We finally have common ground with North Korea. We are both going to have a militarized Southern border with long walls to keep out those we fear!

The recent mention of the Borda count in the newsletter made me come up with something: http://www.thomhartmann.com/users/mathboy/blog/2013/06/reverse-instant-runoff-voting

Instead of $40 billion on the border, spend $1 billion on e-verify and arrest a couple dozen employers. When the jobs stop, the undocumented traffic goes southward at almost no expense to the taxpayer. We will never seal the border no matter how much we spend. Get a fourteen foot ladder or a bulldozer to bend a few pylons. I would prefer an improved version of the Bracero program (1942 - '64) so the workers can go back and forth to keep up family relationships and they don't have to take up residence here to keep sending money back home.

As Ronald Reagan said, "Tear down this wall".

Quote bobcox:As Ronald Reagan said, "Tear down this wall".

Yeah! Yeah! Ronald Wilson Reagan (666=The Number of The Name of The Beast) also said, "Government is the problem!" Maybe he was right then, too? Even a broken clock is right two times a day.

Where oh where has my Palindromedary gone? Oh, where, oh, where can he be? You too, Ken Ware. How about MMmmNACHOS, David Abott, Outback, Historywriter, Vegasman56, and 2450-10K? How about anyone else? Come on, I'm most interested as to how you all stand on this most controversial issue. Do you too agree or disagree with mua? ...and why?

The amount that will be spent on border security is outrageous. Not necessary. The path to citizenship is way too long & the requirement that a person can't be out of work longer than 60 days in a 10 year period is unrealistic. The Dreamers will be o.k. but the deal is a bad one. Schumer offerred way too much at the beginning & left to room for a decent compromise.

Was it a bird? A Plane? Superman? Max Keiser knows....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICqqoPTO3nU

Barb Njos ~ I agree! $40 Billion is a lot of money. However, our border is hemorrhaging, and any amount of money spent to stop the bleeding is money well spent. A "path to citizenship?" For law abiding illegals this may work out just fine. For law breaking irresponsible welfare cheats a "path to citizenship" is a crime and an insult to American citizens. Whatever the procedure is involved to seek a legal citizen status we should know by now that two wrongs do not make a right. We should also know the law of supply and demand. If we increase our legal labor market we will drive down wages, benefits, and tolerable working conditions; also, we will increase poverty, unemployment, and the burden on welfare.

It is intolerable that the American people should be intentionally subjected to further labor difficulties, competition, and unemployment when the real causes of these issues goes unaddressed. NAFTA and free trade are behind all our economic woes in this country; yet, our government only acts to worsen these conditions. This immigration bill's intent has nothing to do with any compassionate desire to help poor foreign illegal immigrants. It has everything to do with flooding an already unstable labor market with desperately poor immigrants who will happily work any job, without any benefits, at any wage, under any conditions, for the sole purpose of driving down the cost of labor, destroying the middle class, and intentionally plunging the average innocent citizen into a labor market of abject poverty where they have no labor union representation or ability to do anything other than what they are told. These Congressmen are merely tools of the elite who only want to keep We the People powerless, desperate, and under control. This is treason of the highest order and a national disgrace. I pity any citizen who does not have the cognitive ability to see this for what it is--including Thom Hartmann.

This militirization of our southern border will be like Northern Ireland's and yes N. & S. Korea's. Now there will be many more deaths, people put in jails (more jails built), etc. Mexico won't stand for this and neither will the rest of the America's! We are starting another war and therefore more billionaires made through the "war machine" which we have become. Next will be drones in our skies watching people (the poor) through their windows, yards, acerage, you name it. The Republicans stand for the rich and their corpporations and that is what our country now stands for. Anyone who isn't rich will feel the weight of the Totalitarian change to our nation. The Democrats in Congress simply layed down and let The Republicans walk all over them and US. We are no longer a respected nation--we no longer respect our immigrants for all the hard work they do and have done to try to build a free society for the people. That is why they came here --for freedom, not tyranny.

DAnneMarc: Rolling over in his grave, no doubt! Rosebud...or Crusader? (You have to slow the movie Citizen Kane down to Frame by Frame (or, maybe read the book) to see the word "Crusader" on his sled when he was a poor boy.) And one can further hypothesize just what that word means in considering what they believe the Crusaders did during the middle ages..especially, the Children's Crusades (but I digress)!

