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DAnnemarc: I am not, of course, targeting you, personally, about religion. I am addressing a wider audience (if they even bother to actually read what I have said..and I am not foolish enough to think that they are). ;-}
I am going to try to find the lyrics of the songs you mentioned. If I can read the lyrics while listening to the songs it might make some sense to me. Thanks for your recommendations. Have you ever heard the one about playing the Beatles "I am the Walrus" backwards? And did you ever listen to the Art Bell "Frantic Caller episode"?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ee3bld4lTG0
Seems to me that the ruling elite uses both the Republican and the Democrat parties, and their propagandists, to scare the people into accepting the futility of rebelling against the ruling elite. The Republicans try to make the Democrats look evil and manipulative...and the Democrats try to make the Republicans evil and manipulative. By both parties pointing fingers at the other party, they manage to divide and conquer.
It is funny how some people can rail against gun owners while ignoring the fact that this country was founded on armed rebellions to begin with. They ignore the fact that our founding fathers...Presidents like TJ has said that citizens have a duty to take up armed rebellion against a tyrannous government. Would we not agree that it would have been nice to see an armed German citizen's rebellion against Hitler? Just how far are we going to let our tyrannous ruling elite control our government that works against the majority of people in this country?
I am certainly not Republican. I consider myself Democrat..or rather, of late, Independent (Green Party). And I think there are a lot of others, who are not Republican, who believe that we are running out of options..because there aren't any anymore. The game's up..it's already becoming a life-or-death situation for many who can no longer afford to live in this criminal empire....more and more people are starting to realize that the two party system is a scam and anti democratic.
Palindromedary ~ BTW I'd just like to thank you for your sincere efforts to "help me" out of my seemingly brainwashed "faith". You are very kind and considerate to be concerned and I deeply appreciate the thought. But remember, I'm a very deep thinking and practical person. Believe me when I say I had a deeply spiritual experience in my life that changed my opinion of the supernatural. I wish I could have shared that experience; but, that isn't possible. The Bible has played a minor role in that process--nothing more.
I resorted to the Bible because I was outraged by pamphlets left on my car when I was in college about anti-abortionists. They quoted the Bible all over the pamphlets. I decided that the Bible was so vague that two could play at that game. I looked up the verses that were in the pamphlet and was shocked to find them quoted out of context to the point that the original meanings had nothing to do with abortion. I then read the Bible. You see, I'm quite gifted with the ability to interpret literature on deep metaphorical and sociological levels. I decided to use my gift to write a paper denouncing the anti-abortion activists using their own source. I was shocked to realize how easy that was going to be. The truth of the matter is that the Bible--or at least many parts of it--actually supports a much more practical way of life than we are led to believe by the members of the 'fundamentalist' movement in this country. You might say every con has a bit of truth to it. (I wouldn't be one bit surprised if the same is true of 'fundamental' Islam and the Koran in the Muslim world.) All of our Institutionalized Religious problems--in my opinion-- are the result of the same cause.
I consider the Bible to be a tool, not evidence of anything real. I don't doubt it has been used and misused by those with hidden agendas to mislead and control people for private desires. Please understand that when I cite the Bible I only cite parts that I believe are wise and universally true. Because I cite a verse doesn't mean I believe the whole book. I tend to only wish to appeal to those who believe the whole book to help them think; much like you have tried to achieve with me.
Don't worry about me my friend. I'm not like anyone you've ever met. If you knew me better you would know that. Regardless, I understand and appreciate your concerns ;-)
That video I suggested you watch I find much more spiritually arousing than the vast majority of the Bible. Do Enjoy!!
