Daily Topics - Monday May17th 2010 - Oil Spill. Banksters. Protesters. OH MY!
By louisehartmann
Hour One: Six degrees of separation...Dick Cheney and the Gulf oil spill - Attorney Mike Papantonio will be here with the latest www.ringoffireradio.com
Hour Two: "American Radicalism"...racism by another name? Thom confronts conservative David Horowitz about his latest piece for National Review Online www.nationalreview.com
Hour Three: Thailand - Who are the Red Shirts? with Giles Ji Ungpakorn, Political Activist
Plus...Is the Revolution here...on Bankters? Are we as mad as Hell yet?
Comments
#2
So what do YOU think we should be using to break up this spill? Straw? Hair? Don't'cha know that nobody is gonna get rich on the use of that stuff?
Have you not yet figured out that the only solutions that will ever be deemed "workable" in today's world are the ones that will involve the expenditure of some HUGE amount of money to a company that's among the "partners" of BP, Transocean and Haliburton? Anything that's cheap, simple and seems to make sense to the "common" man will be deemed "stupid", "soft-headed" and will ultimately be dismissed.
Sometimes I wonder why we even bother.
#3
So the only way for the American people to expect BP to really be held accountable is for this disaster to stay on the front page long enough that the company will be incapable of bribing politicians to get what they want. However, if it stays on the front page that long... well obviously the whole area, and other areas will be destroyed. Damned one way or the other.
N
#4
Haley Barbour is gov. of Mississippi, not Alabama.
#5
"If you want total security, go to prison. There you're fed, clothed, given medical care and so on. -- Dwight D. Eisenhower
#6
@Gene, and only assraped by your bunk mate and not corporations.
N
#7
The true cost of oil
I wonder what the cost of a barrel of oil is; when subsidies, tax breaks, liability limits & government run clean-up funds are taken into consideration?
#8
@Drichards: gas probably cost about as much as in Afghanistan: $400 per gallon.
#9
@Maxrot
Or by both. I saw an interview on MSNBC in a prison warden's office. On a shelf behind the warden was a Blackwater logo.
#10
@DRichards: don't forget the immense military spending that goes into protecting our access to oil. Plus, the US military is the largest single user of oil in the world. Such a deal!
#11
The NYT is reporting this morning that the chemical being used being used by BP "had its approval RESCINDED in Great Britain a decade ago because it was found to be harmful to sea life."
In the 70's, I read a science-fiction novel by Gregory Benford entitled "Timescape", about scientists in the future desperately trying to warn scientists in the past of ecological collapse in the oceans threatening to kill all life on Earth.
I suddenly feel like the novel is coming true. :(
#12
@DRichards -
This was a blog Thom posted about a week ago re: the REAL price of oil -
http://www.thomhartmann.com/forum/2010/05/what-true-cost-oil
#13
Harry,
Oops! I forgot to add the cost of our military to "protect" the oil interest. Yes, $400 per gallon is probably closer to the actual cost of a gallon of gas.
#14
Mstaggerlee
Thanks! I missed it.
#15
Sure Oil is expensive, but thank god we aren't moving to using Solar Power. Just imagine if we had an accident at one of those power plants. Worse would be an unregulated Wind Farm though, I can't even imagine the worst case senario of one of those going haywire... really I can't.
N
#16
Yeah! sunlight might hit the ground!
#17
Ford didn't go public until 1957. I'd guess that a family owned business would have its members as shareholders as far as the 1920s decision.
#18
Horowitz displays a hyper-sociopathic mentality. If I had to venture a guess I would guess that xenophobia and active sociopathic destruction of republican-democracies are what he eats with his Wheaties every farging morning. Of course, he embraces authoritarianism. Of course, he lacks the ability to understand basic agreed upon definitions of words and can make no pretense to communicate without mindless jingoistic tripe.
I understand the concept of modeling communication with wing-nuts . . . But the dude on the other side of the conversation must display even a hint of a ghost of a hope of a chance of ‘mens rea’. Please don’t waste our time with Horowitz, again.
#19
Drilling off shore is more expensive that Middle East oil and the oil cartels use off-shore drilling to drive up the cost of oil to inflate the price as the oil taken from USAian sources is not retained for the sole use of America but bought and sold on the international commodity markets.
This whole happy horse hockey is WAY more insidious than most folk think.
#20
It would never make up for the real damage, but in any Energy Bill, there should be a separate category and tax or penalty for wasted energy or carbon.
There should be costs to capture and sell oil and gas, but an obscenity like this, even in the carbon release to the environment, should carry a proportionally high penalty.
When you put out your garbage in some cities, you pay a fee per bag. If you throw it out your car window, you pay a lot more for a littering ticket because the action was unacceptable. Not many people would look at littering fines as just a cost of disposal. These BP ('bastard people') pirates shouldn't be able to just count this as a cost of doing business. It should be the very high cost of screwing up.
Rick
#21
Maybe Texas should be allowed to secede.
#22
Maybe give Arizona back too.. ;-)
Rick
#23
I hope radicals don't retaliate against Miss USA.
#24
I saw a few brief parts of miss usa show ;) I think a lot of people felt she was the most beautiful like I did. 'Course all i really care about are breasts.
#25
@Rick, yes, lets give Arizona back... to Mexico, then we'll see who gets kicked out for being illegal... oh how deliciously ironic that would be.
N
#26
@harry, I think the rights' biggest issue with the Miss America winner is that she's totally blowing their minds not wearing a veil. Its totally ruining their stereotype of Muslim women.
N
#27
I woulda voted for her even with a veil. ;)
#28
At What Cost? BP Spill Responders Told to Forgo Precautionary Health Measures in Cleanup
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/riki-ott/at-what-cost-bp-spill-res_b_57878...
