware should be more limited than for products for the domestic market.

But does military spending adequately replace jobs that would otherwise be lost in the domestic economy? I uncovered a study dated October 2007 conducted by two UMass researchers, Robert Pollin and Heidi Garrett-Peltier, who suggested otherwise. They wanted to find out how many jobs were created from government spending in six separate categories, with $1 billion as the base point for each. With one billion dollars, they concluded that military spending creates 8,500 jobs; one billion in tax cuts for personal consumption creates 11,000 jobs; one billion in health care spending creates 13,000 jobs; one billion in education spending creates 18,000 jobs; one billion in mass transit spending creates 20,000 jobs, and one billion in “weatherization” and infrastructure spending creates 13,000 jobs.

Obviously what is of interest here is that military spending and tax cuts are the least likely government “projects” to stimulate the economy, while spending on what should be the more pressing domestic priorities are more likely to stimulate the economy. The report pointedly denies the effectiveness of tax cuts, stating that “There is no reason why expanding personal consumption expenditures—particularly of the already affluent, whose level of expenditures have risen sharply since the early 1990s—should be considered as a primary focus of social policy”—or economic policy, for that matter. This is a lesson the Obama administration has yet to mislearn from the Republicans.

Mugsy (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#2

Thom, Republicans believe that colleges "influence" or "indoctrinate" students into becoming "Liberal" because so many come out Liberals. Ipso-facto.

As a college graduate, I can assure you colleges and professors typically do NOT try to "influence" or "indoctrinate" students into becoming "Liberal". It is simply that educated people are more likely to become Liberals while uneducated reactionary people are attracted to Conservatism (no mystery there.)

Nels (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#3

No Thom it's "I'm from a corporation, pay me to help."

moonbat666 (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#4

The priests of the different religious sects....dread the advance of science as witches do the approach of daylight, and scowl on the fatal harbinger announcing the subdivision of the duperies on which they live.

--Thomas Jefferson

chuckle8 (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#5

@Mark K
The way I see things. I think Obama is well aware of what really helps create jobs. If he was a dictator (like dubya), he would have provided significantly more of the stimulus package for infrastructure. The tax cuts were placed in the stimulus package to get votes to pass it; mainly, to get ConseraDems to vote for it.

Mugsy (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#6

The "Liberal is antithetical to evolution" argument is nonsense.

The reverse is true. Man has ALWAYS lived in "societies" and knew that caring for the well-being of the society was necessary for the survival of the community. Societies provided food when your hunt didn't pan out, social interaction and entertainment (story-tellers) and protection from outside forces.

Vis a vie, selfishness and concern.for only ones self was an aberration..With no outside support system, you were on your own and more likely to die in the wild.

Liberalism and concern for the Community is mans' natural state. Conservative selfishness is new (not liberalism) and antithetical to survival.

Quark (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#7

Thom,

My and my husband's I.Q.s are each over 140 and our son's is almost off the charts. It doesn't mean a darn thing to our lives (and definitely not to our incomes.) It just seems to leave us with more questions (and disappointments.) It also makes it hard to "tune things out", though we do try to live our lives the way we wish the world would be --- a good place for everyone.

Anjha (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#8

Re: Educated Liberals

If more education and higher intelligence are pre-cursors to Liberalism (or characteristics of,) and lower intelligence, levels of education and IQ are characteristics of Conservatism – then what explains Libertarianism?

Are libertarians simply more intelligent conservatives? Are they conservatives, either through nurture or some negative experience that they associate with Liberalism, who are also intelligent enough to recognize the truths of Liberalism and our Nation’s history? Is their identity as a Libertarian really just the compromise of their inner conflict between believing that they are supposed to be conservative and their own personal experiences and knowledge proving to them that Liberalism is the truth?

Nels (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#9

Its a shame, maybe even criminal the way higher education is priced out of the reach of more and more students. Then on the other side, after one has graduated with a Bachelors Degree, Master Degree, or Doctorate keep your fingers crossed there is some sort of job available for you that can put that degree to use.