Ken Ware wrote ~ (Concerning The Thom Hartmann show) "He has a tendency to slant the facts in his program and blog when it comes to blaming the Republicans for everything that is wrong and he also has a habit of making the Democrats look better than they actually are. "
"Tendency?" "Habit?" If you ask me Thom's entire show is a Democratic cheerleading dance. Probably written into his contract by his syndicators and promoters. Other than that little under exaggeration Ken, your on fire with accurate observation. We need to drop these stupid labels we've attached to ourselves. They sow discord and are self defeating. What is a Democrat? What is a Liberal? What is a Conservative? Really!! These words mean nothing to everyone, and something different to anyone. The only purpose they serve is to divide, and weaken the electorate. We share more simularities and are more alike than we realize. We are first and foremost Americans! Until we stop playing these stupid word games we will continue to allow our meaningless differences and personal expectations to do what the small wealthy minority that run everything can't do--prevent ourselves from coming together and solving our problems; namely, the wealthy minority.
Palindromedary ~ I strongly suggest that you and everyone else who is fed up with the current paradigm take the time to check out those music links I posted yesterday about The Grateful Dead--Especially the "Throwing Stones" video. The lyrics are available on line but that video goes way beyond lyrics. It uses masterful musicianship and spectacular imagery to get its meaning across. I've never seen anything like it before or since. It was done with 1987 technology. Nothing I've seen since comes close to this. Perhaps you have seen something and can share? Anyone else? Here's the "Throwing Stones" link again for anyone who missed it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WninWFtO0Gg
Enjoy all! Don't forget to share!
I have to agree with kend. I try hard and work hard to get ahead and work long hours. I fully support paying my fair share but I also fully support keeping the fair share that I alone earned. I support charities when I can and pay my tax bill each month. Any more than that is unreasonable and I might as well move to Russia.
As for the Republicans supporting violence, that is a desperate gimmick for ratings!!
Timothy Gilmore: And all those phrases would have been very convenient to the Roman Empire in their partially successful plot to get the Jews conquered not only militarily but in their minds as well.
The Romans wanted the Jews, and all their other "subjects" to worship their Emperors (instead of an invisible myth in the sky) and stop being such a pain-in-the-butt messianic militarists...to stop rebelling and "give unto Caesar what belongs to Caesar" and "do not rebel against your masters"...to paraphrase quotes from the bible.
Our modern day Roman Emperors want the same thing...to completely rule over us...for us to "give unto the ruling class what they believe belongs to them"...everything. So, as long as believers continue to believe that they will get their just rewards in heaven, the ruling elite gets what really matters in this world...all the gold..opulence...power..comfort...security...and even happiness. Because with well being, comfort and security usually comes much more happiness than those who are struggling to survive. Everyone else, the believers, are left a terrible struggle to survive in the midst of the greedy ruling elite.
The militaristic messianic Jews successfully drove the Romans out in 66AD..which showed that they could do it...but their freedom didn't last long because the Romans came back in and laid siege to Jerusalem after destroying Galilee and several other towns, then destroyed the temple (in 70AD), and destroyed all copies of the Jewish literature in Judea except the one that Titus gave to Josephus to use in creating the new Christian religion. The other surviving literature of the 1st century AD, the Dead Sea Scrolls, gave a more accurate picture of what Judea was like in those days. No mention of Jesus, of course, and it was all messianic and militarist hatred of the Romans. There were no movements in the DSS depicting peaceniks roaming around the countryside telling people they had to "turn the other cheek"..or "do unto others as you expect others to do unto you". That is just what the Romans wanted..for the Jews to turn the other cheek and accept their submission to Rome.
The Romans realized that they needed to prevent future rebellions by conquering the minds of the Jews. They partially succeeded when they took the wind out of messianic rebellion by inventing the peace-preaching, pacifist, Jesus, which was the beginnings of the Christian church.
Those sly devils, the Romans, knew how to play with people's minds...a real psyops sleight of hand. Today's Romans, the ruling elite, use the same psychological propaganda to rule over people's minds. When you control people's minds, you control the people. It is slavery of another color. A variegated hodgepodge of confusion purposely propagated down the centuries by the ruling elite to control the masses.
While the ruling elite propaganda propagates ideas like "a rich man has as much chance of going to heaven as a camel going through the eye of a needle". Propagandized believers pick up on those catchy metaphors and similes thinking they have something over on the rich but in reality the rich are laughing at you...all the way to their offshore banks. They know, that in the end, we all merely rot away and there is no such thing as heaven or hell, devils or gods, no soles except in the minds of people who have been proselytized and propagandized into believing that they exist. Yes, many of the ruling elite will put on a pretense...maybe even some actually believe their own nonsense to an extent...so that they can help to continue the great lie..that has become so useful to those ruling elite that hide behind the skirts of the church.
