Republicans have no shame.

Republicans are now admitting that the only reason they still control the House of Representatives is because they rigged the election. In a new report by the Republican State Leadership Council, the Party brags about how it spent $30 million in 2010 to put Republicans majorities in state legislatures in blue states, like Michigan, Ohio, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania.

Those majorities went on to carve up Congressional districts in a way that benefits Republicans – by carving up very safe red districts –and hurts Democrats by splitting up Democratic strongholds. So by the time the 2012 elections came along – Republican House seats were already very well-protected. As the report notes, “2012 could have been a repeat of 2008, when voters gave control of the White House and both chambers of Congress to Democrats…Instead, Republicans enjoy a 33-seat margin in the U.S. House…having endured Democratic successes atop the ticket and over one million more votes cast for Democratic House candidates than Republicans.”

Yes, Republicans just admitted that voters wanted Democrats to control the House – but Republican gerrymandering prevented that from happening. Clearly the Republican Party has adopted one simple strategy: If you can’t win elections fair and square – then steal them.


ken ware's picture
ken ware 11 years 22 weeks ago

I am sorry Alice, but please let me know where you got your info about more suicides than those who died in battle. You sound like you have your wars mixed up. The soldiers in Afghanistan have suffered more suicides than combat deaths during a specific time period. I have to assume those of you who made comments that we as soldiers need to decide whether we will fight once we are military men, have no practical experience of being in uniform. I believe Mr. Abbot mentioned he resigned from the army. Resigning once your contract with the army is up is not the same as being in the military and refusing an order. Are there times when a soldier, airman or a naval personnel should refuse to obey a command if it is clear and apparent it is wrong, such as gunning down unarmed civilians, the answer is without a doubt is YES! The people who did not want to fight were consciences objectors and where given non-battle positions in the military. Whether you joined or were drafted into the army you swore an oath to the country and the military chain of command. The idea that a soldier on the battle field can just refuse to fight because he doesn't want to kill or be killed is one way to demoralize and destroy the fighting men around you. Does anyone out really believe we should just turn the other cheek if we are attacked? The Presidents you have mentioned believed at one point that the Domino Theory was a possibility. A perfect example was the Korean War where had we not fought to stop the Communists from taking over S. Korea, there would be no S. Korea and the whole population would still be under the control of a dictator from N. Korea! We were in a Cold War with the Communist forces around the World, or did that just happen to miss your mind. America, China and Russian where in an ideological war and the duck and cover drills were real because we thought there was a good possibility we would be attacked. No war is preferred if it can be avoided through diplomatic talks. But I guess you thought the communist in the North Vietnamese Government were fighting to unite their country as a free state. They were trying to unite the country as a communist run state like China and Russia. And if you disagreed with the communist you were sent to relocation centers to be re-educated to be a good communist. These days have passed, but at the time they were a real threat and for you TV journalists to say you know what it was like or what happened during and after any war and you had the answers is ridiculous at best. It is always the arm chair warriors with no knowledge or experience, that come up with statements they might have heard something somewhere about a specific war, with no evidence that situation was factual. And the fact that you can say what you want, when you want and about anything you want is a gift handed down from those who served and died in our military. The government has no reason to worry or think you people could be a threat to them and that is why they get away with the crimes they do. The people who have made these comments about our military are of the same character of those who spit on our guys when they returned from war. I really wish one of these cowards would have tried to spit on my uniform; it would have been a pleasure to make them aware of the reality in their little minded world. Arm chair warriors have been around in every conflict where real men and women put their lives on the line for this country.

.Abbot - You are a perfect example of someone who might have had military training, but are still an arm chair warrior. You heard two soldiers tell you about something that happened in Vietnam. You actually think the Communist Soldiers in any country during this war would not have fired on a Huey or a UH-1 chopper. Anyone who served in active duty in country during the war would have retired in 1993, because we pulled all combat personnel out of Nam in 1973. The only combat troops left in country were Maines tha guarded the Embassy. More arm chair B.S. from someone who was never in combat and the odds you talked to real combat soldiers is stretching it by a mile! Try telling facts and not your arm chair stories. You may not have even been the one who stated he served in the army for ten years than resigned. If so why did it take you ten years to discover you were not military material? The military usually gets rid of personal they consider not to be combat ready after their first tour of duty and replaces them with new officers, unless the qualifications have been lowered.

ken ware's picture
ken ware 11 years 22 weeks ago

Hartmann really needs to find new material to blog about. Anyone with half a brain already knows what happened in the last two elections. He has repeated this same information over and over again, I guess like the rest of R.T. things are getting stale on the info plain. This is getting as bad as CNN and their constant repeating of old news stories. I guess when you job depends on stirring things up among the "nit wits", any news is better than no news....

Fingers's picture
Fingers 11 years 22 weeks ago

Of course we know Republicans cheated in 2010... When will democrats fight back..... President Obamas biggest mistake IMO once he won election was not investigation the Bush administration over Iraq and holding them responsible.....the Republicans would impeach president Obama for jaywalking if they could....

Global's picture
Global 11 years 22 weeks ago

Yes ken, if you noticed Thom gets his talking points from media matters, think progress, move on, and the Obama administration propaganda machine. They are now focused on the second amendment and how to destroy it. As Thom was trying to connect it with slavery and of course racist. Now you see other drones out there making reference to NRA members as being racist. Playing the race card at every opportunity to push the control agenda. It is pretty sad when it is so obvious and in your face. We are being constantly barraged with the propaganda. I will give it to them that they are very very good at it. I just hope I am not the only concerned citizen out here that is wise to their ways. Too bad Thom is also a pawn in their movement.

