Are ALEC and the Politicians They Fund Complicit in Niklas Cruz's Florida School Shooting?

The Koch American Legislative Exchange Council (ALEC) group writes many of our laws rather than the legislators. This is the result of a series of Supreme Court decisions starting with Buckley v. Valeo in 1976 and reaching their peak with Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission in 2010 and McCutcheon v. Federal Election Commission in 2014.

Citizens United said that it's no problem, it's perfectly legal if a member of Congress wants to prostitute themselves, essentially, if they want to sell their vote, if they want to sell legislation that they introduce to the billionaire Koch brothers, to the Walton family, to Bill Gates or if an entire political party wants to sell out to a group of billionaires as the Republicans have done with the Koch network which has committed 400 billion dollars to them for this election cycle.

That's just fine, that's what the founders intended, that's why they wrote the first amendment - that's what the Supreme Court said.

It's total BS. It's a lie. It has destroyed our politics.

In 2011 in his State of the Union address, President Barack Obama called out the Supreme Court for their 22 October 2010 Citizens United ruling and and Sam Alito, mouths "not true" at Barack Obama. Sam Alito's a fool. How did this idiot get on the Supreme Court? Well, then we had a Republican president, of course.

The Supreme Court said it's legal to own politicians and so sure enough, every group from the chemical manufacturers to the drug manufacturers to the gun manufacturers said, "hey, hey, let's buy some politicians".

And while the Democratic Party to a large extent, at least half of the Democratic Party, has been saying, "no, we're not going to be for sale," the entire Republican Party said, "oh, yeah, this is how we can get power." And that's what they're doing and they don't give a rat's ass about the future of America. These Republicans don't give a damn about these kids that were murdered.


Scotty11 5 years 4 weeks ago

Ahhh...perhaps I should read this again as I must have missed something.

How does 'Citizens United' equate to being complicit in the Florida school shooting?

SueN's picture
SueN 5 years 4 weeks ago

Allowing politicians to be bought means that the NRA and ALEC can get their gun legislation passed (or prevent gun control legislation from being passed), which meant the shooter could easily get his gun.

Legend 5 years 4 weeks ago

Wow SueN is even posting. I agree totally. one of my Senators, Cory Gardner is totally bribed by the NRA. I hope that he burns in hell.

Hephaestus's picture
Hephaestus 5 years 4 weeks ago

#1 - It's about guns

And, the 2nd amendment delusion that a country with a standing army still needs the populace to bear arms

Get this - there was no standing army in 1791


What has happened to common sense?

stopgap's picture
stopgap 5 years 4 weeks ago

Does Scotty think that the guy that drives the getaway car at a bank robbery is innocent of abetting the crime?

Does Scotty think that the Fence that buys stolen jewelry is innocent of abetting the crime?

Does Scotty think that the NRA buying politicians for the purpose of making it legal to sell assault weapons to mass murders makes them innocent of abetting crime?

TIrving's picture
TIrving 5 years 4 weeks ago

While the 2010 ruling in favor of "citizens united" was a gut punch to democracy in the U.S. and yes the Kochs were behind it, it was the Supreme Court that actually let our nation down. I think the Kochs are self serving pukes, but assholes like them have always been around. It's our Judicuary and Congress that are the real problem and they collude and feed off the Kochs and lackeys that follow them. Only a Constitutional Congress that would put retro-active term limits on all three branches of government can save us now. Unless you know a better (none violent) way.? With the loss of our rights to privacy, even the attempt to convene a constitutional change would be easily thwarted by the "deep state", let alone a militant up-rising. I suspect the fight will be in the streets.

TIrving's picture
TIrving 5 years 4 weeks ago

Gardener and his buddy here in my district, Mike (can't think of his name, same state) is just as bad. They vote on a "party-line" regardless of an issues merit. In the end, they're all either Demopubs or Repubocrats as my social studies teacher told us back in 1971. Career politicians seeking fame and fortune.

