Daily Topics - Tuesday - May 25th 2010
By louisehartmann
Quote: “History records that the money changers have used every form of abuse, intrigue, deceit, and violent means possible to maintain their control over governments by controlling money and its issuance.” – James Madison
Hour One - Should BP be put out of business and its executives put in jail? Mike Papantonio Activist, Attorney, co-host of The Ring of Fire Radio Program with Robert Kennedy, Jr. www.ringoffireradio.com
Plus..."Toxic Talk: How the Radical Right has Poisoned America’s Airwaves" Bill Press, Talk Show Host, Author, Activist www.billpress.com
Hour Two - Has Obama slipped Social Security death panels in under our noses? Nancy Altman http://socialsecurity-works.org
Hour Three - Why are socialist organizations that want us to pay their taxes allowed to make money criticizing socialism?! Robert Knight www.dangersofsocialism.com
Comments
#2
don't ya know those who were yelling loudest for "smaller government" are now yelling loudest "where's the government?"
#3
Say, California State Senator pro tem Steinberg's staffer called me back after having faxed in a copy of that Hawaiin resolution to say the corporations are not persons. I told them the Hartmann Show was behind the push and that I was half way through getting my book report on the to be re-introduced UnEqual Protection in on my early copy as there is a little window of concentrated opportunity for me to do its richness justice. The staffer said he would be glad to be in reciept of that as soon as I have finished it!
#4
@Harry- Laura Flanders had it right in 2006- 'they are a bunch of four year olds.'
#5
@Golden (from yesterday): The 'un-left' to carry is a choice and action. Skin color is a state of being. To exclude an idiot for enacting a social/legal malfeasance is the legal obligation of a business person and discrimination is the illegal excluding/oppression of a person for condition of birth or legally protected state of belief. There is no relationship and the analogy does not hold. To be clear, broken logic is NOT reason.
An apt comparative statement would be:
‘Meet the Press’ is to Rand Paul like Vietnam is to Dick Cheney.
Both are fear-driven members of the actual socio-economic elite who ran from a social responsibility to the public at large. Rand Paul, like Ayn Rand, is a sociopath committed to disassembling society. Defending sociopathic statements with bad analogies only serves to irritate those folk who took rhetoric classes in high school.
#6
I am still trying to find a home in the political arena.
Thom has mentioned the selfishness of the libertarian blind support of business and the free market, of which I agree. What is the libertarian position regarding global empire? We know that beyond the rhetoric, that the actual policies that the republicans & democrats are pretty much the same. Obama's actual policies are very similar to Bush. We have expanded the war in the middle east, Guantontomo is still open, Obama agrees with Bush's use of signing statements, and the right to detain people with no habeas review. Both republicans and democrats believe in big government, and both parties are beholden to the corporations.
We also know that after the "close call" with Ross Perot that both the democratic and republican parties agreed to band together to prevent the threat of another third party candidate rising to power.
My questions are; what other practices of the libertarian party are bad? What is the libertarian position regarding global empire, the Federal Reserve, the bailouts of banks & corporations and tariffs? How many libertarians are in the back pockets of the corporations? I sometimes wonder if it is the libertarian party that we need to "take over".
#7
One of reasons that oil companies drill off-shore is to drive UP the average cost of oil out on the world market. Since all oil is pooled in the commodity markets . . . having an expensive source off-sets the price of pumping cheap oil outta the Middle East . . . BUT worse, the average price of method of procurement is cross applied to ALL oil . . . regardless of actual production flow from each source resulting in an artificially inflated bottom line . . . Reasonable folk see the base-line price and are willing to pay more per barrel.
#8
UnAmerican for being tough on a foreign corporation for destroying our natural capital.
#9
Thom
May 25, 2010
Let me start by saying the Dow and Wall Street are not the economy. Labor and jobs are the economy.
If I was president, I would prosecute criminals. There is a long list of names and corporations that should be put in jail.
I have never claimed to be the sharpest tool in the tool box but why is it that the United States of Hell seems always screwed by foreign corporatists, such as BP and Halliburton? Why is it that the United States of Hell finds ways to waste away our precious natural resources? Why can’t the United States of Hell find alternative energies so that we do not go to war for a foreign country’s energy resources? Why is the United States of Hell a perpetual hell hole? Why are we letting the Texas publishing companies to dummy down our youth?