Jeremiah (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#10

Here's a quote from John Stuart Mill:

"Conservatives are not necessarily stupid, but most stupid people are conservatives."

Bob (ProgressiveInTexas) (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#11

Let me start by giving credit to Thom for the seeds that led to this. Last week, in passing, Thom tossed out the a thought about Medicare eligible at age -9 months. Since that time, I have been refining the idea.

There are two keys to winning this health insurance reform war.

The first is designing a good marketing strategy and the second is choosing the appropriate battle ground.

Democrats have been inept at getting their message out; they lack bumper sticker sound bites and talking points that resonate with low-information voters. To that end, I offer to the Democrats, for free, what services that Frank Luntz would charge the Republicans several million dollars:

The Bumper Sticker Sound bite: MEDICARE ELIGIBLE AT CONCEPTION

The Talking Points:

We want all babies to be born healthy
We want all Americans to have the right to a healthy life.

Let the Republicans argue against health care for a fetus.

BTW: DO NOT fight the Reproductive Rights battle in the Health Care Arena.

I’m reminded of the scene from 1776, where Adams and Rutledge are arguing over the slavery issue. Franklin remarks that if Independence is not achieved then any attempt to abolish Slavery would be a meaningless.

Win the health care fight and Democrats will control congress and the White House for a generation or more. They will have the ability to deal with the issue by regaining control of the Supreme Court. LOSE the health care battle and the Republicans will gain even stronger grip on SCOTUS. We can kiss Reproductive and other Rights good bye.

(I also posted this on the blog)

Scott (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#12

In general people are more inclined towards liberal ideas and philosophy, not conservative ones. If that is so and you are an extreme conservative what do you do? You attack their ideas as unpatriotic and evil, a cancer. You create a list of words such as Newt Gingrich did to hand out to Republicans when describing Democrats. Naturally, all the words paint a negative picture. You create a hostile atmosphere, you make government not work for the average person so they will be turned off to the whole process and thus not vote because the move people vote the less chance you have to gain and maintain power.

Gerald Socha (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#13

The purpose of college is to help you think and to be exposed to a wide range of ideas. Conservatives want dummies leaving our high schools and colleges. They want programmed idiots roaming our country and the world. What truly amaze me are my relatives from marriage who are conservatives and they fail to know the difference between what is right and what is wrong. Conservatives do not want to be challenged by educated persons. They believe in keeping people stupid so they can control you and enslave you to remain their drones and cannon fodder.

Nels (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#14

Gerald, I don't believe that if you can't think well or open your self to a wide range of ideas before entering college, that college will bestow this on you. However, if you can't think well or open yourself to a wide range of ideas, its probably not likely you'll graduate anyway. I guess what I'm saying is, College doesn't make people more intelligent, it just proves whether they are or are not, while imparting knowledge (and being knowledgeable is different then being intelligent in my book, a smart man can be very foolish).

I agree with your statements about conservatives wholeheartedly!

Chris62 (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#15

Hi Thom,
Well first off, the power-hungry conservative is always anti-change unless they are not in power. Consequently, they are unable to process the concept of "evolving" because theirs is constantly a struggle to return to the state at which THEY are in power and therefore, control. I have been noticing the un-holy union between conservative political power and popular christian religion such as the evangelical movement, is nothing new. This is the same social plague that has spread death and disease of the mind for centuries. They are spiritual elitist and believe that no one else should be allowed to participate in the political process besides them. I find it odd, speaking as a recovering fundamentalist christian, that controlling and influencing the political process is of such importance to these people. Their own Savior said, "Be no part of this world just as I am no part of this world." Jesus position was one of complete non-involvement in politics. It is a tragedy that, with the exception of Jehovah's Witnesses, more Christian's don't feel that way.

mathboy (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#16

So another Republican schmuck in Congress wants to put Reagan on the money. He wants to put him on the 50-dollar bill. I have to ask what makes Reagan more important (and better) than Grant in American heritage. But also, the Presidents on the front of the bills are associated in some way:

On the back of Jefferson is the Signing of the Declaration of Independence, because he wrote it.