Kilosqrd's picture
Kilosqrd 5 years 4 weeks ago

The 1st Amendment reads "...the right of the people to peacebly assemble and to petition the Government for a redress of grievences..."

For those of you who can't comprehend what that means (including Thom, apparently) means lobbying. Yes that includes the NRA but it also includes Planned Parenthood, NARAL (talking about those with blood on their hands), SPLC, ACLU, La Raza, NAACP, etc. and all the other alphabet soup organizations that are the left's go-to lobbies.


stopgap's picture
stopgap 5 years 4 weeks ago

K2, Citizens United has to do with money to politicians, not lobbyists…"shut up and dribble!"

Kilosqrd's picture
Kilosqrd 5 years 4 weeks ago


That's all you got???? FAIL


Legend 5 years 4 weeks ago

The money that the NRA gives to politicians is nothing but bribes for their votes. That is not lobbying, it is bribing and they should be ashamed for accepting it. It should in a normal world and Government be highly illegal. But not in ours.

Legend 5 years 4 weeks ago

Virtually all of these crimes are done with semi auto and most with assualt type weapons with large clips. None of which is needed in public. You do not hunt with them and they are not even good for tartget shooting. We had a ban that worked for 10 years. We need it again. Moments of silence and prayers do not work. Our politicians (mostly Republicans) that are supposed to represent us are bribed and only represent the NRA. There have been 3 Sheriffs in Colorado murdered by assault wepeaons since the beggining of 2018. Paul Ryan says now is not the time to talk about it. Tell that to the dead.

Kilosqrd's picture
Kilosqrd 5 years 4 weeks ago

"There have been 3 Sheriffs in Colorado murdered by assault wepeaons since the beggining of 2018."

I supposed these "assault weapons" acted all by themselves. You are blaming an inanimate object. Epic FAIL


Legend 5 years 4 weeks ago

If the murderer had a hunting rifle instead, Do you think that the officers would have had a better chance. You are an asshole that ignores the fact that each of those officers had wives and children. You are the reason that we have so many murders in America asshole!

jefflisse's picture
jefflisse 5 years 4 weeks ago

Don't even get me going on Paul Ryan! I live in his district. I live in his home town... And he most definitely doesn't care about his constituents! But because of illegal redistricting he has no trouble keeping his seat. He's an evil sociopath who has absolutely no empathy at all!!

Legend 5 years 4 weeks ago

Assault weapons does something to people mentally. Big dick syndrome or whatever they do something.

go to 1:35

jefflisse's picture
jefflisse 5 years 4 weeks ago

This evil genie was let out of the bottle a long time ago..
And l have no idea how it can be put back in and capped.

Hell, l think the bottle is shattered beyond repair.

Its so sad...

Worn out door knobs's picture
Worn out door knobs 5 years 4 weeks ago

This is the problem when the subject of guns is addressed. Both sides line up, dig in and hurl blame and insults at each other. I understand that after a tragic event emotions and feelings are raw. Something needs to be done to prevent future massacres. I’m not sure more laws will change anything. It’s a extremely complex cultural issue....I don’t have an answer, but chooseing up sides, blaming and calling names isn’t the solution. Everyone will have to work together to solve this problem.

stopgap's picture
stopgap 5 years 4 weeks ago

No Kilosgrd, we are not blaming an inanimate object. Were blaming you for abetting these killers by making an inanimate object that makes mass murder as easy as how fast you can pull the trigger. In my mind you are no better than Niklas Cruz.

In fact you made our point by pointing out that three Sheriffs were killed by ARs. They weren't killed by knives, hammers, slingshots, or even handguns. They were killed by assault rifles that were made available by the Gun Nuts of America, like you.

Maybe you can go meet with the families of the victims of mass murder and assure them that the assault rifles used by the majority of mass murders had nothing to do with the loss of their family members? Do you think that will make them feel better? Do you think they will agree?

Scotty11 5 years 4 weeks ago

Stopgap; I asked a question...I didn't submit a seemed to jump on my query with both boots.