Neil_Kramer's picture
Neil_Kramer 11 years 22 weeks ago

Hi Thom,

I live in California. A couple years ago, a ballot mesaure was passed chaning the way legislative boundaries are drawn in the State. Now a panel of retired judges appoint a commission to draw the disrtict lines for congressional and state districts (State Assembly and State Senate). I've suggested to my friends in Michigan, although I know it's another 8 years to the next census, that they try to begin the discussion of getting a similar measure on the Michigan ballot. As I listened to Brunch with Bernie this afternoon, I caller asked him what could be done about gerrymandering. This could be one suggestion? Hope this helps. Thanks for all that you do!

PensiveLiberal's picture
PensiveLiberal 11 years 22 weeks ago

In the first hour today, one of the questions to Bernie Sanders was what we can do to prevent Republican gerrymandering to take control of presidential elections in the future. Bernie failed to have any real suggestions.

However, one thing we can do is to get behind the National Popular vote effort. If that were to become effective, Republican gerrymandering could have no effect on presidential elections.

historywriter's picture
historywriter 11 years 22 weeks ago

Thom repeats this information over and over because it's still a problem and needs to be fixed. Sorry if we're boring you. Jus tdon't read it.

klentz's picture
klentz 11 years 22 weeks ago

Someone at the federal level needs to pass a law requiring districts to be defined with only straight lines and limiting the number of edges to 6. Within a given state, the number of registered voters in any given congressional district must be within +/- 10% of any other district. End of gerrymandering.

akunard's picture
akunard 11 years 22 weeks ago

Let us not forget all the counties where Obama got from 98 to 100% of the vote!

David Abbot's picture
David Abbot 11 years 22 weeks ago

Well, it's a time-honored tradition among sociopaths. First, claim a Divine Mandate: "God told me to hurt you people." If that doesn't work, claim a popular mandate: "Everyone wants me to hurt you people." And if that doesn't work, what the hell, rip a page out of Dick Cheney's book: "I am hurting you people because I can, and in fact I think I'll brag about it."

And when that doesn't work, just do what Global says: go with the talking points supplied by Rupert Murdoch. I mean sure, Murdoch owns a lot of American media for a foreigner, but there's nothing wrong with someone getting all of their talking points and all of their news from a foreigner.

Global, if you had studied a tenth the actual American historical data that Thom has studied- and which he quotes from time to time so you could look them up when you're not busy quoting that foreign guy Murdoch- you might be qualified to debate Thom on politics. But what the hey, this is America, you don't have to be a patriot; you are free to swear allegiance to some foreign guy.

You wanta prove your point about the second amendment? Here's an idea: READ the second amendment, and then, to prove that you at least know where to find it, post it here on Thom's blog and show us where it proves your points. Unless, of course, you're too busy obeying that foreigner.

Since you opened a door by criticizing Thom's motivation, I'll walk through that door. I probably shouldn't, but I will. I knew Thom in the late 1960's. I didn't spend a lot of time with him, but I noticed that every time I saw him, he was talking about things he was researching, and he always knew much more about those things than any of the rest of us. He was always fascinated with life and very proactive, moving strongly on the cutting edge of our group of friends. Then he began really outpacing the rest of us. It was like his hsin (Chinese for heart-mind) sprouted wings and he just took off. He was fairly young when he started a live-in facility for disadvantaged children, helping them grow up to be healthy, happy adults. In various places there are lists of some of his other accomplishments.

So Global, not that Thom needs me to defend him, but so I can better understand your qualifications for calling him a drone and a pawn, perhaps you would favor me with a list of the subjects you have studied and the services you have provided for humanity.

And let's make it interesting: if you prove that you have done even a tenth the good for humanity that Thom has done, I will eat a bug. And then I will join the republican party, become a pistol-packing, foaming-at-the-mouth lifetime member of the NRA, and listen to that foreign guy Rupert Murdoch's Fox News every day. But if you do not prove it, you have to volunteer for five hours at a homeless shelter and then post your experience there, on this blog. What do you say?

Ok, now you can call me a drone and a pawn. At least I'll be in good company. And you'll be with that foreign guy.

PhilipHenderson's picture
PhilipHenderson 11 years 22 weeks ago

The Republican Party is behaving as though it is a domestic terrorist organization. They believe that all is fair in love, war, and politics. My Republican friends believe that they are right all of the time and that every idea from a Democrat is bad. My Republican friends believe they have the only right answers and that Democrats need them otherwise we would self destruct. Their beliefs about religion, abortion, guns, and their fear of educated people is the basis of their position that only they know what it is that God wants them to do. My Republican friends say that America is a Christian nation. We should have lawss that follow the Christian Bible. We should abolish abortion because it is against Christian faith. We should encourage citizens to arm themselves to provide protection agains a tyrannical government. I listen to them and wonder how such otherwise intelligent people could have these crazy ideas. Mitt Romney's comment that 47% of the American people are sucking off the government is what manyof my Republican freinds believe to be true. The irony is that a huge number of people who fit Romney's idea of being among the 47% are registered Republicans. He included those men and women who serve in the Armed Services. He included those men and women who have retired. Of course, he included the high income people who pay little or no taxes because they have successfully lobbied the government to give them loopholes. He also included millions of Americans who work hard every day but at wages so low they can barely feed themselves, and thus pay no taxes. What a loser Mitt Romney is! We are fortunate to have awakened in time to re-elect Barack Obama. Obama is not perfect however he is a warm, intelligent, caring, and wise man. He will lead us to prosperity.