Instead of being invaded by extraterrestrial bug-eyed monsters from space we are being destroyed from within by even more destructive bug-eyed monsters of the sort called the Koch Bros and their bought-off politicians.

Many of these greedy termites have hogged out the infrastructure of our country by taking it all and giving back little in return. Sure some may have given the illusion that they give to various charities (although, many of these "charities" help support their Ayn Randian religion) but that is just cover for their rapacious greed and selfishness and total disdain for humanity..and provides tax shelter for their billions.

Maybe, if we had a real alien invasion and takeover, and all that wealth was confiscated from those who have been lucky enough to have largely inherited all their wealth (or those who have used sneaky and ruthless tactics, that they like to call good business practices, to amass their fortunes), we would all be better off.

Really, what difference would it make whether the Russians, the Chinese, the North Koreans, the Iranians, the Mexican drug cartels, or Extraterrestrial Aliens invaded us and took us over? Those 1 or 2 percent of Americans who own and control 98% of the wealth of our nation are really just as heartless and ruthless and ALIEN as any other potential invader. These tempestuous and insidious connivers have invaded us from within and are no better or worthy to lord over us than any "outsider". To whom do we owe our loyalty when our country has been undermined by greedy financial manipulators and gutless corrupt politicians.

Here's a funny piece written by John Stanton on God, Jesus, and the NSA...

Saint Obama of the Digital Inquisition:
God Contacts Rome, Christ Holds Press Conference

by John Stanton

http://cryptome.org/2013/06/god-nsa.doc

..

DAnneMarc: Yes, of course, you raise some valid points and it still could very well be merely a matter of drunk driving. I don't know how they will be able to determine, from lab tests conducted on a charred body, if Hastings had been drinking. Hastings did have a history of alcohol and drug use...and wreckless driving. But, he was known to be "on the wagon", so to speak, for something like 10 years.

And it has been proven that late model automobiles with on-board computers can have their operation interfered with, even overriding the operator's controls, but this has not yet been done remotely, you would have had to physically connect to the on-board computer through the connector that is there for monitoring and modifying the software. And this could have been done to trigger at some point in time when Hastings was driving. The speed and braking system could easily have been modified to ramp up the speed and disable the brakes. I don't know what would have caused the sparking near the gas tank and the explosion that occurred..except that there is a fuel level sensor in the gas tank that uses electrical current...could they have created an overload condition to the fuel sensor? Could they also have planted a bomb or source of ignition that would go off at the right moment after the speed and braking and even steering system were disabled? Just like the airplanes during 9/11 were electronically hijacked and guided (like guided missiles) to hit their targets either by a preprogrammed method, or remotely, it is quite possible to have our cars messed with to crash in firey balls of flame. Most of us, most likely, don't have to worry about it unless there is some way to remotely hack into a car's on-board system and some hackers feel like having some fun. But if you are making big waves against the corrupt establishment, like Hastings did (and a number of others as well), you might have to stay out of planes and automobiles...and continually scan the skies for drones (not that you would actually see it coming).

I suspect, if they don't have the ability to upload software changes to your automobile's OS remotely now, they most likely will in the future. But for now, all they have to do is gain access to your car, hook up a computer and upload the changes...you'd never know it.

Of course, we don't know what he was doing at those early morning hours...maybe he was just going into the office earlier than normal...or maybe that was his normal schedule...lots of people work those hours. And according to his email about the FBI investigating him and people he knew...and that he was going to have to (what I read as) go into hiding...he may have had a very good reason to believe someone was after him..a drone perhaps? I saw a youtube video of an Israeli hit on a vehicle driving through the streets and the car just blew up as it was driving on the urban street. After it got past some other traffic, in a clear spot, the vehicle just blew up..

It used to be that if they wanted to cause an accident, they would just nick the brake lines so that the brakes fail at critical times...like going around mountainous passes...or, they'd just plant dynamite in the car that would explode when the ignition is turned. Those things are too obvious. Manipulating the OS in a car can make it look just like someone is recklessly speeding and the explosion would be a natural assumption when the car crashes at such speeds. Mercedes Benz are noted for all their safety features and some people have survived 80 MPH crashes with only scratches. Not that I believe everyone would. Some people have survived hangings and the electric chair as well.