Others explained it better, however, I still feel Thom's essay could have been been written.

stopgap's picture
stopgap 5 years 4 weeks ago

Yes Scotty, I answered your question. You just didn't like my answer. You wanted an answer that was more sympathetic to what you wanted to believe.

Kend's picture
Kend 5 years 4 weeks ago

Here in Canada you can't have a clip that can hold more then four bullets. You can carry all the bullets you want to reload. I hunted for years I have never needed more than that. I have no proof of this but am I wrong in saying all of these school shootings seem to have started the same time we started giving children Ritalin or similar drugs at young ages.

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago

Gazing out over the chaos of America today, the racial and ethnic antagonism, the hostility over sex and faith and politics–I have never seen anything like it. The country is imploding. The main culprit is diversity–in the broad sense, not just the juxtaposition of races, but the mixing of ideas and philosophies with no dominant culture to maintain order. Current policies promoting this mess are insane.

We hate each other.

Countries are happiest when they have one national culture, or at least one dominant culture to which all must perforce conform. We see this in countries like Japan and Korea, homogeneous societies which, because homogeneous, have no race riots or religious wars. It was largely true in, for example, Sweden and France until they began admitting immigrants from incompatible cultures. Today, most of the news from such countries deals with the consequences.

Diversity, never a good idea. is in fact the cause of most of the world’s conflicts: Shia and Sunni, Jew and Arab, Hutu and Tutsi, Tamil and Sinhalese, Hindu and Muslim and, in America, black, white, and brown. Diversityis the cause of the dissolution of American society.

Until roughly the Sixties, America was homogeneous enough, overwhelmingly white, European, Anglophone, and Christian. This provided sufficient commonalty that people all regarded themselves as Americans. At the same time, there were many geographically separated subcultures which had little in common and didn’t like each other, or wouldn’t have if they had come into contact. Massachusetts, Montana, Alabama, West Virginia, and New York were different civilizations.

It worked because the different sections had little contact with each other. Life was intensely local. Roads were poor, limiting commerce. There was of course no internet. Telephone calls were expensive and there was no direct long-distance dialing. The federal government lacked the capacity to dictate to local communities. Radio meant local AM stations. Businesses were mostly owned locally with few chains run from remote corporate offices.

People consequently lived among others like themselves, who had the same values and ideas about how things should be done. In Virginia high school boys drove to school with shotguns in deer season so as to get to the woods when classes ended. It would have been unthinkable in Boston. In the Bible Belt the Ten Commandments might be on the wall in the courthouse, which everyone thought natural. Tidewater Virginia believed in gentility while West Virginia liked a wild and rough freedom. These wee not compatible yet there was no friction because pretty much everyone in these regions believed what everybody else did.

Then everything changed. Diversity began, not at first of people so much as of ideas. Reasons were several. Communications improved. Interstates appeared. The federal government gained in power and reach. The Supreme Court began making sweeping decisions on manners, morals and faith–that is, on culture and values–which it had not done before. Now Washington–New York, really–could enforce these decisions.

The result was unwanted cultural diversity. The Court decided in decision after decision that increasingly explicit pornography enjoyed protection as free speech, imposing an alien ideology on small towns in Kansas. This culminated in internet porn accessible to children of ten, uncontrolled and uncontrollable. Obscene music poured out of New York as local stations were bought by Manhattan, from which rap came–unfit, in most regions, for a toilet wall. Towns could not defend themselves because of the doctrine of free speech and the massively increased power of the northeast. Television became national with similar trampling of local values of faith, propriety, and race.

Particularly invasive was the newly invented doctrine of separation of church and state. For at least a hundred and fifty years no one, neither court nor individual, had noticed that the Constitution forbade manger scenes on the town square at Christmas, or the singing of carols on public streets, or mention of the Bible in schools. It was yet more compelled cultural diversity.

Then came the compulsory mixing of disparate populations that we usually think of today as diversity. First came the racial integration of blacks and whites, cultures with virtually nothing in common. It worked as well as was widely expected. The two differed sharply in manners, morals, attitudes to education, dress, and acquiescence to law. The result was the disaster we see daily in the news.

