Who's really winning in the government shutdown?
By Thom Hartmann A...
The real dangers of this government shutdown are becoming clear, but Republicans just want to keep up their political game. On Thursday, we found out that the Capital Police, who stopped a potentially-dangerous situation at the White House, will soon see their pay disappear. In Gulf Coast states, thousands of FEMA workers are furloughed, even as Tropical Storm Karen is expected to become a hurricane. And, domestic violence programs all around our nation say they will have to close their doors today if the government shutdown continues.
Yet, House Republicans think this is just a game, and it's all about winning or losing the media narrative. After recent television appearances, Senators Mitch McConnell and Rand Paul were caught with open mics. They were overheard discussing the GOP talking points about the government shutdown, and which phrases were “poll tested” for the media. Senator Paul told McConnell, “we're gonna win this, I think.”
However, police officers losing their pay, and being unable to protect our president, is not winning. FEMA being unprepared for a possible deadly storm is not success. And, domestic violence victims having no place to turn certainly doesn't sound like victory. The only ones winning in this situation are the billionaires behind the Tea Party, who are getting a huge return on their political investments. Tea Party Senators like Rand Paul seem to think winning means refusing to back down from their long list of billionaire demands.
Deregulation doesn't pay cops for their work. Building Keystone XL won't help FEMA workers prepare for the next hurricane. And, repealing Obamacare won't help domestic violence victims find a safe shelter. These are real people, facing real pain, so that the House Republicans can feel like they win with the media, and Americans are angry that this Tea Party game isn't over.
Comments
#2
I don't understand, why don't they just pass a bill to fund the necessary branches of the Government until this gets settled? Both parties are doing the exact same think and blaming each other.
Building Keystone would generate tax dollars that would fund FEMA. Thom you do know where taxes come from don't you.
#3
Very well Said, but I sadly don't think it will happen. I do hope I am wrong.
#4
sandlewould ~ Thank you! I too hope you are wrong; yet, fear you are right. I'm not sure if you were listening to todays show but a caller mentioned the TPP legislation you spoke about recently and how it is being rushed through by the White House itself. Very sneaky! Very disturbing, indeed! It appears we are being thrown a bone to distract us from the taking of our food and water dish.
The question was directed to Senator Bernie Sanders. He basically affirmed your apprehensions. Thanks for that heads up. That's very serious mischief. Although, in the long run with a responsible Congress and Executive it is damage that can be undone quickly along with the rest of the free trade fiasco. I still stand by my conviction that we need to focus on Campaign Finance Reform and Move to Amend over everything else. It is our TOP PRIORITY AS A NATION. Nothing meaningful is going to happen as long as these Corporate shills stand in the way of progress.
(By the way, were you that caller?)
#5
Concerning Miriam Carey. Thom has suggested that shooting the tires of the car would have been the way to go. I agree. However, we must put ourselves in the place of the police officers involved. They only had a split second to assess and respond. After all, this is Washington DC and they have been prepared here for a Terrorist attack for 12 years. None as to yet has occurred. Now they have a driver crashing through security check points. They have no choice but to conclude that this is a Terrorist. The person is attempting to gain close vicinity with government buildings. Suicide terrorists are the hallmark of terrorists organizations. Miriam is acting like such a threat. The question is what type of bomb is she attempting to deliver? How will it be detonated? There is no time to consider the consequences. In my humble opinion the police and the secret service acted appropriately. Imagine if this was a terrorist attack and there was a tactical nuclear weapon in the trunk of the car and the detonator in the hand of the driver. Of course that wasn't the case. However, that is the assumption that must be assumed by the security agents in the vicinity. Otherwise, our nation's defense is a joke.
#6
Quote DAnneMarc:Imagine if this was a terrorist attack and there was a tactical nuclear weapon in the trunk of the car and the detonator in the hand of the driver.
Most terrorists, that intend to blow themselves up, use a hand-held switch that detonates the explosives once the switch is released...so that even if the terrorist is shot...he/she releases the switch and....boom!!