According to the eyewitness, the car was on fire before it hit the tree...he said after it hit the tree, the flames were much bigger.

Quote article::Former U.S. National Coordinator for Security, Infrastructure Protection, and Counter-terrorism Richard Clarke told The Huffington Post on Monday that the fatal crash of journalist Michael Hastings’ Mercedes C250 coupe last week is “consistent with a car cyber attack.”

“There is reason to believe that intelligence agencies for major powers” — including the United States — know how to remotely seize control of a car,” Clarke said.
----
In 2011, Car and Driver magazine published an article substantiating the Pentagon research. “Currently, there’s nothing to stop anyone with malicious intent and some ­computer-programming skills from taking command of your vehicle. After gaining access, a hacker could control everything from which song plays on the radio to whether the brakes work,” writes Keith Barry, citing research conducted by the Center for Automotive Embedded Systems Security, a partnership between the University of California San Diego and the University of Washington.

“What has been revealed as a result of some research at universities is that it’s relatively easy to hack your way into the control system of a car, and to do such things as cause acceleration when the driver doesn’t want acceleration, to throw on the brakes when the driver doesn’t want the brakes on, to launch an air bag,” Clarke told The Huffington Post. “You can do some really highly destructive things now, through hacking a car, and it’s not that hard.”

Clarke was careful not to directly implicate the government in hacking Hastings’ car. “So if there were a cyber attack on the car — and I’m not saying there was,” he said, “I think whoever did it would probably get away with it.”

http://www.infowars.com/richard-clarke-hastings-accident-consistent-with...

And if the car's OS has been modified to do any of those things...why do you think you can nullify those actions by doing something else...like shifting gears...or honking the horn...or rolling down the window?

By the way, there are no speed bumps, or dips in the road, or pot holes at that intersection or for the 600 some feet past the intersection (to the tree he crashed into). And I can expect an old car with bad suspension and a low hanging exhaust pipe to possibly be likely to scape the pavement but even they would have to have some kind of unevenness in the road surface for that to happen. This was a Mercedes which most likely had very good suspension.

And yes, if the government wanted to do away with this guy they could have done it in so many other ways as well. Some people have been thrown out of tall buildings, others poisoned with plutonium, others injected with various poisons, fake suicides (you know...multiple shots to the back of the head). But when they have new toys...they have to try them out. In addition to which, it sends a chilling message to others not to think they can get away with outing the government's wrong doing.

And what better way to destroy evidence than a fiery explosion. There cannot be much left to analyze, both body or car parts...including (or especially) the contents of firmware after a nice big explosion and fire. And there can't be too many witnesses at 4:20 in the morning. What we don't know is why he was driving around at that time...did he get a hot tip? was he going to work? was he running from someone trying to assassinate him? a threat?

Palindromedary ~ Wait a minute! I just learned this guy was a speechwriter for Condoleezza Rice. Why didn't you say so! That really adds steroids to the concept of motive. Now I'm really curious; and, much less skeptical.

Palindromedary ~ Oh my! I just saw an Alex Jones diatribe on the incident in question. He says there is a Car And Driver article about how that type of Mercedes is remote controllable. However, most disturbing he showed a photo of the vehicle the next day. The car is essentially intact resting against the tree. It didn't impact the tree at all, only came to rest against it. Oddly, the explosion doesn't even appear to have come from the gas tank; but, rather, from under the driver's seat. Check it out for yourself. Unbelievable! The claim that an explosion occurred prior to the tree impact is completely valid in my opinion. Congratulations Palindromedary! You've done it again. I've seen enough already to conclude that this was not an accident. Perhaps the biggest factor to support that contention is the fact that the car is intact and the front fender is resting against the tree--not the trunk where the gas tank is. The darkest, most charred area of the vehicle is in the middle where the driver's seat is. The roof above the driver's head is melted! Foul play is the only explanation as to how this car exploded. Once again I must admit I was wrong. Thank you!