Did not Pope Leo X say "It has served us well, this myth of Christ"? Christianity, as initially invented by Josephus Bar Mathias who became Josephus Flavian, after he became a Jewish rebel turncoat and flattered Vespasian and Titus invented Jesus and early Christianity. Early Christianity was a Paganized Judaism modified to emphasize that it's followers should not rebel against the Romans. In fact, the Pagan Priests moved right into the Catholic Church becoming the new early Catholic Church fathers.
The real fools are the ones who are used by the ruling elite. The ruling elite live very well until they die...the masses live poorly until they die. And at death, they are all equal...both rotting away in a natural decaying process. There are no rewards after death. The rich want the poor to believe that they don't have to rebel against the rich because they will get their rewards in heaven...or 67 virgins... or... whatever. It's all just pure nonsense and fiction to keep you from rebelling and keeping the ruling elite wealthy and powerful.
As a person on the right I think we are just getting tried of paying more and more of the "fair share". Year after year taxes just keep climbing. People on the right don't want Socialism. We believe we have the right to be unequal. If you want to work your 7 1/4 hours a day with your six weeks of government holidays I have no problem with that but I believe that if I took huge risks and worked 18 hours a day 7 days a week why should my fair Share share be bigger than yours. I would stand up and fight for our way of life if I wanted Socialism I would join the Omish.
you are SO right about the 'land-grant' colleges having reneged on their promise.
Unfortunately, it's not just Republicans who feel disenfranchised to the point of armed revolt. When our government is actively engaged in criminal doings worldwide... what are we as citizens to do?
Although I'm a senior citizen on Social Security, with little else, and can see the black hole at the end of my tunnel, I would be strongly inclined to take up arms again (I was a good sharpshooter with rifles from the shoulder and the hip as a youngster) if the right wing theocrat nuts who want to return to the 17th century took charge. I hope we can find the leadership somewhere to defang these snakes. The current President is an incompetent inept nincompoop who has let the wingnuts paint him into a corner where he can't do much of anything but whine. We need another LBJ who could get results despite a a crazy recacitrant opposition.
Of course Thom is right, although I think the results of the survey of republicans is stretching the point a bit--a lot, actually. The conservatives who deny global warming, who think that if you register your gun it's going to be snatched away from you, the ones who believe greed is good are the dangerous ones. The damage that the conservatives are doing to our economy and our society is severe. How can this country survive when the top 1 or 2% owns so much of the wealth and the rest of us own so little (don't remember the exact figures right now)? Tthat's not sustainable. Our capitalist economy is based on consumerism and if people do not have the money to consume--to buy houses or cars or food or appliances or whatever--what happens to the economy?It keeps plummeting. There is no such thing as a "trickle-down" (successful) economy. We can only survive if we start redoing things like taxes and raising minimum wages and stop destroying unions so that the middle class and the poor have half a chance. More and more, opportunity is lost for those who are not wealthy, who cannot afford college or any advanced education, who are shut out of the economy. There is virtually no "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" anymore. The children of the poor are also poor; the children of the rich are also rich.
I come from a lower middle class family and it was only because land-grant colleges were supposed to (and did then) have manageable tuition and fees so that I could put myself through school that I could boost myself into the middle class and make decent money--and pay taxes and contribute to the economy. We know--statistics prove it--that education is THE key to greater prosperity in a state or country.
When you buy into this nonsense, you perpetuate the system and the inevitable death of the economy.
Hello Ken Ware ... You've made several good points. Your last point >> A violent uprising could only end with tragic consequences for the people of our nation. We would not survive a second civil war. << is the best.
Hello Ken Ware ... You[ve made several good points. Your last point >> A violent uprising could only end with tragic consequences for the people of our nation. We would not survive a second civil war. << is the best.