I would sure love to hear a recording of the police conversations over their radios between the time that those cops were surrounding the car, near that Monument, in front of the Capitol...after she backed into the police car and then got away...till the time she was shot. I would be interested in knowing if the cops had seen the child in the car..and perhaps, even though they did fire at the car, may have tried to just shoot the tires not wanting to shoot into the vehicle for fear of hitting the child. If that was the case then that would look better for the cops..not wanting to hit the child. But this is just speculation...no real reason to assume this was true.
But it looks like the only time they actually shot the woman was when she got out of her car unarmed. They shot her multiple times...as if once wasn't enough! This is a very frequent pattern with police...they kill people like in the movie Bonnie and Clyde. I believe that there are a lot of psychopaths that gravitate to that career path. Psycho killers that just can't wait to kill people.
And remember the students that got gassed during that Oakland demonstration...and the guy that got his head cracked open by the cops. Looks like that Mayor of Oakland is going to get ousted...about time!
#7
I'd also be interested in knowing what psychotropic drugs she was using since she fell down those stairs and hit her head then had her baby and the postpartum depression she was having. Psychotropic drugs seems to be playing a big part in making people go nuts...especially if you are somewhat unstable to begin with.
#8
Quote Palindromedary:They shot her multiple times...as if once wasn't enough! This is a very frequent pattern with police...they kill people like in the movie Bonnie and Clyde. I believe that there are a lot of psychopaths that gravitate to that career path. Psycho killers that just can't wait to kill people.
Palindromedary ~ Very strange coincidence that you should mention that and the Oakland Police in the same post. I guess this is it if there is any aloft reason for me to share this story with you. One of my oldest friends once aspired to become a member of the Oakland Police force. He was barely in his twenties and this was back in the eighties. He passed all the exams with flying colors except one--the psychological exam. He flunked that test. We were all shocked beyond disbelief. However, his family was close with the higher ups in the police department. Eventually it was learned that the reason he flunked the test was because he was too calm and responsible. The spokesperson for the department informed the family that they intentionally seek recruits who have a short fuse and irrational violent behavior. Go figure! Of course this is Oakland and that is Washington DC. I can't say that I agree with your assessment in this case because it is hard to believe that the nation's Capitol shares the radical values of the law enforcement of Oakland; however, I can't help but share with you the facts as I learned them to support your opinion. Call it the spiritual side of me and take it for what it is worth. Hopefully, someone else on this blog can shed more light.
#9
Quote cnn article:Carey apparently did not have a weapon, but did have a 1-year-old girl in the car with her. The child -- Carey's daughter -- survived the chaos unharmed, officials said.
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Authorities who searched Carey's apartment in Stamford found discharge papers that listed risperidone, a medication to treat schizophrenia and bipolar disorder, a law enforcement source said. They also found paperwork listing escitalopram*, an antidepressant commonly prescribed under the brand name Lexapro, according to the source.
--
Also, the early investigation revealed that there was no evidence that the woman had a gun or fired a shot.
But the initial reports was that she shot a police officer. Seems that police officer they took away in an ambulance was apparently not from being shot but by being hit by Carey's car.
http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/04/politics/u-s-capitol-shooting/
*
Quote article:
Adverse Reactions Reported Subsequent to the Marketing of EscitalopramHere's one of the many other adverse reactions reported:
Psychiatric Disorders: acute psychosis, aggression, agitation, anger, anxiety, apathy, completed suicide, confusion, depersonalization, depression aggravated, delirium, delusion, disorientation, feeling unreal, hallucinations (visual and auditory), mood swings, nervousness, nightmare, panic reaction, paranoia, restlessness, self-harm or thoughts of self-harm, suicide attempt, suicidal ideation, suicidal tendency.
http://www.rxlist.com/lexapro-side-effects-drug-center.htm
Also, many of the double-blind studies may not take into consideration people under a lot of stress while taking the meds...most may not have any pressures when participating in the tests. Mariam Carey was undergoing a lot of stress...after fall down the stairs...hitting her head, being hospitalized for it, which was when she discovered she was pregnant, then after having the baby, having postpartum depression, and complicated by the fact that her dispute with the Condo complex fees. In fact all of these situations..the school shootings...the theater shootings..the Naval Station shootings...were all both taking SSRIs and under a great deal of stress at the time.