David Abbot's picture
David Abbot 11 years 22 weeks ago

I agree with PhillipHenderson.

In fact, I would say that the Republican Party IS a domestic terrorist organization. I mean, they want to harm women, children, working people, and poor people. Who's left? Who don't they want to harm? They don't want to harm 1% of the America population: the extremely rich. But you know, any country can get along very well without its extremely rich citizens, because extremely rich people do not really contribute anything to a country. But no country can get along without women, children, working people, and poor people. The only logical conclusion that can be drawn is that the republican party is a domestic terrorist organization.

I'm thinking, Guantanimo summercamp for them, with plenty of nice waterboarding! Or maybe just guano, because the republican totem animal is bat_____.

ken ware's picture
ken ware 11 years 22 weeks ago

Global - Sorry to burst your bubble, but my complaint was I have heard this over and over again. The Information Hartmann passes on is not a tool of the left, actually he is one of the few people that I believe has real character and an honorable commentator. You want to hear B.S. listen to Fox entertainment channel, MSNBC or Limbaugh! As far as the 2nd. Amendment goes I think you Republicans and conservatives are full of B.S. The Republicans are not concerned with our rights, their main concern is the rights of the Gun Corporations to continue to spread fear that everyone needs to be well armed, while pulling in billions in cash. I have nothing against owning a handgun or shot gun. I believe thinking that limiting the clip capacity is a Red Herring to get us off the real point of why do we need assault weapons with enough velocity to travel over one mile and still retain their kill power! The civilians that talk about defending themselves against the Government if they tried to become some type of dictatorship are a friggin joke. Our military is not the Syrian Army; it would take just a matter of days for our military to take over every major city in America! So if you’re depending on your AR-15 or any other assault weapon to keep you free, you really have a screw loose. I just didn't want to leave the impression I agreed with you or any other conservative who comments on this blog.

ken ware's picture
ken ware 11 years 22 weeks ago

Alice - I hate to sound sexist but your reply is based primarily on you feel good female hormones and bitch response mechanism. The troops that served under the Commander in Chief were sent there not to protect America, but to stop further aggression from the Communist in China. You actually have no understanding of history. Are you so naive to believe the N. Koreans chose to live under a dictator? If you think the threat of nuclear war was all hype, you really have a limited knowledge of HISTORY. We came to the point of nuclear war when Russia moved ballistic missiles into Cuba in Oct. of 1962.With missiles in Cuba they had a strategic advantage concerning the time it took to launch and strike American cities. The reason they felt compelled to try this is that we had nukes in Europe and we could strike them with nukes and the retaliation time was limited with their nukes on Russian soil. The Nation and the Military were on full alert, but you would have to have an interest of what happened during that time. The Russians believed we would launch a full scale attack against the Mother Land in Russia, since we were the only country to use nukes against the Japanese in 1945. I cannot believe someone with you attitude actually survived the 60's, I really consider the source when I hear your rants. My point was the Military over the decades has kept this country free of foreign invasion, not that our involvement in Vietnam was crucial to our national defense. But, at the time as I have stated the President and his advisors felt losing Vietnam to the Communist could start a domino effect where they might invade other South East Asian countries if Vietnam fell and they had a chance to spread their religion of Communism. Only someone with limited knowledge of the history and of the military and our history as a nation would vent the crap you have spewed on this blog. The men and women who served in the Second World War kept this nation free from dictatorship. But the way you talk you think we are under some dictatorship from our own government. The brave men and women who served in Korea and Vietnam did so under the direction of the Commander in Chief, our president, your opinion of the troops who served in these conflicts is valid, but your account of history and the way you present your opinion is laughable. I do not gratification from people like you, I know I served my country when it called me to duty and that is all the satisfaction and gratification I or others that served in Vietnam need. (3,000,000 American men and women served in Vietnam over an eleven year period) You sound like an aged "hippy activist" from the 1960's as far as I am concerned. The main reason I even bothered to rebut the opinions of others concerning Vietnam, is that you and Abbot stated incorrect information with a lack of knowledge or purposely lied for attention or what other reason you may have had. If you’re going to make comments about something the least you can do is get the facts straight to validate your opinion.

Abbot: Your statement that black Huey's, UH-1 were the primary helicopter used in Asia, flew over the enemy and were not fired on from the N. Vietnamese. The N. Vietnamese fired on any American style helicopter they saw, even the choppers with red crosses on them indicating they were transporting the wounded. The Vietnamese never signed the Geneva Doctrine of War, prohibiting combat troops from firing on Med. aircraft; neither did the N. Korean's. When the CIA used any type of aircraft in Vietnam they used company’s setup to hide their involvement, like Air America to name one. Black Ops Helicopters that were actually painted black did not come into action until the late 1980's. So the information that these Vets saw black choppers fly over and were not shot at seems more like one of those stories where she said, he said, she said situations where stories change from one person to

David Abbot's picture
David Abbot 11 years 22 weeks ago

Ok, so when you say something, it's not he said she said. But when I say something it is he said she said. I get it.