DAnneMarc: Yes, I saw that youtube vid of the car flashing by that intersection, caught on camera by the police, after which the police drove what seemed to be several blocks, and making turns, to get to the actual scene of the "accident". So, that scene of the car flashing by was probably not captured at the intersection of N. Highland Ave and Melrose Ave because the "accident" would have been right around the corner from the police. In fact, about 650 feet south of the intersection. We don't know if it was actually Hastings' car that flashed by. It could have been some other car. But I have no reason to believe that it was Hastings' Mercedes as viewed from some other intersection other than N. Highland and Melrose....further North perhaps. But, it seems to me that the police had made at least one turn, in addition to the right hand turn, in getting to the "accident" so how could Hastings be driving so fast, and the police car giving chase (if that is what you want to call it---he didn't seem to be moving very fast) and then when the police got to the scene..just a few seconds later...it appeared that the "accident" had happened well before the police got there. People were there with hoses trying to put the fire out already. The timing on that video of the car flashing by the intersection, the police "chase", the turns, all just did not seem to shout out that the timing was right on this video. Something fishy about it. If the police was following Hastings, making those turns, how could Hastings have made the speed that we have been led to believe he was going. The eyewitness said Hastings was going fast so he must have been...but could he have done that speed while making the same turns that the police made in that video? To go at the speed he was reported to be going, he must have been traveling straight in a southerly direction down N. Highland without having made any turns...like the police had to do.

And yes, I read about eyewitness reports, and saw photos of the engine and/or transmission having come to rest at at least 100 feet from the "accident".

I've heard of air bags exploding out with enough force to do some damage to people but I doubt they have enough force to blow the engine/transmission out 120 feet and roast the driver. Maybe Mercedes needs to do a recall to check out their air bag system? ;-}

Palindromedary ~ At this point I am not prepared to discount any of your hypothesis. I'm too tired and too discouraged; also, I'm not to proud of being so wrong. That being said I will throw out this little observation. Cameras are perfect, police officers are not. Just because a camera, mounted on the dashboard of one of LA's finest is able to capture .0003 secs of a speeding vehicle running a red light at 4:20 am doesn't mean that the officer was paying attention. If you look really closely, the officers light is green and the speeders light is red. That means the officer wasn't moving despite his light being green. Damn good thing too or that officer might have become part of the crash scene. My assessment? He was probably looking for that last donut in his bag on the passenger seat when that .0003 secs of action occurred. Possibly he was taking a cat nap and was awaken .006 seconds afterwards by a loud noise. He proceeded slowly because he wasn't sure it was a noise or a dream... Unless, of course, you are able to prove otherwise. Don't get me wrong my friend. At this point I would be shocked, but not really surprised. At that, I bid you goodnight. Sweet dreams. We can pick up where we left off tomorrow. There should be more light shed on the incident on the Sunday News. Thanks for the scoops. I look forward to learning more. Buenas Noches!

DAnneMarc: Yes, I believe you are correct that the possibility remains that the camera caught what the policeman may not have caught. It's funny that you mention "looking for that last donut" or taking a nap...I was going to joke about that myself but you beat me to it.

So, since the officer was just sitting there (what appeared to me to be in a parking space at the curb) and the light was green...he must have just been monitoring that intersection for people who run red lights. It was very late(early) hours so I can imagine that it would be hard to stay awake at those hours. Maybe the sound of the speeding car running the red light woke the policeman up and he decided to do some patrolling of the neighborhood.

Since it would have taken 20-30 seconds (perhaps) until the explosion/crash, the officer would have been about half way to Cole Ave (he wasn't going very fast). And according to the data displayed on the video dubbed in by LoudLabs News it was 2 minutes and 30 seconds just before the officer turned right (south) onto Cole Ave. (so the explosion/crash already happened 2 minutes before that). The next time a caption is displayed on the LoudLabs video, as the officer approached the "accident" scene going south on N. Highlands, it said it was 4 minutes since the car went by the intersection. That would mean that it took the officer 1 minute and 30 seconds to travel from the time he turned off of Santa Monica Blvd onto Cole Ave., traveling south on Coled, and then drove another 1/2 mile and turned west onto Waring Ave, then traveled another 1/2 mile to N Highlands, then turned left (south) to cross Melrose to find the "accident" scene on the other side. It took the officer 2.5 minutes to go the first 1/2 mile..then only 1.5 minutes to go the next 1+ miles. And what is confusing is that between the time the officer turned on to Cole and eventually turning off of Waring onto N. Highlands..the video was broken up several times with fade outs and fade ins during various turns..that didn't seem to fit turn off of Cole and going north on Waring. There were too many turns. So it could be that the officer did not take a straight path to N. Highlands along Cole and onto Waring. A zig-zag path..he sure didn't seem to be in a hurry. I couldn't make out the audio portion (the dispatcher calls) so I don't know if they announced the "accident" to the officer until he turned left onto N. Highlands from Waring where I thought I heard the dispatcher mention the fire.