Hey, we didn't need Precautionary Health Measures for the 911 cleanup... and everyone is fine...
#29
I'm still wondering what happened to all that toxic dirt in New Orleans? I haven't heard about it being cleaned up, nor even any news about if its still there, and what levels of toxicity is it?
#30
@DRichards -
Except, of course, for those first responders, and the "search and recovery" volunteers, who are now dying of breathing disorders, and fighting for both their insurance benefits and their lives.
#31
@mstaggerlee, well it'll all be fine once they just die. You really just need to adjust to the corporate point of view, then everything is bliss.
N
#32
Keep remembering how the Exxon Valdez settlements went; 20 years then thrown out / cut down by Bush's Supreme Board of Directors..
Rick
#33
Yeah, President Perry will work to reverse the penalties.
#34
I recall that it is illegal for the US government to supply weapons to governments that use the weapons against their own people. The solution was to send the weapons to Israel, and have Israel send them to Indonesia or wherever.
Such a deal!
#35
@mstaggerlee, here's an excellent example of what I mean by comment #31. On Friday the info came out that well the oil coming out is about 25,000 barrels a day, and as it had been from the get go. So now what's all over the news, they got an insertion tube sucking up 1,000 barrels a day...yay!!! (Please don't bother doing the math you'll be able to figure easily that there's still at least 24,000 barrels a day spewing forth). Also Oil really hasn't been washing on shore, because of the use of dispersants, never mind that the dispersants are highly toxic and the underwater oil is killing mass amounts of sea life.
As I see it, you're just going one step further than the story. I know, I know you're just coming to natural conclusions, but you're not supposed to think, thinking leads to depression.
N
#36
mstaggerlee
Re: and everyone is fine...
I was being sarcastic ;)
For many corporations, it's all about maximizing the CEO's self centeredness, no matter the cost.
#37
Texas is an Oilygarchy ;-)
So, now they are teaching about the USA victory at the Alamo?
Rick
#38
@DRichards... can you explain this concept you call... sarcasm? I'm not sure I get it ;-)
N
#39
Irony.. That's what a blacksmith does, Right?
Rick
#40
At the Alamo, the headline should be: "Terrorist Slave-Trader Cell Cornered and Killed during Ilegal Rebellion. -coon-skin clad cabal cooped-up in catholic church chapel; corraled to cut chaos"
#41
I thought a blacksmith ran a forge operation. ;D
#42
@Rick in Canadia, please don't rub the salt in my American wounds... it seems that Arizona and Texas are trying to vie for the coveted 'which state can embarrass the country more' prize. Providing Palin to the public had really put Alaska up at the top of the list, but since she quit as governor, Alaska has lost a lot of its embarrassing power.
N
#43
The Obama Administration... the Should Have Administration.
N
#44
Irony, forgery, hammers and sickles.. sounds pretty evil.. 'axes of evil'?
#45
Don't feel bad; we have Quebec.. ;-) Trade ya for Vermont.. maple syrup etc..
#46
THOM! Be horrified. The President is not a Democrat. This is a DLC (Democrats Loving Corporations) White House. Flesh and blood folk don’t count.
#47
So Rick, what happened to the Habs?
#48
Texas and Arizona are 'pissing off' Kansas . . . They can't even generate the winger-whacko to keep up.
#49
I disagree rladlof, I think the President is a Democrat... a political Democrat, not your average person in the street, progressive Democrat. The difference is once a democrat becomes elected, money is sprayed all over the politician. Like a dog urinating on a tree, the DLC just pisses all over these people until they're humilated enough to take proper direction.
N
#50
re:#48: What about Jersey? they can't even claim to be the dirtiest any more.
Thom's Blog Is On the Move
By webmaster
Hello All
Thom's blog in this space and moving to a new home.
Please follow us across to hartmannreport.com - this will be the only place going forward to read Thom's blog posts and articles.
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Dispersants Might Be INCREASING Damage From Gulf Oil Spill
http://georgewashington2.blogspot.com/
Everyone knows that the dispersants being dumped into the Gulf oil are toxic. As I wroteFriday:
Highly toxic dispersants have been used to try to break up the oil. See this and this. Not only are dispersants being released underwater, but the air force is also dropping dispersants on the slick from above.
The official information for the dispersant reveals problems:
OSHA requires companies to make Material Safety Data Sheets, or MSDSs, available for any hazardous substances used in a workplace, and the ones for these dispersants both contain versions of a disturbing statement.
***
Both data sheets include the warning "human health hazards: acute." The MSDS for Corexit 9527A [the dispersant apparently being used in the Gulf] states that "excessive exposure may cause central nervous system effects, nausea, vomiting, anesthetic or narcotic effects," and "repeated or excessive exposure to butoxyethanol [an active ingredient] may cause injury to red blood cells (hemolysis), kidney or the liver." It adds: "Prolonged and/or repeated exposure through inhalation or extensive skin contact with EGBE [butoxyethanol] may result in damage to the blood and kidneys."
Indeed, the specific dispersant being used is more toxic and less effective than other alternative dispersants, perhaps because of BP's connections to the manufacturer.
In addition, new questions have arisen as to whether the dispersants might actually beingincreasing damage from the oil itself.
As the Christian Science Monitor notes today:
More relevant could be the dispersant that BP is applying to the oil at the source. BP officials have hailed the process as a success, noting diminishing oil at the surface. But the dispersant breaks the oil into smaller drops, which might instead be spreading throughout the water column, instead of rising to the surface.
It is not clear what this would mean environmentally, though past research indicates that oil can be trapped in the seabed for decades after oil on the surface is cleaned away.
Shouldn't the use of dispersants be stopped until scientists figure out whether they will make things better or worse?