On the back of Lincoln is the Lincoln Memorial. Duh.

On the back of Hamilton is the Treasury Building, because he was the first Secretary of the Treasury (but he was also a founding father, cowriting the Federalist Papers).

On the back of Jackson is the White House, because he changed its architecture, switching the north and south porticos around.

On the back of Grant is the Capitol, because it was expanded and given a new, larger dome during his Presidency.

On the back of Franklin is Independence Hall, because that's where the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, both of which he had a hand in, were signed.

So what would be on the back of Reagan? A woman on welfare driving a Cadillac? The Berlin Wall (a foreign location)? Soldiers on the beaches of Grenada? A fictional space laser? The Debt Clock? How do you draw a picture of jobs going overseas?

Charles in OH (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#17

Wal-Mart sales declined 2% last quarter at its retail outlets. Is this an indicator that we are far from the end of the recession.

"At the beginning of the recession, Wal-Mart and other discounters were seen as the beneficiaries, as consumers 'traded down' to cheaper options."

"The tough economy and high U.S. unemployment are also playing a big role."

Nels (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#18

John Roberts, your health is far more important than some silly job. Please please please watch over your health and leave the SCROTUS. Think about your family.

Quark (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#19

John Roberts leaving the Supreme Court? 'Makes me think there IS a God!

Richard L. Adlof (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#20

Of course, (In)Justice Roberts can leave the bench, now . . . His vision for America was fulfilled by the Citizen’s United decision.

Ed in Redondo (aka DancingBear) (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#21

@Anjha

Re: Educated Liberals

"If more education and higher intelligence are pre-cursors to Liberalism (or characteristics of,) and lower intelligence, levels of education and IQ are characteristics of Conservatism – then what explains Libertarianism?"

If I had to assess Libertarians as a group I'd say that unlike your typical knee-jerk conservative, they tend to have a more highly developed capacity for reason. So much so in fact that it frequently leads them to a form of intellectual hubris and even folly. Where they typically fall short is in the realm of their ability to recognize some very basic empirical truths about the nature and boundries of human nature. Their reason leads them to desire a hyper-logical social order that ignores the fact that there is much, much more to being human then just our capacity for rational self-interest. Indeed, if human nature were as Libertarians imagined, we would be much the lesser beings for it.

Ed form Redondo
(aka DancingBear)

Geria (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#22

By the time students get to college they are too old to be influenced by professors, no matter what they profess. I graduated from an upper-class, conservative (though it was listed as liberal-arts) private college. My political science professor, at one point, said to the class, "all change is bad." Categorically, ALL change is bad. of course I thought this was nuts. Nothing living can continue to live without change. It dies if it tries to stay the same. That includes societies.

Charles in OH (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#23

The Roberts' court has thrown out stare decisis. His retirement, the sooner the better, can set up the opportunity to overturn Citizen's United. I'm sure there are some constitutional lawyers that can steer a case toward the SCOTUS much like Citizen's United.

Quark (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#24

Ed in Redondo (aka DancingBear),

Your comment seems to agree with a comment I recently heard about someone's observation that so many liberterians seem to be young men who have not yet experienced a lot of life's challenges. They are often from the Ayn Rand "school."

Gerald Socha (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#25

When I first heard David Horowitz many years ago, he seemed to be a reasonable person. He changed more and more over the years. Now I hear that his daughter died two years ago and maybe he will move toward being more understanding of persons who have serious economic and health problems.