One thing, I would imagine, that it would be just a little embarrassing for the officer who didn't seem to notice, or ignored, a speeding car that went through a red light. He might have pulled the guy over and saved his life...but that may be a stretch...especially if the car was rigged to blow up...and of course we can only speculate that that happened. It is just a very good thing that no one else got hurt..and no other substantial property damage was done.

An odd thing I noticed in the video as the officer arrived at the scene...there was a large stream of water gushing out of the ground very close to the fire (as if a fire hydrant was knocked over). Problem is that there was no above ground fire hydrant to hit or destroy. It was all underground that had a cover on top. Was someone able to get close enough to a very hot fire to remove the cover and turn on the water, managed to turn it on?

Palindromedary ~ I saw some strange things in that video too. First was the appearance that other emergency vehicles arrived before the police officer. Giving the timing of when the accident occurred, how long it takes for a witness to look for a phone, call 911, get a dispatcher, and have a vehicle dispatched--I can't see all that happening in the first 3 minutes. I didn't notice a fire hydrant but there clearly was a pool of water on the ground and a neighbor with a garden hose desperately trying to help. Someone once set off a car bomb next to our house when I was a kid. I remember trying to put out the flames with a garden hose. For some reason the flames just got worse. I desperately hosed down our house to keep it from catching fire. I remember the fireman I spoke to saying that the incendiary used only gets worse when fed the oxygen that is present in water. I remember what the car looked like after the fire and that is what Hastings car looked like too.

In addition to the fast presence of other emergency vehicles at the scene, the other thing that bothers me is that he must have been travelling 60-100 mph when he passed the police cam. His car exploded 30 seconds later. He did not hit anything which means the car either braked and locked its wheels or--more likely--the detonation of a bomb on the car slowed the vehicle. I believe that could only have been a detonation because--as reported--the engine and transmission intact were thrown 60 yards ahead of the vehicle. That would indicate that the bomb was placed somewhere behind the engine--probably just behind the lower dashboard, under the seat, or maybe in the glove box. The force of the detonation and propulsion of the engine and transmission forward slowed the car to a standstill like it hit a wall. Then it rolled to rest against the tree and burned.

Interesting that you said you thought you saw an empty vehicle blow by the police cam. Are you suggesting that Hastings comment about going under the radar may have been to fake his own death?

Palindromedary ~ Yeah this incident sure does bring back memories. That car wasn't in front of the house. The side of the house we lived in was against an alley way. The car was parked right under my bedroom window--about three feet from the house. I was about 16 -19 years old at the time. It was the Reagan era and here in Oakland that was a time of street warfare--especially in my neighborhood.

I was awoken in the middle of the night by what sounded like a barrel bomb, or a shotgun going off outside my bedroom window. Being summer time, near the 4th of July, and used to guns going off in the alley below I thought little of it and almost went back to sleep. However, a glow of dancing lights on my bedroom wall struck my curiosity and I went to the window to see what was going on. Outside my window a fire was raging; and, without a second thought I flew out the front door to see what was going on.

When I saw the car on fire I instinctively grabbed the garden hose, put the water on full blast, and doused the vehicle the best I could with the length of hose I had. I had to shoot the stream over hedges and around the corner of the house using my fingers because we didn't have a nozzle on that hose. I wanted to drop the hose and run inside to call the fire department but I feared the flames licking the house could set the house on fire; so, I stayed outside and committed myself to the water hose hoping someone--maybe a neighbor--would show up soon. They did and I yelled to them to call the police and the fire department. Fortunitely, there were several neighbors who appeared at once; and, some went to call for help; whereas, others manned their own hose to help out in the effort.