#10
Quote DAnneMarc: Eventually it was learned that the reason he flunked the test was because he was too calm and responsible. The spokesperson for the department informed the family that they intentionally seek recruits who have a short fuse and irrational violent behavior.
Wow! Interesting story! Yes, I understand that the police have a very tough and dangerous job and without them we'd all be screwed. Maybe it is necessary for police to have an edge that enables them to go up against those dangerous people. But we have all known of way too many stories of police just abusing their powers and needlessly applying unnecessary force...like the Bonnie and Clyde style shooting of unarmed women with a child in the car...or the 10 policemen who mercilessly beat to death with their batons some poor guy laying on the sidewalk. And then the police department disappeared the video evidence after they confiscated it from some woman bystander who filmed the whole thing. There are just way too many incidences like these around the country to cut the police any slack.
#11
Palindromedary ~ You forgot to mention the stress and strain she underwent after losing her job as a Dental Hygienist. That together with her pregnancy must have been an awesome burden to her even if she was in her right mind.
#12
DAnneMarc: Thank you, DAnnemarc. Yes, I did forget to mention that. And there is no telling what kind of relationship she had with her boyfriend. He did call the cops on her once saying that she might be a danger to the child. And I wonder just how she fell down those stairs?
#13
Quote Palindromedary:But we have all known of way too many stories of police just abusing their powers and needlessly applying unnecessary force...like the Bonnie and Clyde style shooting of unarmed women with a child in the car...or the 10 policemen who mercilessly beat to death with their batons some poor guy laying on the sidewalk. And then the police department disappeared the video evidence after they confiscated it from some woman bystander who filmed the whole thing. There are just way too many incidences like these around the country to cut the police any slack.
Palindromedary ~ That is exactly my point. As far as I am concerned, there is reason to believe that these senseless murders are part of a larger agenda. I can prove nothing. Everything I have is mere hearsay. Nevertheless, this is serious cause for the concern of us all. That is why I mentioned it in the first place. We need to collectively build a case before we can even begin to make an allegation. It will take a lot more than my testimony to skin this goat
#14
Quote article:The Secret Service and Capitol Police were unable to communicate with each other by radio during critical moments after a woman tried to ram a car through a barrier at the White House, then was chased past the Capitol before being shot to death.
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The inability of law enforcement and first responder radios to communicate has been an issue for years and was sharply criticized by the 9/11 Commission. In this week’s incident, NBC station WRC of Washington reported Friday that the inability of Secret Service officers to alert Capitol Police of Carey’s approach deprived the police officers of a crucial 30 to 45 seconds they could have used to put up perimeter barriers.
http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/04/20823007-secret-servi...
Remember the excuses they used for 9/11 when they said that departments weren't talking to each other and that is the reason why the terrorists were able to slip by their radar?
#15
Quote DAnneMarc:We need to collectively build a case before we can even begin to make an allegation. It will take a lot more than my testimony to skin this goat
And, I think that if we all keep digging and collaboration, even on just a blog, that we can maybe raise some awareness to some who may be reading these posts but who may not be seriously looking further than a few headline stories by just a single source. Maybe not!
#16
Palindromedary ~ And, maybe so! Who knows? Keep a stiff upper lip. (There! That is much better than, "Keep the Faith". Right?) All we can do is hope. Obviously, this problem is very complex, and far out of our control. Nevertheless, let us keep on keepin on and not let up the good fight in our struggle for truth, justice, and the Ameri... that is, The Right Way!!!
#17
It's a bird....it's a plane....it's...ewwww...a bird!