Charell (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#26

Hi Thom,

Just a small correction. I did a paper on the Myers Briggs Type Indicator in college. The test uses Jung's personality types consisting of the opposites of:
Extraversion (E) or Introversion (I),
Sensing (S) or Intuition (N),
Thinking (T) or Feeling (F)

But the fourth set of opposites used in the test, Judging (J) or Perceiving (P), was developed by Isabel Briggs Myers, and her mother, Katharine Briggs, not Jung.

~ Charell,
webmaster: www.JungInOC.org

Geria (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#27

If colleges turn you into a liberal, should be ban them? Does that mean ban all colleges or just liberal colleges? As I pointed out in an earlier entry, my college was labeled liberal-arts and was solidly upper-class and conservative. Banning all colleges will keep people ignorant and conservative, a perfect condition for some politicians, clergymen, despots of all kinds, snake-oil salesmen, astrologists, propagandists, capitalists, and frauds of all kinds. Education, as Jefferson pointed out, protects democracy. It protects all of a nation from the above predators.

Ed in Redondo (aka DancingBear) (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#28

@ mathboy

So what would be on the back of Reagan? A woman on welfare driving a Cadillac? The Berlin Wall (a foreign location)? Soldiers on the beaches of Grenada? A fictional space laser? The Debt Clock? How do you draw a picture of jobs going overseas?

I think it would have to be a congressional conference room tableau showing Oliver North raising his hand to testify while a gallery full of fundamentalist Mullahs and bandoleer clad Contra drug smugglers look on.

Ed in Redondo

Gerald Socha (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#29

Nels, in my second year in college I had a two semester Humanities course that was great. The course opened a person's world to the arts, music, society and culture, and comparative religions. In my Junior year and my Senior year in college I had a semester of Introduction to Anthropolgy and a semester of Cultural Anthropology. These course were also great learning experiences. College opened my world beyond my previous world in a small community of similar persons. My dad had a limited education but he was very knowledgeable in many areas. In my formative years he was my best educator.

Richard L. Adlof (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#30

@MathBoy: Your observations on the construction on our legal tender are brilliant.

You need to add Union being busted, Airport Controllers being permanently furloughed, college students being turned away and high school humanities textbooks being purged.

Mark K (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#31

Bellevue, WA is the principle Republican enclave in otherwise reliably liberal King County, so it must be a truism that the opinion expressed by the caller from that so-called city does suggest that conservatives have a lower IQ, What exactly was he trying to say? That in order to prevent the "lower classes" from aspiring to improve their lot in life and acquiring better jobs, we must keep them "satisfied" with janitorial work? It's odd (or not), but whenever we start on the blame-game for lack of work among blacks, and the scapegoating of Latinos for taking "their" jobs, it is always over the jobs that white people like himself find "undesirable," and who should have the cushy office jobs, like some kind of plantation system.

Gerald Socha (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#32

No Supreme Court Justice will leave the court. It is the greatest gravy train job in the USA.

Wendy (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#33

Peter knows he doesn't have a leg to stand on - so, like most conservatives, he resorts to shouting and personal insults.

Don't give this guy another minute of your time Thom!

Gerald Socha (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#34

Thom, when an idiot filibusters on your radio show quiet his mike so you can speak. I prefer listening to you rather than listen to idiots.

Mugsy (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#35

Thom, the most costly drains on Medicare are private for-profit agencies draining the program for obscene profits.

Medicare Part-D with "competition" stripped out.
"Scooter" companies selling every overweight American an alternative to weight loss.

And how many times have we seen insurance companies deny coverage on the grounds "you never told us you had acne as a child" or "didn't report the bladder infection you had when you were 25"?

Quark (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#36

Wow, after listening to the nasty, mannerless, disrespectful and untrue arguments by Peter Ferrara, I could feel Ferrara's authoritarian FEAR reaching right through my computer! (I almost felt sorry for him.)