The Latinos came. While they resembled whites much more than did blacks, they were racially distinct and differed in culture. Hostility arose among native whites. who liked their culture as it was.

The obvious soon became evident to those not ideologically resistant to it: In matters cultural, you can’t have it both ways. When you mix in schools populations whose values are contradictory–say, those who believe in clean language and those three quarters of whose discourse consists of “motherfucker,” one side has to give. You cannot require half of the studentry to follow a dress code while allowing the other half to wear pants almost around their ankles. Those who did not eat pork or did eat dogs coexisted uneasily with those who had opposing dietary ideas. Those who mutilated their children’s reproductive organs in one manner (Christians and Jews) and those who did it in another (Muslims) came into conflict.

The less well diversity worked, the more furiously its advocates sought to impose it. Feminists arose, hostile to men and powerful enough to impose themselves on society. They pushed women into the infantry, where they did not fit and did not belong: more ill-advised diversity. Homosexuality went from being quietly tolerated to being taught to children in grade school. though their parents abominated it.

Those inhabiting the extreme reaches of political correctness imagine a world as they think it should be and then try to move into it, dragging everyone else along. I think of the Beatles insipidly crooning “All You Need is Love” in eternal adolescent sanctimony. They of course hated those who disagreed with them. Obama, who transparently liked neither whitens or America, imported many hundreds of thousands of immigrants who were almost impossible to assimilate. It was, I suspect, revenge for 1619.

It did not, of course, work. And so the papers carry endless stories of Islamophobia, dislike of Jews, attacks on Christianity, of misandry, looting of malls, burning of cities, White Nationalism, Black Lives Matter, calls for The Wall, novel policies regarding bathrooms, anger over Spanish on federal forms, affirmative action, perennial academic gaps, the demands of the various sexual curiosities, the Knockout Game, special privilege for this and that group, and a seething anger and despair over a country that many remember but no longer exists.

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago


Every school shooter I know of has been to therapistis and on prozac or some such drug.

Willie W's picture
Willie W 5 years 4 weeks ago

Hot Coffee,

#25 Wow! Your whole post made perfect sense to me. Today, everyone still wants it their way. Hard liners on both sides need to tone it down a notch. Solutions will only be possible when both sides can agree to give a little. Just saying we're going to look into it at this late date is just a cop out. The facts are already in.

stopgap's picture
stopgap 5 years 4 weeks ago

Wow is right! I have never read anything more racist and bigoted than Hot Coffee's delusional, self-centered, self-serving, interpretation of history. No facts, just hearsay and antidotal musings to support these claims.

Legend 5 years 4 weeks ago

I like how the author (not HC) says "Countries are happiest when they have one national culture". Then he uses Korea as a homogenous culture that works together. Does he not know about the Korean War, the DMZ, North and South Korea? How happy are they? Great example.

stopgap's picture
stopgap 5 years 4 weeks ago

Hey Rod, you forgot to indict Hot Coffee!

It occurred to me that when Rod Rosenstein read the particulars of the indictments of the 13 Russians and three Russian companies that interfered with the American Democratic elections, he was describing Hot Coffee. Deep seated hatred of Hillary, support for both Bernie and Trump to undermine Hillary's campaign, constant pitting of Hillary supporters against Bernie supporters in an effort to divide the Democratic party, showing selective support for both sides to muddy the American Democratic process, playing the race card to divide the American electorate.

2950-10K's picture
2950-10K 5 years 4 weeks ago

For all those who keep trying to subvert passionate momentum for gun control by commenting that both sides need to tone down and work together I say this....and I admit to saying it seemingly unsuccessfully many times before, but here goes again. When one side is drinking Kool-Aid such as Foxaganda, and Putinganda, that mindset/opinion has no more validity than the source of the information. So tell me how those pushing for truth and justice compromise with those afflicted with lies and misinformation? Belief in disinformation/lies only benefits the Fascist clinging to power with this weapon, not those who have been swayed by slick media presentation.