#18
Very good points! That video is increadible. I'm too tired at this point to offer any credible opinions of the testimony--except that you are right, this testimony blows the lid off of any theory I've previously espoused. It does indeed sound like an assasination/execution. Unbelievable! The baby was removed before the shots were fired? No attempt at pepper spray or stun gun? Something smells very fishty!
#19
Quote theNation article:...for hours yesterday on TV, something seemed off from the start. After the breathless, often (very) wrong reporting on high-profile shootings and bombings in past months, my skepticism was on red alert. Now nearly every major news outlet was reporting that (1) a black sedan had deliberately tried to “breach” a gate and enter the White House grounds; (2) the car drove away and the driver shot and wounded a cop; (3) and the driver, possibly a woman, was dead, or alive.
--
It took hours for the media, especially on TV, to admit that (1) there was no White House “gate,” it was a barrier, and maybe she had just made a wrong turn and then flipped out; (2) the woman somehow escaped not one but two police checkpoints; (3) and she was unarmed and, exiting her vehicle, she was shot so many times by police that identification would be difficult.
------
http://www.thenation.com/blog/176505/unarmed-african-american-slain-poli...
And all this right after an unprecedented Government shutdown.
Here is a video of a witness that worked in an office overlooking the shooting and saw everything as it happened.
And she says that the police got the little girl out of car and then the heavy firing began. Was this a deliberate assassination? If they could get the little girl out of the car and then the police opened up on the woman as she was getting out of the car...this was a needless murder by the police.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=cGHzE9ie-M8
When you watched those scenes of the police carrying away that little girl didn't you get the impression that the girl was inside the car when the mother was shot? So, instead we learn that the police got the girl from the car, then the mother opened her door to get out, and then the police opened up on the mother.
#20
Sorry, DAnneMarc. I edited which put your reply before what you were replying to.
And I guess it's time I stopped for tonight. Time to play with my little Arduino again and then hit the sack.
#21
Palindromedary ~ I'm still reeling from that eyewitness testimony. I am also very tired. However, something has occurred to me that I must mention. One explanation that may make sense. What if the baby was the out of wedlock baby of Barack Obama? Then would all this make sense? I know, ridiculous. Time for bed. Goodnight all. Sweet dreams.
#22
Palindromedary ~ Sorry! I must pry. Who is little Arduino?
#23
Stranger things have happened...like tough head of the FBI director wearing dresses and playing doctor with Clyde. But, I'm tired too...so nighty night!
#24
My little microcontroller that can be used to control LEDs, Servos, etc...It's a hobby.
#25
Who? LMAO ;-}
#26
Palindromedary ~ Ok. I slept on it. I stand by my suggestion. Why would an officer approach the car and remove the baby.
1. He must have know there was a baby in the car.
2. He must have know the woman was incapacitated or unarmed.
3. The baby must have been very important and the woman very dangerous. This is the only reason for waiting till the baby was clear of the car to open fire.
4. This was some kind of deliberate assassination. The officer safely retrieving the baby proved to everyone in the vicinity--including the woman watching from the window above--that the driver was incapacitated and/or unarmed. Further shots obviously weren't necessary. Yet everyone continued shooting the woman point blank in the face. The obvious intent was to silence her.
5. This testimony completely invalidates the concept that these officers suspected a bomb in the car. You don't approach a vehicle and open a door if you suspect it is wired with explosives. You disable the vehicle and the driver first. You shoot out the tires and send in the bomb squad.
6. Finally, you don't fire shots directly into a vehicle you think is carrying a bomb. Especially If people are in the vicinity.
Either there was something completely different going on or these are the most incompetent police since the Keystone Kops. Please correct me if I'm wrong. In my opinion, preventing some kind of high level scandal is the only logical explanation for the behavior of everyone involved. The only other explanation, far less logical, is sheer madness and incompetence mixed with "Dirty Harry" vigilantism.
Time will tell. Any scandal displayed on this magnitude is going to leak out sooner or later. The DNA in that baby alone might just blow the roof off this story.