#10
Social Security shouldn't be insurance.
The guest is correct that SS was sold to us as insurance, but that's a silly way to allow for retirement. It allows the Aristocracy to throw the burden on those least able to pay and ... as Nancy's entire presenation shows ... handicaps a rational analysis of the problem of caring for our aged and infirm.
#11
@Gerald: "Why are we letting the Texas publishing companies to dummy down our youth? " 'cause its Texas's turn.
#12
THOM! I believe you are incorrect. We did not vote for FDR and get Clinton:
On human rights, President Obama is truly GWBush-lite. On taxes and regulation, President Obama is the bastard love child of Reagan and Clinton. On corporations, President Obama is largely DLC.
#13
Re: Why would Obama appoint people to a commission who do not want to raise the Social Security tax ceiling?
Is Obama just a continuation of the Clinton administration?
Why has Obama continued Bush's policies?
OK, tell me again what the actual difference between the two parties is?
#14
@DRichards: re #13: they're spelled different. Actually, both parties feed from the same trough, but the GOP gets the deep end....
#15
@rladlof, I think you missed Thom's point, I believe he's pointing out what the American people wanted, they thought they saw it in Obama, but ended up with yet another DLC servant. Your absolutely right, that if the American public as a whole really paid attention and had common sense they would have known this during the campaign, but as happens so often, the electorate falls into the "lessor of two evils" stupor, and ends up resigned to vote for someone they ultimately have settled for. Thom is right, though, a lot of people who voted for Obama, really believed he was a strong progressive, more so because they wanted to believe it, then actually having facts that supported it. Then there were those of us who had really no other choice then Obama or McCain at that point, what're you going to do with that choice?
N
#16
Harry,
So why aren't the liberals yelling just as loud as when Bush was in office? Is it the same blind allegiance to a political party? Is it a double standard?
#17
@DRichards, no question about it, you'll always get the faithful to cheer for their team, no matter how bad they play.
N
#18
@Drichards: why arent liberals yelling as loud? Obama isn't as bad as Bush.
#19
FYI
As a follow-up to yesterdays member of the day post re:Should Nebraska adopt an Arizona style immigration law. The final out come was 82% yes 18% no. There were 964 votes cast. What a sad commentary on todays culture. This is the HEARTLAND ?!?!
If you would like to post a comment go to editor@theindependant.com
Mena
#20
Harry
Sounds like a game of good cop, bad cop. Either way, it's the same people running the show.
#21
It's part double standard, but more Stockholm syndrome
#22
@DRichards, sounds like your waking up. ;-)
N
#23
We've disempowered ourselves by wondering, if only in the back of our heads, 'what if the center-right-nation mantra is actually accurate?'
#24
I don't think there is a good cop. It's more like bad cop, worse cop.
#25
Chickens for pigeons?
Here's an idea: Hold a contest for composing a "Robot Pigeons from the Planet Zenu" theme song. The Ghost Chickens song is pretty funny but I bet there are a lot of song writers who listen to your show. I'm sure one of them could compose something better. Or just ask the best comedian/song writer/satirist: Roy Zimmerman!
#26
Perhaps the reason Obama and the democrats turns a deft ear to liberals & progressives; is that we really are a tiny minority?
#27
Dr. Hartmann has a pet theory that Obama is playing some form of 3-dimensional chess. More plausibly, the Republicans are playing chicken. The Democrats, are also playing chicken; they just aren't playing to win.
#28
@DRichards, progressives are only a tiny minority in the administration and on Wall Street, the only voices the White House listens to.
American progressives are not in the minority, but we're not aggressive enough yet (and we're pretty aggressive).
N
#29
Peevish austerity and poverty does not precede prosperity; they precede dearth.
#30
Playing chess, playing chicken... it's all a game to make one think there really is a difference.
#31
@radlof/maxnels, re: #'s 12 & 15 - Do you guys actually wonder why the public thought they were getting a Progressive when they voted for Obama? Were either of you actually in the USA in 2008? Didja turn a TV on during the election? See if this phrase elicits some deep memory -
"Barack Obama represents the FAR LEFT of the Democrat Party!"