You're the one who said cia. I didn't say that. And you're the one who identified the birds.

Global's picture
Global 11 years 22 weeks ago

Sorry ken, but Thom IS a tool of the left. He follows lock step with the propaganda message. Just pay attention to the Obama agenda and on the media issues -- they all rally to the cause. He plays the race card all the time and that has been the primary strategy for the last four years and it is pathetic but effective.

DAnneMarc's picture
DAnneMarc 11 years 22 weeks ago

Thank you, Ken!

Old Blue 11 years 22 weeks ago

Hey Ken,

Is that your biplane in the photo? And is it true that you flew that thing in Nam and shot down 18 Migs? Jesus Ken, I stand in absolute awe! Sieg Heil!

Old Blue 11 years 22 weeks ago

2950, Don't you think that our beloved Democratic Party is just a teeny bit complicit in advancing the interests of the uber-rich? Think "Blue Dog Democrat" for starters ....

2950-10K's picture
2950-10K 11 years 22 weeks ago

The Republican Party may be good at gerrymandering and stealing elections, but just how good are they at controlling the Teafrankenstein problem that aint going away?

Because they're getting nervous, the Kochs/AFP, the Chamber of Commerce, and a few financial big heads have recently given Cantor orders to hit the kill switch on ole Frankie for the next three months, this regarding the debt-ceiling hostage strategy.

The Kochs at some point are going to lose control of the monster they've helped create. This will happen when Tea Party members start to decipher the populist lies behind the Tea Party movement. There's the one about shrinking Govt., which is the rich man's code for deregulation so he can pollute and poison for profit, commit unimpeded financial frauds against the middle class, with the Social Security Trust Fund being the last thing worth stealing. Remember Paul Ryan's road map to hell, privatize Social Security by creating personal accounts with stocks and bonds?

Then there's the one about cutting the rich man's tax rates to create jobs, which really means cut off revenue to a point where austerity politics becomes possible, a point at which union busting and economic desperation creates a feudal like shift away from progressive prosperity and secures the tyrannical power of big money.

It won't be the Democratic Party the Teafrankenstein monster is about to destroy and in my opinion there isn't a damn thing the Kochs or Cantor can do to stop it!'s picture 11 years 22 weeks ago

Excellent idea. Contact your representatives - anyone who'll listen. Start a petition. Spread the word!

2950-10K's picture
2950-10K 11 years 22 weeks ago

I'm a Socialist leaning Independent Old Blue, but I still see a clear difference between the Democrats and Teapublicans. Check the congressional voting records and you will see what I mean. However I do agree that big money has purchased a vast chunk of what we call Democracy. To be honest, I look at it this way, Fox doesn't need any of our help bashing the Democrats, and I damn well refuse to give them any of mine.

Aliceinwonderland's picture
Aliceinwonderland 11 years 21 weeks ago

David- your letter to Global (the one about Thom) had me doubled over 'til my sides ached and cracking up so hard, I almost wet my drawers. And I'm thinking: this old hippie gal better start wearing "Depends" when she reads your entries, because... (switching to "first person"...) I've gotta lotta laughing to do!! (Get it?) - Alice I.W.

Palindromedary's picture
Palindromedary 11 years 21 weeks ago
Quote ken ware: "Our military is not the Syrian Army; it would take just a matter of days for our military to take over every major city in America!"

And it's taken over 10 years and our military are still dodging bullets in Afghanistan. We are finally retreating. Maybe! When you can't "win hearts and minds" by murdering their families after 10 years I doubt any military assault upon American families will "win hearts and minds" either. Street to street combat is the toughest and most dangerous war for any military to fight. When you can't tell the combatants from the non-combatants the military ends up killing a lot of non-combatants.

Nope, if our politicians ever made the mistake of sending out troops against their own families in the streets of America killing a lot of innocent civilians like they do in other countries...they'd eventually loose...just like they lost in Vietnam and are now losing in the Middle East. They are just struggling with the propaganda that it wasn't a defeat...just like in Vietnam...but we WERE defeated in Vietnam. And now we are being defeated in the Middle East...they are now moving to easier targets in Africa. We'd never go after N.Korea or China. If the US went to war with China, they'd have to get a loan from China to do it....and use high tech weapons that are made in China.

Why do you think our government is so cowed by all those Tea baggers with guns...and various militia all over the country? If you don't think the government has been cowed, both the Republicans and the Democrats, just look at how they managed to change the Republican party and even kept the Democrat party from acting like Democrats. Look at how ineffective and wimpy Obama has been...until the gun issue broke out. After all, these shootings have a lot of Americans upset and Obama will play on that for all he can. And he is really ticking off gun owners. I suspect that Democrats will be the likely targets of these people. And I suspect the Republicans won't mind a bit.

The Republican party doesn't dare come out strong on gun control because they know, along with all the money they get from NRA lobby groups, that there are an awful lot of gun owners in America. As long as they play up their support for gun is likely that the really radical gun owners, militia, will not have evil thoughts about the Republicans..the Democrats will get all the flack.