#27
Sorry, a repeat, but not a flood, I worry no one reads all this.
Thom,
Allow me to preface my comment with the realization that I am to the left of almost anyone and not a libertarian by any means.
Oh, and I take my communism (e.g. us) without any totalitarianism, and, if you bring it with totalitarianism I WILL SEND IT BACK.
Ahem. Now the U.S. Constitution makes very specific conditions about what will be regarded as treason. Nixon and Reagan aside, (I wonder, perhaps our hero Mike P. would know) could the provision that requires an OVERT ACT against the United States be made to include the senior editor (s) at Fox–so-called–News that ordered the spin that it's a 'slimdown' or Hannity's 'liberal' shutdown crack OR that it's the President or the Democrats at fault, as being a deliberate falsehood designed to hurt (maybe overthrow, disable etc.) the United States. An OVERT ACT if you will.
I suspect a talented attorney (our hero?) could rattle such a senior editor (s) enough to admit IN COURT that the order came from a billionaire that would not be denied?
Arresting John Boehner for public drunkeness might have a certain sense of poetic justice, but convicting a billionaire of TREASON, especially a visible one, would be…
Well, priceless.
Now Thom, don't get mad when I send much more critical analysis of some of your more funny ideas, like say, James Madison's objective when writing the Constitution was NOT to put in place as many barriers to ordinary people voting their own interests.
Remember, those guys, mainly all slaveholders, thought T. Jefferson had some funny Parisian ideas when he returned.
Good job one of them wasn't the guillotine.
I am, however, poised to set up on a moments notice, a metaphorical, non-violent one.
Guillotine, that is.
Let's hope it's as effective.
So you won't think I am a total moron, here's a poem:
FROM US
Wildcat strike
34 dead
Apartheid is gone
from South Africa
Seniors who don’t drive
Don’t vote
We killed racism in the 60’s
As strange as it sounds
It’s morning
In America
And how the day shapes up
Is up to someone
Make sure it’s us
No cause for which
I am prepared to kill
How about
Prepared to live
Tar sand bribery
War crime whitewash
Where did they get
All the money
From us
Your formatting isn't so hot for verse, you get the gist.
Yer pal,
Michael Willis
mwjeep75@gmail.com
#28
Maybe I put this in the wrong place I thought it was comment on the shutdown.
#29
mwjeep75 -- You put it in the right place and thank you.
#30
kend -- the parties are not even close to doing the same thing. The prez is trying to do the most important thing we have in the constitution. That thing is WE. John Boehner will not bring the clean Continuing Resolution to a vote.
#31
chuckle8 ~ Good point! The Constitution does deligate the responsibility for the dept to Congress; however, it clearly states in the 14th Amendment:
US ConstitutionQuote 14th Amendment, Section 4:Section 4. The validity of the public debt of the United States, authorized by law, including debts incurred for payment of pensions and bounties for services in suppressing insurrection or rebellion, shall not be questioned.And then in goes on to say
Quote 14th Amendment, Section 5:Section 5. The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fourteenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution
Therefore, in my humble opinion, The Constitution delegates the authority to pay the dept to Congress; however, it stipulates that any such dept "shall not be questioned." That is exactly what is happening at this time. Congress--or certain members thereof--are abandoning their Constitutional responsibility to "pay the dept." For that reason I feel that it is The Constitutional RESPONSIBILITY of the Executive to either remove the members of Congress that are preventing the Constitutionally required mandatory action of the body from proceeding; or, to use an emergency Executive Order to do it himself. Either action should be upheld by the Court; and, if not, the President has more than enough legal recourse to delay the implementation of an Unconstitutional Court decision indefinitely. In this case the President has The Constitution, We the People, justice and righteousness on his side. He can do no wrong with either action mentioned above. In any event, where the Court to overturned such a decision, the President could also use such a circumstance to compel Congress to fulfill its Constitutional obligations without further delay. The President is currently in a situation that he can only lose by gross incompetence or deliberate intention.