Gary R. Page (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#37

A couple of notes to Mr. Ferrara:

1. Volume and repetition does not create Truth. It is easy to define anything in such a limited perspective.

2. A "dialog" requires two inputs; otherwise, is it a monologue (which can be annoying at high volume).

Charles in OH (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#38

I commend Thom for bringing cons on his show. But, Peter Ferrara has to be the worst. His disregard for the format of Thom's show is insulting. Can the ACRU provide a person more familiar with the rules of debate.

mathboy (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#39

Thanks, Richard. There's too much badness for one person to remember.

todd_se_pdx (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#40

If intelligence is the embracement and distillation of new ideas, how can the rigidity of atheism - the absolute belief in the non-existence of God - be condidered any more intelligent than the rigidity of religion?

I would like to know if the study on intelligence that Thom cites seperates agnosticism seperately from atheism.

As a physicist I understand that, scientifically at least, that we are seemingly limited to the rational limits of understanding within our 11 dimensional universe. As such I know that the cosmos - and intelligence - exists, but from where they come from we cannot scientifically say.

I partly agree with Thom (and I hope I get his thought right) that the most intellectually honest form of religion is agnosticism. But where agnostics are not sure of the existence of God, as a staunch Calvinist I am of the opinion that Chrisitanity is just another form of agnositicism, one in which we are resolved by logic to concede that we - alone - do not have the ability to pierce that veil of knowledge of the personality beyond or own rational universe.

So just how can an intellectual liberal believe in the Divine? I'd love to answer the question, but first I must go feed the hungry, clothe the naked, shelter the homeless and seek justice for the oppressed.

I think that's liberal enough.

mstaggerlee (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#41

The New(?!) Business Model for Big Pharma?

About a year ago, I had a little brush with skin cancer. No big deal, really - my wife spotted a suspicious growth on my back, and we're fortunate enough to have semi-decent health insurance, so I went to a dermatologist. He froze it off, and we scheduled follow-ups for 6 months and a year to make sure it was all gone.

Just had my 1-year follow-up, and everything's fine. But he noted some splotchy redness on my face. In fact, I've pretty much ALWAYS had that - it's most likely a result of 35 years of shaving over the remnants of my acne scars. Whatever it is, he assured me that it's nothing to get concerned about,
but he gave me some samples of some stuff to put on it, wrote me a prescription for it, and handed me a coupon so that if I decide to fill the scrip, it'll cost me $25 or less. Mind you, this has NOTHING to do with my HEALTH - this is really about little more than vanity.

Anyway, I took it all home & showed it to my wife. The coupon amused her. That's when I realized that I've seen this business model before. Do you recognize it?

Let's see, now - the first dose is FREE ...and the next one is quite affordable. After that, my friend, it's gonna cost ya!

Sound familiar NOW??

Ed in Redondo (aka DancingBear) (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#42

@ Quark

Your comment seems to agree with a comment I recently heard about someone’s observation that so many liberterians seem to be young men who have not yet experienced a lot of life’s challenges. They are often from the Ayn Rand “school.”

Rand's vision has little in common with real world as it is actually lived and experienced, but it does have a kind of idealistic fantasy-land appeal to those who have not yet gained a firm grip on the true moral and practical complexities of life. It is a form of ideological fundamentalism and as such, it has the same kind of appeal that religious fundamentalism offers - i.e. it takes a complex live world reality and reduces down to a simplistic model that does not require one to think so much (just so long as you are willing to ignore the occasional fact).

Ed In Redondo

D.Silva (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#43

My boys (9 & 10 years old) woke up early this morning to attend a rally at school. They are protesting the layoff of their teachers. But really the decision has been made to continue with cuts to education.

What's being cut? Art, Music and PE.

My boys have been forced to wear uniforms in school.

They are being taught to the test and not to reason.

Our school are teaching them to conform and to think the same.

Our schools are teaching my kids:
- Dress the same
- Think the same
- No creativity
- No exercise

If they grow up with everyone around them being the same and thinking the same. Will they then distrust anyone that thinks and looks different?