2950-10K's picture
2950-10K 5 years 4 weeks ago

Well said stopgap ...Bernie pretty much comfirmed what you are saying about the trolls with a comment to Chuck Todd just minutes ago.

BTW: Isn't it obvious by now why Crooked Donny isn't enforcing sanctions and going on offense against the attack on our democracy by Putin? Putin can destroy Trump, Pence, and a good chunk of the Kochbagger party in minutes. Remember, the Russians hacked the RNC too! "We the People" are no better off than our Russian counterparts right now...We need to show solidarity with the Russian citizens..Fascism is real, it's here!

stopgap's picture
stopgap 5 years 4 weeks ago

Amen 10K, Amen!

Legend 5 years 4 weeks ago

HC did not write that. He cut and pasted it.

jefflisse's picture
jefflisse 5 years 4 weeks ago


Thats quite the rant. I started to think that you were writing a book...

But what point are you really trying to make?
Are you saying we'd be better off in a segregated society?
An"us and them" society!

Are you saying we should return to a bygone era in our past?
And if so... What era was so great?
Please tell me when...

This country was founded by the ideals, of some wealthy, land owning, slave owning, aristocrats..
The expansion of this country was based on genocide, slavery, greed, bigotry,and a complete perversion of religion.. dont want to go back to the false, hypochristian, whitebread, "father knows best", " leave it to beaver" mentality?!?
Are you saying we'd be better off segregated??

Im not accusing you of anything..
But it sure sounds racist to me!

Please enlighten me...

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago


If you go back far enough in time what Country hasn't been...." founded by the ideals, of some wealthy, land owning, slave owning, aristocrats.." or some type of force upon the serfs?

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago

Too the questions above,

I wasn't saying anything except I found an article I thought was worthy of discussion, that made some interesting points. I'm glad some of you read and chose to consider how exactly did we get to this point in time. I did not pass judgement on weather the article was right or wrong. Like most things there was some of both.

Then there are those who choose to falsely accuse me of whatever, for their own purposes. The know it all's will continue to be know it all's, yet their are people who really are open to considering and learning.

People who are not brain washed by one side or the other.

No I don't think we should be segegated, no I'm not racisist, yes I think we should do much more to understand whats going on and why. To those who believe I am racisist I think you would be stunned at how many people of color come to my home and share joyful meals with me, as I do with them.

Also I'm not a he I'm a she.

stopgap's picture
stopgap 5 years 4 weeks ago

Hot Coffee, Be sure to share your pearls of wisdom from post #25 with all the many people of color that come to your house to share a joyful meal. I'm sure they will be most enlightened.

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago


You would be surprised how honestly we can talk about truth and idiotcy on both sides.

Unlike talking to you we would have no problems talking it over. Funny how people that love each other can talk about anything, and other people can only deal with what they want to hear.

Run along now and pat 2950 on the head for saying what you want to hear.

Just to set the record straight I said it was food for thought as to how did we get this way...not pearls of need to listen better. We did get to this point somehow didn't we...and most of the time one side does not carry ALL the blame. It really does take two to have a fight.

Now you SEEM to love Soros and Hate the Kochs....I don't think Soros or the Kochs should be able to be more than one man one vote, no matter how much money they have. I think there are many gun owners that would have thrown their bodies in front of that evil shooter to save those children and I think your wrong to to piss on all gun owners as if they are only your evil thoughts about them. I don't think anyone on prozac et al should be able to own a gun, but instead they take guns from medical pot consumers that are possibly the most peaceful people on earth.

I also notice you don't have any pearls of wisdom to add.

At least I can respect that Jeff has questions instead of the tit for tat you like to play.

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago

To carry on,

so why do my friends of color give me such grace to discuss such things?? Maybe because they have been my friends for over 30 years. Maybe because of all the times I brought my white butt into their neighborhood to register them to vote. Maybe because of all the times we gave each other a shoulder to cry on when life was harsh...I dunno.

Legend 5 years 4 weeks ago

So HC cuts and pastes an opinion from a very unknown source with no footnotes or references. And then takes both sides.