Unfortunately, like I said before, and like you can see in the video, water doesn't do much on a car bomb fire--it just makes it worse. So after I realized that fighting the flames was futile I concentrated the hose on the side of the house; hoping to saturate it enough to prevent it from igniting. Fortunately, I succeeded.

As it turned out this wasn't a murder attempt, just a very reckless act of vandalism and possibly insurance fraud. No one was in the car.

After watching other videos of the Hastings crash I noticed the water fountain that you mentioned. It wasn't shooting in the air high enough to be a broken fire hydrant; but it was definitely a source of water under pressure and out of control. Do you suppose that the bomb in the car may have ruptured a water pipe under the median when the car exploded? Perhaps the car hit a sprinkler pipe when it skidded out of control?

I've had a lot of chances to see all manor of accidents where I used to live too--including cars hitting poles. On different occasions I've seen cars spin out and hit telephone poles, a car hit a police call box phone head on, and even a truck hit a telephone pole breaking the pole off at the bottom. When a car hits a pole the engine is driven into the car; not outside the car. If you look at almost any angle of this accident the engine compartment is blown outward. I have never seen an accident blowing the engine outward. In this case the engine, internal wheel well, front frame, front axle, hub and wheel are all blown outward. The transmission, engine and part of the driveshaft are laying on the street 60 yards ahead of the crash, next to the curb. That is impossible with a head on collision with a tree; or, even a side impact with a tree. This was not an accident.

At this point the only real questions are: 1) Was Hastings really in the car? and 2) If so, who did it? General McChrystal, or some other pissed-off branch of the Government? As I understand it, McChrystal was head of Secret Ops before Hastings ruined his career. More than enough motive and means to have committed this murder.

As always, I'm curious as to your take.

Here is a video of a translated coversation with the spanish speaking eye witness:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fweyFCFKcp0

Here's another video by Alex Jones on the "accident":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-9xHy4sMx0

DAnneMarc: Quite a story about your experiences! Yes, I saw those videos..and that is a very interesting idea about Hastings being possibly already dead...the car, perhaps, being remotely controlled. But here is something else I have discovered:

The engine/transmission in this photo* is located exactly 166 feet from the tree that Hastings' car hit. I located the exact spot on Google Earth..matching it with the photo. The light pole, the utility covers on the curb, the bent trees, the houses in the distance all match up. This is right on the corner of N. Highlands and Clinton (how about that, eh?..."Clinton" street) Street. In another picture I recognize the bush in the background as well.

engine/transmission at 34 deg 04' 55.16" N and 118 deg 20'18.16" W
tree Hastings car hit at 34deg 04' 56.81" N and 118 20 18.94 W

It sure doesn't make sense that the engine/transmission would be 166 feet further south and on the opposite side of the street if the cars front end was along the right side of the tree as is shown in some pictures. If the car spun around counter clockwise hitting the tree on the right side of the tree then how can an engine/transmission pop out of the car and be thrown further down southward down the street when the spinning force would have been in the opposite direction (northerly). Now if the car smacked the tree head on then I could see a possibility that the engine/transmission would continue to travel in a southerly direction. But why doesn't the photos show that the front end crashed head-on into the tree, in full head-on or partially so. The car's front end is beside the tree. And why did they cover the front end with a tarp in one photo? What were they trying to hide? But how can a big engine/transmission like that just pop out of the vehicle when the vehicle is fully upright? There was no sign that any gaping hole in the right side of the vehicle was there in the photos. If the car had rolled then I could see that the engine/transmision could have popped out. But there was no indication the car rolled...or maybe it did before it got to the tree? I believe that the C250 has a front end engine...the photo looks like a front end engine with the transmission attached.

I have read that Mercedes Benz has been very embarrassed by this because people are making jokes about the safety on the order of the Ford Pinto jokes of olde.

Another thought occurred to me...the eyewitness said he saw sparks coming from the vehicle even before it got to the intersection...I wonder what would happen if the cars speed was rigged to go full speed, the breaks disabled, and the driver trying with all his might to use the emergency brake to stop the car...would not a lot of sparks result? Of course, we did not see any sparks when the car crossed the intersection where the officer was.

By the way, I know what you mean about those LAPD cops...just think of their recent rampage in trying to get Christopher Dorner..and even the Reagan era guns for drugs... importing drugs into East LA. And shooting a woman about a hundred times as she laid hiding in her car in fear of being assaulted....just a whole sordid history...