The government/military are good at picking on small groups or individuals but not so good at picking on people that are willing to fight insurgents that just keep coming and coming (over 10 years now). Sure they have a lot of high tech sophisticated weapons...and they may not hesitate in using them against small groups of people...but if the whole nation was fighting street to street, door to door combat...we don't even have the manpower in police or military to handle a massive armed rebellion. The police can't even handle many police matters now because of the cut backs. All the government can do is create propaganda like a billion rounds of hollow point ammo going to certain government agencies. They are trying to scare people out of getting ideas of rebellious nature. And how many US soldiers will stand for going to war against their own country? Especially when many of them see what slime-buckets their politicians are...I'd bet a lot would go awol...go to Canada or Mexico if they were turned on the American people. It wouldn't take long for those slime-buckets to fall.

I hope it never happens but if it will most likely happen all over the US fairly simultaneously by many thousands in many cities which will overwhelm the government's current ability to stop it. And that is just the scenario that the government is worried about...which is why they are trying so hard to get everyone to give up their weapons. Once the government succeeds at that they have no obstacle in their way of completely oppressing us all. ☮ ☮ ☮ ☯

Aliceinwonderland's picture
Aliceinwonderland 11 years 21 weeks ago

I must be experiencing deja vu! Haven't I read this silly tirade and responded already?

Let's not be redundant now, Mr. Ware. Once dose of that was more than enough. But hey- on the other hand if more people read this, your fan base shall expand exponentially out here in Blog Land. Everyone gets to see what kinda class act one should expect of Ken Ware in any debate. Never mind the identity of the opponent, be it a man of his approximate height & weight or a woman half his size. Equal opportunity for all to become targets of verbal abuse, from a very angry man.

Anyway it's been interesting, but I really must go. More fish to fry. Cheers. - Alice

JLC's picture
JLC 11 years 21 weeks ago

I second what David says. David knew Thom personally so can speak in a way the rest of us can't But for the rest of us, I think all you have to do is read "The Last Hours of Ancient Sunlight" and "The Phrophet's Way" to know where Thom is coming from and what kind of man he is. Having read those books, I hold Thom's views on all things in even higher regard and with high respect. I highly recommend those books to everyone (they are not political books). Someone called in the other day and mentioned Herr Mueller, the subject of "The Phrophet's Way". I wish Thom would talk about him more often on the air and talk more in general about the big-picture "spiritual" (for lack of a better word) issues facing our world today.

Old Blue 11 years 21 weeks ago

Palindromidary: You're spot on as usual. I agree completely that the US military would be of no use here in putting down a general insurgency, for the same reason that the old USSR had to use elements from their very ethnically diverse population from one region to put down trouble in another. The Chinese do the same thing today. But the USA is so homogenous (with the possible exception of a few counties in the deep south;-) that few in the military would participate once it reached a certain level. What would they do, drop a nuke on Phoenix, AZ? As for giving up our guns, we'll be in a world of hurt the day that happens. I believe that the Framers added the Second Amendment as the ultimate "check" in the check and balance system. When one considers what our government has been willing to do elsewhere in the name of "keeping the world safe for democracy", it takes little imagination to envision what could happen at home, absent an armed citizenry. And the fact that the US population is so heavily armed is the best insurance policy we have against that outcome. Like you, I hope it never comes to armed insurrection here. I'm a progressive and some would describe me as a bleeding heart Liberal, but on this one issue I'm very conservative.

Kend's picture
Kend 11 years 21 weeks ago

I can't help but notice how good the democrats and your President are at defecting the real problems of the United States. The economy, debt and the deficit. Thom and all the other progressives went on and on about a fair tax on the rich and now that you have your tax increase I am astounded that all your problems are not solved. The fact is you spent 5 years on it, President Obama got elected on it, and it didn't change a thing As I said over and over. So now it's guns I think we all know that these new executive orders are going to do little or nothing but a great job of deflecting the real failures of this current government putting people back to work. Sorry to remind you but you are 16.5 trillion in debt about $52,000 a person and your government doesn't even talk about It. I just don't understand why you don't seem to care or even talk about it on the left. I deal internationally and with all due respect the world is starting to look at the US like the neighbor who bought a new boat, RV, Pool, hot tub, caddy, and he only makes 32,000 a year and we are wondering how you are going to pay for it. Doesn't this worry you guys?

George Reiter's picture
George Reiter 11 years 21 weeks ago

To be a Republican today, one must be Rich, Cruel, or Politically Ignorant, and they are not mutually exclusive.

ken ware's picture
ken ware 11 years 21 weeks ago

Kend - Why don't you write the President a letter, I am sure he is not aware of the fiscal problems here and all around the World, thanks to a Republican President, Mr. Bush who allowed the Banksters on Wall St. to destroy economies around the World. You’re so concerned with putting down those terrible Democrats why not get a dual citizenship so you can vote and help the Republicans to continue to kill off the Middle Class and the Poor. You never seem to mention how Bush helped get us here with 2 wars and his help to crash the banks by changing the regulations that allowed these people to sell illegal derivatives and debt swaps that helped to destroy economies everywhere while making billions illegally! You conservatives remind me of people who stand around complaining about the Fire Dept. while they are trying to put out a three alarm fire, and when the fire is extinguished and Firemen and Women almost lose their lives, you complain about the damage and how they could have done a better job! So typical of the conservatives in every country!