#32
Dan -- you are discussing the debt ceiling. That will be relevant in a couple of weeks.
#33
Quote DAnneMarc: The DNA in that baby alone might just blow the roof off this story.Yes, I was just thinking about that! But who's going to run that test...and who will dare spill the beans on that one. They'll send that person's car down the road at 80 mph and run it into a tree. In fact, I hope that office worker who was interviewed by CNN and told what she witnessed stays safe.
#34
Hey "mw", I don't know enough about communism to claim I'm a communist. But I am definitely a socialist. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if others on this blog could say the same. And I'd sure like to see some of those billionaire psychopaths arrested & convicted for treason! And your sentiments about totalitarianism resonate with me. Thanks for the posts!
#35
Randy Rhodes had a different point of view than Thom regarding Miriam Carey, saying she believed those officers were justified killing Ms. Carey, while reminding us of all the crazy, dangerous stunts Ms. Carey pulled to support her view. This was one of those rare instances when I had to disagree with Ms. Rhodes. Like Thom pointed out, Miriam Carey was UNARMED when she finally got out of her car. Like Thom pointed out, they could have shot out her tires before shooting HER, and arrested her instead. Rambo-style policing is unprofessional, uncivilized and dangerous. And I haven't forgotten your previous post about why that young guy was turned away from the Oakland PD (Gimmie a break!) - Aliceinwonderland
#36
There was a book written about an intentional effort to “sabotage” the government as inept in order to create an atmosphere of dissatisfaction within the population in order to facilitate efforts to privatize government functions. Is there a possibility that the sequester, the shut-down, etc. are being driven by similar intentions? In reality, how does one shrink the government to fit in a bathtub? Could it be that the underlying intention involves taking the citizens of the U.S. to new heights of distrust in government so that privatization becomes a walk in the park? If this were the case, then specific outcomes (i.e. destruction of the economy) really are just icing on the cake.
Someone once said “a tree is known by its fruit”. The fruit I see is rapidly increasing frustration and dissatisfaction with government in general. I also see parts of the “shut down” federal government being picked up by states (and private money), i.e. parks. Didn’t someone try to sell off the National Parks about 15 to 20 years ago (bio-something or another). Do you think there might be some wealth ready to take over the National Parks? I just saw a news program about how the private prisons are being paid by beds (whether or not filled). I wonder if the private prison contracts are affected by the “shut down” as well as other payments to private contractors fulfilling the work of the government.
I read a book about the war in Iraq that pointed out that instead of the war being a failed endeavor, it achieved near perfect results. The results being: the destabilization of the Middle East in order to frustrate a “Caliphate” from forming that would block access to oil. It occurs to me that the current federal government activities are equally successful if one wants to privatize and shrink the federal government.
#37
Tclark says "There was a book written about an intentional effort to 'sabotage' the government as inept in order to create an atmosphere of dissatisfaction within the population in order to facilitate efforts to privatize government functions. Is there a possibility that the sequester, the shut-down, etc. are being driven by similar intentions? In reality, how does one shrink the government to fit in a bathtub? Could it be that the underlying intention involves taking the citizens of the U.S. to new heights of distrust in government so that privatization becomes a walk in the park?" And I say, BINGO. You just highlighted the heart of the problem. It is definitely what motivates those little fascists. This is why they fill the airwaves with government-bashing messages, while filling the seats of Congress just to make sure that government doesn't work.
Wake up, people! Don't fall for this crap, or you'll be in for much harder times than we've seen already. - Aliceinwonderland
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No one is winning anything. The rich can afford to lose the poor can't. That is what it all boils down to. Drastic action is necessary. The President must use his Executive power to do what Congress is unable or unwilling to do. Congress must replace the Speaker of the House. The SCOTUS must uphold the executive branch's authority to raise the debt ceiling. Anything else is failure on the behalf of the 99%; and, it won't be pretty.
We must stand firm with no compromises!