*http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Screen-Shot-2013-06-20-at-11.10.47-AM-e1371741324328.png

Yes, I'm going to turn in as well.

I propose that we spend $3 bazzillion to dig a 3 mile wide and 1300 mile long trench populated by hungry alligators and piranhas between Mexico and the US...then we spend another zillion or two to install powerful laser beam weapons on the bridges to zap any illegal that tries to come across. Jesse Ventura will just either have to stay in Baja or stay in AmeriKa. Sorry Jesse! I propose that we spend another quadrillion dollars to ramp up HAARP to create hurricanes on both ends of the AmeriKan Maginot line to prevent the aliens from doing a sneak attack on the ocean. This is war! Our very "way of life" is being threatened here! We must defend our liberty and security or the peons will steal it all away from us...Be Vigillant, Vainglorious, and proud. The Fatherland is proud of you! Seig Heil, Comrads!

Oh, yes, by the way...let's double the effort on the Canadian border. We wouldn't want any pussyfied, squeamish AmeriKans to escape to the north now would we. After all, they do pay a lot more (yeah, in Canadian dollars...currently .95/1.00...yikes! it used to be a lot less). Let's build an "Iron Curtain" around all of Amerika! Erect anti-aircraft guns all around the rim of Amerika and shoot down any aliens (or Amerikans trying to sneak out) trying to sneak across by airplane.
------------
Seriously though...
How about nipping-it-in-the-bud by cracking down on US employers who hire these illegal workers. Deport the employers straight to prison. Slap-on-the-wrist fines only pass the costs on to the consumer while the top execs and investors get insane compensation for their wrong-doing. Imprison the employers..the CEOs and other execs who reap the benefits of cheap labor from illegal workers. That would sure be a lot cheaper than building a big fence and manning it with lots of Xe (formerly Blackwater) psychos who shoot first and never ask question later. I bet that paramilitary-force-from Hell (who think they are doing God's work) is salivating over prospects of contracts to Nazify our southern border. What do you want to bet that they will end up murdering a lot of people like they did in Iraq.

Palindromedary ~ I'm not so sure I like the idea about a huge trench on the border filled with alligators and piranhas. Mexicans are used to living around rattlesnakes, and scorpions. I think they could easily find a way around alligators and piranhas. Now sharks with laser beams attached to their heads is another story.

But seriously. MMmmNACHOS and you make good points. Closing the borders isn't going to resolve the problems created by this new law. If the law passes forget about prosecuting the employers. I think that is really what this law is about--legalizing slavery. The other problem about sealing the borders that even the esteemed Mr. NACHOS didn't mention is what about chinese immigrants. Hello! Free up a path to citizenship and I bet you you'll be seeing boatloads of cheap imported workers streaming in from China. Sure, that's probably what is happening anyway; but, now it can happen in the open. Surprise! Surprise! The master deceivers have tricked us again! If you ask me it is the Chinese labor that they are really after. Just as hard working and cheap as Mexican labor; but, hightly intelligent and well educated as well. Tap into the shear numbers of disposable laborers in China and you and I have had it. "It's over, Johnny!"

I bet even Ken Ware never saw an invasion from China taking the form of guest worker visas. Thats what happens when you focus on the military and what our government says. Sleight of hand. I wonder if even David Copperfield saw this one coming? Spanish and Chinese. Soon we will all be trilingual.

This subject is so depressing it burns me out. I'm so glad I'm close to retirement and don't have kids.

DAnneMarc: You are probably correct...they would find a way around nearly anything we build to stop them. They would probably just tunnel under the trench.

As it is now, I think most illegals just come across the border at the border crossings or just fly in with falsified passports. I managed to fly out of the US into Mexico and back again even with no passport. I was on a business trip and forgot my passport when I got to the airport. The ticket agent called a man, who I guess was some kind of lawyer (he was a Mexican in a suit and carried a briefcase) who came to the airport and had me fill out some kind of papers...I paid him $50..and I was able to use these papers leaving the US...entering Mexico..leaving Mexico and back to the US. When I reentered the US, the Customs agent gave me a bit of a hard time but said ..."next time bring your passport!". And that was after 9/11.