ken ware's picture
ken ware 11 years 21 weeks ago

ALICE - My comments to you that I posted on this blog concerning your comments you made yesterday are no viler than the words you felt you had to use. If you are going to use distasteful remarks about someone you will get the same kind of response. Before you take the high and mighty moral stance about verbal abuse I suggest you and anyone who reads this stuff take a second read on your remarks from the 17th. You can use verbal abuse but when it is returned to you in the same, you start crying verbal abuse! And, there is a reason why women are not placed in direct combat roles in our military. You have made my point, about women and men being different from their hormones that produce different results in nature. As we evolved nature made the male species of every kind of animal and insect to be larger, more muscular and more aggressive. Except for certain species like the Black Widow who eats the male after mating! If you do not like that, start taking male hormones and you can have the same characteristics as a man and you will be more aggressive. Younger men are stronger with more muscle mass and more aggressive than older men because with age animals produce less hormones, which is nature’s decision in how we are composed not mine. Also as we evolved nature made the males larger, stronger and more aggressive to defeat any threats and to pass on the genes to the animal who won the "battle" to mate. You have a computer look it up on Google under difference in the male and female species!

As far as being angry, when it comes to someone who knows very little about a war, that I and millions of Americans took part in and you use remarks to basically diminish what they did as comrades in arms, your damn right I will get angry and respond in a forceful manner. About being an aged "Hippie", your remarks sound as if you were a left winger marching and spitting on our men and women when they were lucky enough to have made it home.

Old Blue - the aircraft that you remarked about is a bi-plane that is located at our local airport in S. Call. As far as being a smart ass about what I flew in Vietnam, you probably were one of those guys who sat on their ass during this time period while others served. My new picture is an A-1 Skyraider which was used to give cover to ground personnel when they were rescued from a downed aircraft or a revac of troops being overrun. Of course you would know nothing about what happened there, would you!

Abbot - You implied it was a military helicopter that was flying heroin for cash. ALL military aircraft in Vietnam were painted in our colors to eliminate friendly fire bringing one down and killing American men and women. The North Vietnamese Air Force flew Russian aircraft, totally different from ours. To remark it was not fired upon by the N. Vietnamese implies it was an American aircraft. That was my point in my comments.

Anyone else have any more questions about our troops and military engagements during that time period, or does anyone have any more remarks to put down our military and how they served this country?

ken ware's picture
ken ware 11 years 21 weeks ago

Old Blue - I wish I had the same faith in the fat and over aged Americans you say could stop the Greatest Current Military mankind has known in modern history. Of course I am not a Arm Chair Warrior with all the experience of watching the news channels to get my info, so I am sure you guys know better, when it comes to non-trained Americans,(hell, most of you have never been in the military or fired assault weapons) fighting in combat situations. You guys talk big, when there is no action going on, I am not so sure you would stand up against the people we are fighting to stop terrorism around the world. But there is one comforting thought; the wealthy would never allow the Government destroy what they own, which is America!

Kend's picture
Kend 11 years 21 weeks ago

I am sorry I thought it was Obama that sent 30,000 troops to Afganistan. If you want a strong middle class create a good economy. Bush has been gone for over over four years and 6.5 trillion dollars ago. I am just saying isn't time you start blaming the new guy. can any one name one thing Obama has done to improve the economy.

Palindromedary's picture
Palindromedary 11 years 21 weeks ago
Quote Old Blue: "When one considers what our government has been willing to do elsewhere in the name of "keeping the world safe for democracy", it takes little imagination to envision what could happen at home, absent an armed citizenry. And the fact that the US population is so heavily armed is the best insurance policy we have against that outcome."

Excellent point, Old Blue!

Palindromedary's picture
Palindromedary 11 years 21 weeks ago

I'm just glad that people like Julian and Ethel Rosenburg, and others, if they really did hand over nuclear secrets to the Russians, did what they may have done because had they not, the US would have bombed the rest of the world with nukes. And I don't really think that the US had any cold, hard evidence that the Rosenburgs gave nuke secrets to the Russians...but they were executed for it anyway.

Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD) kept us from prematurely ending the world through a nuclear holocaust. We had some close calls but had the US been the only ones with the nukes, many arrogant slime-buckets would have had no hesitation in using them. I believe that having a MAD program of our own to keep those slime-buckets from thinking they can get away with turning all lower class Americans into subservient slaves with no freedoms or liberties is quite necessary. I am not advocating the we citizens have nukes...just that we are well armed and that would present a really big problem for anyone trying to move against the American people. Even bullies will back off if the people they bully are well armed.

Aliceinwonderland's picture
Aliceinwonderland 11 years 21 weeks ago

Oh well, not everyone has to love me. Tsk.

Old Blue 11 years 21 weeks ago

Ken - So happens I am a Viet Nam era veteran. I wasn't called upon to serve in that theater, happily, as my AFSC was Ground Radio Operator and I probably wouldn't be writing this now if I had been. Ken, you should lighten up a little. Not everyone who shows up here with a critical word about our government's policies is a fat peacenik, commie or a coward. Quite the contrary. Sometimes it takes more courage to speak up for what you believe is right than to simply tow the party line.

Annabee1 11 years 21 weeks ago

Ken is from idiotville! He has watched and sucked on Fox News far too long to have any coherent form of discourse! Certainly--he's as out to lunch as the Fox News anchors are as he's got his facts totally twisted!