The way I see it, everyone in washington is a terrorist.
Ken Ware - Thom's piece said that "According to a survey conducted by Fairleigh Dickinson University" nearly half of the Republican Party is ready to see blood running in the streets. Hmmm. FDU is a small independent school in New Jersey. He used the word "survey". I wonder if that's different than a "poll". Is it more regional? I'm not placing a lot of weight on this "survey", and even though I'm the furthest thing from a Republican, I give them more credit than that. Mr. H does tend to sensationalize at times. Your point about "who were these republicans?" is a good one.
Ken Ware,
God ? Nature ? External super natural sentience ? I have no clue and in that I have no clue I don't rule anything out. However oddly enough there always seems to be another mystery behind every mystery solved , why is that, what is that ? Again I have no clue other than it's there , remains there and persists to be so. Incredible ! Awesome ! Worthy of moments of reverence regardless of how you fathom the mechanics and seemingly limitless scope of it all . I am a product of and in participation with the precondition of my existence. My recognition of that circumstance is as close to a "Religion" as I ever hope to achieve.
Outback - You are right on the point when it comes to Hartmann's blog today. I would like to know how many Republicans were polled and where are these people located that were polled?
Ken Ware. Kudo's and Ditto. Time will tell.
Thom's point regarding the "real threat" being the militant right wing of the Republican Party is moot. I don't believe for a minute that the power brokers in this country subscribe to any ideology but money - and more of it (for themselves)! They play us against each other. It's to the advantage of the corporate heads, the Wall Street moguls and the elites in the political class (all three branches) to keep the masses at each other's throats. Don't listen to the media (including Mr. Hartmann on this point). It's a distraction. While with the one hand they rile you up and get you sweating about Jihad and violent domestic revolt, they pick your pocket with the other. The real threat to this country is that it's being gutted by a very wealthy minority.
IntermeDx -- why look at other countries for the correlation between union control and productivity? In the US in the 50's union participation was around 35% and is now at 7%. I thought the US productivity has remained relative constant. Just a note if you plan deeper analysis. For any measure of cause (union control) and effect (productivity) we always have to keep in mind the lag time of economics, which on average is 7 years.
On the other hand using productivity as a metric for an ecomony is fraught with peril; even worse than the GDP by itself. I think a better metric for the economy is that given by Larry Beinhart. He says we should look at the combination of the DOW, the GDP, the number of jobs created and the median wage (inflation adjusted). The combination is not a nice polynomial but rather that all 4 indicators should be positive. This non-continuous metric seems to measure what Adam Smith was describing. The thing that really makes it a valid metric is that Larry is not an economist.
Thanks for the info. Sounds like something I need to know when my warranty expires.
stonesphear - Somewhat dramatic to say the least! The greedy have always been here and will always be here. There will be changes and they will be slow and perhaps painful for the masses. Reformation through policy change will be far more beneficial to the nation and world then through violent means. I once thought it would take a violent uprising to change the state we are presently in. But the end results would not outweigh the destruction a violent revolution would inflict physically and economically on us all. So hopefully the American voters will get up off their asses and vote in the next election. The politicians and wealthy fear the vote more than they fear the gun. But, it will take more than a mere 50% of the population voting as has been the fact in the last election, to make changes that benefit us all. The sad thing is that we may never enact change because most Americans believe what they hear on the tube instead of researching and trying to find the truth in matters for themselves. And if that ends up being the situation in the future, we may just see violence run rampant across America, by the masses that are being trotted upon by the politicians, corporations and the very wealthy, here in American and around the World...K.W.
awake 108 - What does it say about those of us who do not believe in your God(s)? Are we perceived as being lesser of greater in the mentally ill category, than those who believe in some (their) God? How about we just try to be the best we can be and let God take of his or her business and we take care of our own without the interference of a deity! Seems like people might just try to live a better life if this is the only one we get versus believing someone is taking care of us and we will live forever when we return to dust....K.W.
Stonesphear - Good Point! Thanks for the explanation. K.W.
I meant to write - I am not sure, "not use". I need to spell check.