Are they being trained to be Conservative?

Anjha (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#44

@Dancing Bear

"If I had to assess Libertarians as a group I’d say that unlike your typical knee-jerk conservative, they tend to have a more highly developed capacity for reason. So much so in fact that it frequently leads them to a form of intellectual hubris and even folly. Where they typically fall short is in the realm of their ability to recognize some very basic empirical truths about the nature and boundries of human nature. Their reason leads them to desire a hyper-logical social order that ignores the fact that there is much, much more to being human then just our capacity for rational self-interest. Indeed, if human nature were as Libertarians imagined, we would be much the lesser beings for it."

So true, so true.

While Thom was speaking with that man this morning and they were arguing about [discussing] the "influence" of professors in college, my mind drifted to my one "conservative" friend. She is not really conservative at all, but rather Libertarian.

She is extremely intelligent. One of the most intelligent people who I know and I love her very much, however, we cannot discuss politics at all.

I know that she is very caring and I know that she is very well studied in many disciplines. She is grounded and she is emotionally mature...this in particular is why I am so confused about her political perspective.

That is why I drifted during Thom's discussion into attempting to figure out what influenced her perspective. She is of the Ayn Rand school, (though I have never asked her outright if she studied Rand, because I have learned that there are some topics that are better left un-discussed with her.)

She does have a negative view of human nature and she was also raised in highly conservative political environments. That is why I suspect that it is nurture that determines the Libertarians world view. That, perhaps, Libertarians are really Liberals who conform to Libertarian philosophy because that is the only way to, emotionally, reconcile their intellect, values and personal experiences with their upbringing.

Just a thought.

Thanks, Dancing Bear, for your thoughtful response.

LeMoyne (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#45

OMG - Medicare covers our older people who naturally have a greater need for medical care without recission. The healthy people are given to the private insurance companies in our employer-based system and the insurance companies will work hard to break Peter's precious contract if he gets sick.
If the healthy people are brought into the Medicare coverage pool then the cost will go down per person so the Medicare system will be stabilized AND the people will not get cut off if they get sick.

Again, if the Democrats pass a mandate without at least a strong public option they will take a real beating in this fall's mid-term elections.

Charles in OH (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#46

The only thing Ferrara said that had a smidgeon of truthiness was that "Obamacare" is fascist. The mandate to purchase a for-profit insurance policy is a little too close for comfort. Short of Medicare for all, what other options is there to force insurers to lower costs?

Bill B (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#47

Tom,

With the new health care approach of including several Republican ideas from the health care summit last week, I have a novel way of presenting these ideas for a vote.

The Democratic items that Obama wants to put through reconciliation should be isolated into one bill, which of course will not get any Republican votes. The items he has identified from the Republicans can then be isolated into their own bill. The interesting aspect is how much support will this bill get from each party.

I think letting these ideas stand alone will highlight the real support the Republicans have for their ideas, among themselves and their Democratic colleagues. As an added notion, each Democratic Senator will be free to vote as they wish.

This could be a great example of possible hypocrisy and bipartisan support.

I would really like to see how many Republicans would end up voting for any health care reform.

Thanks,
Bill

mathboy (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#48

And thanks to Ed in Redondo. I'd forgotten about Iran-Contra too. Apparently it takes three to remember all of Reagan badness.

Sue (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#49

Tom, I was really surprised that you would mention that seemingly bogus report about Chief Justice Roberts stepping down. The thing was reported in only one place, an obscure blog, and they had already retracted it. Don't know why you would have given any airtime at all to something that wasn't worth mentioning yet.

All that aside, love you, love your show.

Quark (not verified) 9 years 51 weeks ago
#50

Ed in Redondo (aka DancingBear),

Yes, I agree with your much more (than mine) beautifully and thoughtfully stated comment. I think a naive black and white world view plays nicely into the Ayn Rand cult.

"The Saddest Thing Is This Won't Be Breaking News"

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