2950-10K's picture
2950-10K 5 years 4 weeks ago

BTW: I know how to spell confirmed.....LOL..just keyboard challenged.

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago


It happens when your thoughts go faster than your fingers. :)

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago

Yes Legend I know you want everything handed to you...yet provide none of those thing yourself. It's ok some children need to stay in the shallow end of the pool!

Try reading it again I didn't takes any side...I said it was food for thought. Such as....What role is increased travel and communications playing in whats going on..or Does the Northeast and the West have the right to dictate policy? How does leaving your extended family behind while you go find work elsewhere leaving your roots behind effect you. Just a couple so I don't confuse you.

Legend 5 years 4 weeks ago

I am certainly not confused. Post #29 sums it up.

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago

more food for thought

Rob Goldman, vice president of ads at Facebook, took to Twitter on Friday to applaud special counsel Robert Mueller's ongoing investigation of Russian trolls on social media. He also sought to clarify what he perceived as misconceptions surrounding Russian meddling in the U.S. political process.

"The main goal of the Russian propaganda and misinformation effort is to divide America by using our institutions, like free speech and social media, against us. It has stoked fear and hatred amongst [sic] Americans," he wrote on the social site.

"It is working incredibly well. We are quite divided as a nation," he added.

Facebook's Goldman stated that sowing chaos, not electing Trump, was Russia's primary intent in infiltrating American social media networks.

"Most of the coverage of Russian meddling involves their attempt to effect the outcome of the 2016 U.S. election. I have seen all of the Russian ads and I can say very definitively that swaying the election was *NOT* the main goal," he wrote on Twitter.

To prove his point, he referenced an anti-Islam protest in Houston in November 2017. Russian trolls were later shown to have organized both sides of the protest.

2950-10K's picture
2950-10K 5 years 4 weeks ago

Coffee: Kochpublicans deny climate change, they want severe cuts to Medicaid, Social Security, and Medicare, they're against DACA, most of them want huge increases in military spending , they're against gun control, they're against medicare for all, they're anti-union, and basically they want to deregulate every economic, environmental, and social protection we the people have fought hard to establish for decades.

People like you once argued that the world was flat, then they thought the earth was the center of the universe, then they thought white people should own black people...etc. etc. You and your party are sooo on the wrong side of's not even up for debate anymore...Fascism is evil, plain and simple!

BTW: I find it quite strange that you seem bothered by agreement between progressives on a progressive blog. Hmmm? What's up with that? GEEEZ.. I wouldn't even be offended if you grab Diane like Trump would...or just pat her on the head.

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago


But you have no problem with Bill Clinton shaking his finger in you face and straight out lying to you. Or Hillary calling Black people superpredators or calling Donna Brazille a dumb blind buffalo...Or Hillary trashing and threatening all the women that came forward about Billy Boy, Hipprocrite! "Fascism is evil, plain and simple!" Look in the mirror.

But maybe your right how dare anyone come here an suggest the people should come together and not be taken for fools over politics. I do apoligise for thinking there is some intelligence in there somewhere.

What is it you agree on? Who can say the nastiest BS about 1/2 of the nation??? Good Job, well done.

In a way I wish Hillary did win... But just so you could see past your own BS. Think of it she could sell off the rest of the country's assets and hide the money in her foundation, while selling your butt down the river.

HotCoffee's picture
HotCoffee 5 years 4 weeks ago

The Clintons closed military bases and cut the military, a military you might appreciate someday if Iran or N.Korea sends a few friendly Death to America bombs to your neighborhood. You might even think it was stupid to make the men wear high heels....for what???

Getting America to play nice just won't make every other country nice. Wake up!

changeX's picture
changeX 5 years 4 weeks ago

Who funds alec? Don't our elected representatives write the laws?

Legend 5 years 4 weeks ago

Numerous other sites. Took a few seconds to research. ALEC:

Thom's Blog Is On the Move

Hello All

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Please follow us across to - this will be the only place going forward to read Thom's blog posts and articles.

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