We heard it from Rush, from Hannity, from Beck (who wasn't as big a player back then), from Buchannan, from Savage, from Drudge, from every friggin' pundit on the right. In fact, despite all evidence, all of them STILL say it! So I do NOT wonder why people think that way - if EVERYBODY says it, it MUST be true!
... right?
#32
We voted for Obama cause he was better than McCain. that's it.
#33
We're where the Reagan revolution was in the mid-70's, at the 'silent majority' stage.
#34
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice...
It's so very, very hard to face the facts.
#35
@MAXROT: No, I got the point. This is a common retort of Thom’s when a knee-jerk liberal labels President Obama as Bush-lite. The truth is that President Obama is habitually to the right of the great triangler . . . Actually, like a heartbeat to the right of Clinton.
I recognize that progressive/liberal folk were desperate for a miracle after a near decade of the Bush-Cheney hooligans. I realize that folk saw ‘not Bush’ and thought that Obama did not have a snide for plutocrat campaign dollars . . . BUT I remember being shouted down on this site for noting that Obama’s pantsuit has more green stains on its knees than HRC’s did.
The Bush era wiped a hunk of history and what it means to be American from our populous. Eisenhower and Nixon were largely to the left of Obama.
#36
@harry re: #32 -
EXACTLY! Obama was certainly not MY first choice. Kuchinich was, even though I knew that his candidacy was essentially a pipe dream. When Dennis was forced out of the race, I supported John Edwards, even though Randi Rhodes had been saying all along "I know stuff about him that I can't talk about, so trust me, he has no chance."
Eventually, the Blue choices were reduced to Obama & Hillary - and only then did I get on board with Obama.
#37
@DRichards regarding "So why aren't the liberals yelling just as loud as when Bush was in office? Is it the same blind allegiance to a political party?":
We are. It just doesn’t make the news.
#38
Mr Knght hides his hypocrisy behind his God.
#39
The "simple solution" crowd is trying to sell socialism etc. as totalitarianism. People tend to believe there is a connection.
#40
great, this ist guy is for forced marriage- yeah....that works.
#41
Wow! Great bridge Thom! You reached consensus on some vital issues. But
Robert still doesnt get that We are the People- that entire side of that aisle doesn't get this.
#42
Yeah, the mainstream Democrats are deaf to cries from the left.
#43
@DRichards regarding “deft ear to liberals & progressives; is that we really are a tiny minority?”
No we are a solid majority of about 60% . . . We just have 25% or less of the capital . . .
#44
@n*chz: BINGO!
#45
@Drichards: what is a "deft ear"? one that works on either side of the head?
#46
I have read that statistically Christians cheat and abuse their spouses at the same rate as non-Christians. Regarding the hypocrisy; for the fundamentalist, it seems to be a case of overcompensating for their own character flaws.
#47
Where do you find all these "Conservatives?" This guy Knight is as much of a blockhead as Grover Norquist!
If corporations produce so much wealth, why are the people of Nigeria trying to throw BP out? Why are the Boiivians suing Chevron? Why can't coal companies protect their miners? Why do they all have to ship jobs overseas? Because they produce so much wealth?
This oil spill in the Gulf is produced by a corporation--is that wealth?
#48
@mstaggerlee: The talking head on the un-left impacted the perception that President Obama was not a mediocre, just-right-of-the-center-of-road pro-corporatist shill . . . BUT short attention spans and desperation and fear fatigue really helped.
#49
The two party system is my one and only reason for voting Democratic. Needless to say, I'm waiting with baited breath to see what becomes of Britain's coalition government, ESPECIALLY concerning the promises of electile reform.
#50
@rladlof re: "BUT I remember being shouted down on this site for noting that Obama’s pantsuit has more green stains on its knees than HRC’s did."
ROTFLMAO, that imagery just brings up way to many innuendos.
N
Thom's Blog Is On the Move
By webmaster
Hello All
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1. yes
2. yes
3. no (or at least I am in denial)
4. because the sheeple let them