Annabee1 11 years 21 weeks ago

Agreed--Ken is a Fox News junkie high on alcohol and prescriptive drugs that are NOT to be taken with alcohol--poor man--he's lost his bearings (if he ever had any??)

ken ware's picture
ken ware 11 years 21 weeks ago

When it comes to the military and its personnel I simply cannot react in a calm manner if I think someone with the wrong facts is making comments that shed any light of dishonor upon them. Soldiers like Lt. Calley and the men under his command that killed innocent villagers because Viet Cong (V.C.) had attacked their unit and killed some of their men should have spent the rest of their natural lives in a Military Prison. I feel that any Airman, Army, Marine or Naval personnel that cross the line should be dealt with in a severe manner. I realize crimes were committed in the heat of battle on both sides and in every war since and before Vietnam. But nothing is perfect and especially when it hits the fan and your survival instincts take control. WAR should be the last resort of any nation, but when necessary we should use everything in our arsenal to defeat any threat be it military or civilian. I do not think it is acceptable to say civilian deaths happen and that is just the price of destroying the threat. We do not live in a perfect world and the enemy takes various forms and represents different levels of threat to our nation and military. Bottom line in my mind is we are not the only nation that is constantly preparing for war. China, Russia, Europe and various Middle East countries are doing the same as we are and that is too make sure if war is inevitable, we are the victors in the end. If that makes me a war monger so be it. Personally, if I had the chance to be 22 again I would spend the next 20 to 30 years in the military. The main problem with our leadership is that they have never tasted war or the horrors that go with it. That includes the Bush administration (Bush actually refused to show up as an Air Force officer and should have been court martialed, (but daddy Bush was at some point the head of the C.I.A. and a decorated Pilot in WWll) and the Obama administration, and unfortunately it almost seems like a game to them. So if I sound hard core about the military, that is just who I am. No I will no lighten up if you attack veterans who were following the orders they swore to obey and the does not include killing of unarmed civilians that are not a present and clear threat.

Many of you that comment sound like you have bought into the propaganda that Oliver Stone the left wing director and producer of documentary’s and movies that show the U.S. and it's Military as some evil entity that is out to destroy the rest of civilization and we should be ashamed of ourselves. He is free to take that stance because the people he sees as the enemy fought to give him the right to say what he chooses. Even after WWll our military keep other countries from thinking they might be able to defeat Democracy and replace it with Communism. Try saying what you want in Russia or China 20 years ago and you would find yourself in a relocation center (armed camp) to be re-educated. This happened to the S. Vietnamese, Cambodians and Laotians in Southeast Asia after 1975 and the fall of Saigon. Read it for yourself and you can Google all of this from your computer.

Palindromdary - No one can know for sure if the Rosenberg’s were part of the spy ring that gave the technical information that allowed the Russians to develop the A-Bomb a few years earlier than they would have. I tend to believe the government and the F.B.I. were correct. As far as it being a good thing, I disagree with you. Your hypothesis is that if the enemy has the same weapon that can destroy your country that is a good thing, because it will stop us from doing the wrong thing. That pre- supposes that we would attack other enemies with the same Nuclear Weapon. You do understand don't you that President Truman tried to do everything possible to not to have to drop the two weapons on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. They were notified in every venue possible about the consequences of not surrendering. They were told we had developed a weapon that could destroy a city. We had fought them on Iwo Jima and several other outer islands and they were determined to die before giving up and they actually had their families that were with them commit suicide before allowing them to be captured. The Emperor of Japan was seen as the manifestation of God and would follow his orders to the death. It was estimated we would lose 100,000 to a 1,000,000 men trying to defeat the island nation of Japan. Everyone single person, man, woman and child swore to defend the Emperor to the death. After we dropped the first bomb on Hiroshima we ask them to surrender, the Imperial Military Command representing the Emperor refused. We dropped a second weapon and after three days they surrendered. It was terrible that we had to drop those weapons on those cities. But, the loss of life for the Japanese people was far fewer than it would have been if we would have had to invade the country and then defeated the population. Those were the two choices we had. And whether you know it or not the Nazi regime under Hitler was very close to coming up with a nuclear device from their Heavy Water projects. And they would have used it on everyone to retain power. We rebuilt Japan and installed a democratic government and helped rebuild the whole country. We did the same for Germany after defeating Axis powers of Germany, Italy and Japan.

The point I am trying to make is that just because we had the power after the war does not mean we would use it again in a land battle. We could have destroyed the North Korean forces that over ran the sovereign country of South Korea with the help of the Red Chinese Army. N.A.T.O. forces came very close to being destroyed in Korea, and President Truman did not consider using nukes. At that time in 1951 Russia was not seen as a threat if we used a nuke and China had no nuclear devises. Point being that M.A.D. was not a threat at that time and we still would not use a nuclear device to stop the Communist forces from destroy S. Korea and the N.A.T.O. troops. In my opinion giving the technical information to Russia just helped an enemy to develop a weapon that could destroy our country. I could go on for hours pointing out why the Rosenberg’s helped to develop a policy of M.A.D. was not beneficial to American, then or now. You have your opinion and I respect that and I have mine. Hopefully we will never have to see who is right on this question. Sorry for carrying on slow long on this comment. As a military history major and a collection of 800 hours of tapes and DVD’s pertaining to Wars and the Aircraft that were involved, I get carried away at times. Hell I doubt if anyone will even take the time to read this comment it is so long!!

ken ware's picture
ken ware 11 years 21 weeks ago

Old Blue - Since you mentioned your AFSC was a Ground Radio Operator, you must have been in the Air Force around 1965 or 1967. We served in the same branch. I went in, in 1970 out of college. If you were in the Air Force, you had a pretty good chance of coming home. It was the Marines and grunts in the Army that ate most of the dirt, although we had our share of K.I.A.. Glad to know a fellow Air Force Man.

ken ware's picture
ken ware 11 years 21 weeks ago

So Sorry Girls - I never watch Fox entertainment Channel or MSNBC the left wing channel! As a matter of fact I watch P.B.S. and a little R.T. the commie channel and C.N.N. the channel that use to have integrity. I am not a left winger Dem or a right winger Repub., I voted for the Independent candidate. I knew she would not win, but I had enough self-respect not to vote for Obama the liar or Rummey Romney the candidate of the billionaires. Sorry to disappoint you. I do not adhere to either party; they are the same party with different names! Have a good one, ladies.

Palindromedary's picture
Palindromedary 11 years 21 weeks ago

ken ware: Actually, I did enjoy reading your comment because I am also very interested in history and we don't disagree on many of your points.

Kend's picture
Kend 11 years 21 weeks ago

Ken we don't agree on much but I do agree with you here. All elected officials become crooks. Easy money I guess. It seems the bigger the debt the wealthier they get, both right and left. I have mentioned before when it comes to newhew hen I go down there it seems MSNBC and Fox are talking about two different countries.

Old Blue 11 years 21 weeks ago

Ken Ware - Yes, 1966-1969. As you know, ground radio operators were used as "forward air controllers" and didn't do quite as well as some of the Air Force guys, so I always figured I dodged a bullet. Some of my unit was sent to Korea, some to Nam, but my time was so short at that point I got to stay stateside and run phone patches at McChord. Another point in common, I voted for the "other independent", Rocky Anderson, rather than voting for Obama again, as he turned out to be a total traitor to many from day one (please don't get me started on that). And finally, with your obvious interest in aviation I would be willing to bet you're a pilot, as was I, though no longer active. So I guess this is a good example of how decent people with much in common can disagree. Sorry for my snyde remark earlier. I sometimes have the bad habit of getting a little snarky on these blogs. Peace, bro ;-)

Old Blue 11 years 21 weeks ago

Ken Ware - As a P.S., I read your comments and found them interesting, though I agree with Palindromedary that MAD stabilized the world for a time. I shudder to think what the U.S.'s Military Industrial Political Complex would be doing in the world right now if we were the only nuclear power on the planet. You may find this a very unpatriotic thing to say, but I'm not a subversive agent. As a friend of mine used to say (he may have been quoting someone else) "I love my country; I fear my government". The record speaks for itself if a person reads it with an open mind and then looks at the mounting body of evidence. As an historian I'm sure you're widely read. "A People's History of the United States...." by Howard Zinn, mentioned here before, Is a good foundation for understanding that alternate history - the one that was carefully edited for our high school and undergrad texts. But with a narrower focus on a more recent time, the post cold war era, there are three excellent books by Chalmers Johnson known as the "Blowback Trilogy". If you haven't read them, you should, to get a taste of the other side of the story. Those three books are "Blowback", "The Sorrows of Empire", and "Nemesis". Here's a link to the first of the three on Amazon's Web site:

DAnneMarc's picture
DAnneMarc 11 years 21 weeks ago

Same here Alice! That part about eating a bug if Global can offer any evidence of charity has me still chuckling while typing this. I suspect I might be laughing about that one well into next weeks blogs. LOL Thanks David!

DAnneMarc's picture
DAnneMarc 11 years 21 weeks ago

Well Kend,

Lets see! Can I name one thing President Obama has done to improve the economy?

Well, he saved the Auto Industry which preserved one major export from being completely shut down. He sought and obtained funding for repairs, maintenance and expansion of our infrastructure putting thousands of Americans back to work and improving our transportation system. He extended unemployment benefits for victims of layoffs so they could continue consuming goods. And finally, he sought to obtain extensions on home mortgages for victims of foreclosures so that they could stay in their homes and not have them seized by the banks; which, in turn prevented the homes from falling into disrepair and jeopardizing the property values of all the other homes in the area.

Has he done anything? You bet he has. Your head must be stuck in a hole somewhere... Oh that's right, you live in Canada. That explains it.

DAnneMarc's picture
DAnneMarc 11 years 21 weeks ago

My apologies to Canada. My mother's family is from there and I should know better. Go Canucks! On the other hand Kend, maybe its your diet that is causing your myopia. David had a great idea, perhaps you should try eating a bug. It worked for John the Baptist. Maybe it might help you.

DAnneMarc's picture
DAnneMarc 11 years 21 weeks ago

Please stop calling us "Girls". Calling me a girl is an insult to girls everywhere. Some of us guys like girls.

That said, I agree with you Ken 100% about watching propaganda on television. I learned long ago that it does no good to the body or the soul to expose it to biased news commentary. I too prefer PBS to any other source of news; with the exception of Comedy Central. I find The Colbert Report and The Daily Show to be an excellent source of news. Not only does it spoon feed the sour medicine with a hardy helping of sugar to make it go down easier, but it offers entertaining and completely accurate satire that places the stories in a humane and kind perspective.

Remember, the best medicine is laughter!

PS You're new Avatar is bigger, meaner, and scarier than the previous one; yet, is still on that collision course with Palindromedary's. Coincidence?

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