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We've strayed so far off the topic Thom initially selected for discussion, I can't even remember what it was! But there are a number of points Ken Ware has made, concerning Private Manning and Wikileaks, that beg a response. So here goes...
Bradley Manning & Julian Assange are true heroes on the world stage. They should be celebrated, not persecuted, for what they've done. These guys are more deserving of a Nobel Peace Prize than Kissinger or Obama ever were. Seems to me that if justice were actually being served, the folks who would be facing trial are the REAL war criminals - Bush, Cheney & Company - rather than the whistle blowers who exposed them.
If these were legitimate wars waged against real enemies who posed an eminent threat to our freedom & soverignty, I'd be inclined to agree that any act committed which lowered soldiers' morale or somehow hindered our ability to fight would be a terrible thing. But the last war this country participated in that had any legitimacy whatsoever was World War Two,
Kend, you are right. It is impossible to get through to these economic airhead Obama drones about the laws of free market economics. Money always tries to move where it is most efficient. They always think they can tweak the codes a little here a little there to get people to do what they want. Trillion dollar deficits can go on forever because the rich will always be there to pay their LIONS share and the federal reserve will support us with the printing press. Inflation is that thing that they all hear about but don't understand as they complain that they can't keep up with the Joneses.
Well now, as a freedom-lover and a traitor-hater, I think the republicans should be renditioned to Syria. I think they would enjoy that. After all, they all say that waterboarding is not torture and that even if it is torture, it's fine to do it if you're trying to save America, so ok, those are their rules, so let's rendition them puppies and gitter done.
Kend - I was about to mention the fact that you know less about who pays taxes and who doesn't than I gave you credit for. But you know what, that would dignify your statement from a Canadian who obviously knows very little about our system. Do yourself a favor and go ice fishing in your frozen waste land...I find it hard to believe a person who has free insurance from his government has the balls to criticize us...But you have once again confirmed my belief that you people north of our border have frozen brains and an inability to grasp reality.
Three Cheers for the moral of whistle blowers and truth seekers!!!
It use to be the truth would set you free...as long as you don't have anything important to say.
Sometimes the truth is hard to accept, but for a soldier their is nothing worse than discovering the very government you work for lies and cheats the American People and tortures and murders innocent men women and children. If you have to lie and cheat and torture inorder to "wage war" - as you put it - than maybe it isn't the other guy that's the problem to begin with.
There is no doubt in my mind that your generation is still licking its wounds from the lies and corruption of the U.S. government.
Condeming Pvt. Manning for exposing our Governments corrupt ties, and dispicable actions very ugly!!!As is blamming Fonda for speaking out against the Vietnam war and killing innocent people.
My uncle was a combat soldier in Vietnam and received a dishonarable discharge and one year in prison for beating an Officer that was raping a 14 year old Vietnamese girl after slitting her mothers throat.
As soldiers we both know that war is hell, it can make you do crazy things that we never in 10 life times would ever dream of doing. The military labled my Uncle as dishonerable for his actions, yet the rapist murderer officer was never arrested and charged for the crime he commited. Its a f*cked up world!!! That's the kind of bullsh*t that destroys morale!
Yes Pvt Manning leak classified information, but he did it for ALL THE RIGHT REASONS...To protect and serve the very country he loves and cares about.
As far as cutting Medicare benefits or increasing the age for getting benefits or raising prices are concerned: Over. My. Dead. Body. Literally. We -- my husband and I -- will no longer be able to survive.
Wow! Thanks MMUOIO. That info is very useful.
If not too much trouble would you mind citing your sources so that we in other States may ascertain similar data?
To those of us afflicted by cutbacks -- jobs stolen, food stamps slashed, Social Security offices closed -- the United States is already a "deadbeat nation."
Personally I'm tired of the Republicans getting away with good business strategy and negotiation skills. Maybe taking Obama to the wood shed during his first term might be explainable; but, being manipulated and maneuvered so professionally during his second term with four years experience with these bozos and their tricks, and nothing politically to loose, would really expose him as a Republican Puppet.
There are far too many simple cards he can play to get what he wants. If they don't work he has the joker card of an executive order; and, he can all ways declare a national emergency and do anything he wants. (Thanks to the Bush administration) I'd love to see him play that card with these Republicans. Of course the best part of the ridiculous acquisition of power of the Bush years is that now Obama only has to threaten to pull that card to get his way.
The Republican constituents have far too much to loose to even consider risking calling such a bluff. If Obama rolls over and plays dead after all the clout he has, he's lost what's left of my faith.
If the republicans are deported who will pay all the bills? Obamas tax increases are sending them to tax free countries. You guys sound like a bunch of spoiled teenagers, come on mommy I need those $300 jeans. The rich have them.
If the politicians were doing their jobs - they would be going after corporate tax evaders like google, not seniors, the disabled and the poor.
On Monday, Bloomberg's Jesse Drucker reported that the tech giant avoided paying $2 billion in global income taxes by moving $10 billion in revenue, or 80 percent of its pretax profit, to Bermuda, which does not have a corporate income tax. Google has nearly doubled the amount of money that it is sheltering in Bermuda since 2008.
I live in Wisconsin...all we hear is the nonsense about job creators and corporate taxes.
This is all nonsense....in 2011 the individuals of Wisconsin paid $6.3 Billion in state taxes, corporate taxes in the state totalled $900 Million.
But here's is the reality....Corporations received $1.53 BILLION in tax rebates, concrssions etc........so the way I see it we transferred $600 Million to the Job Creators......makes one wonder just how they produced record profits....hum....I guess it may have been revealed here....
How many Republicans in Wisconsin know this? More than the Democrats.....we need to spead the word by every state.
Gerrymandering and fraud has permitted many states like Wisconsin to be controlled by these neo-fascists.
If programs are to be cut, how about the entitlements of the Congress? Such as the free trips around the world. Is it necessary for a Congressman or Senator to go the Iraq, Afgan., Lybia etc??? Don't we have a Secretary of State? What about hosting lobbiest?
What is the dollar amount for these trips with all the entourge? Just to say they have been there, but nothing is accomplished for the money spent. When I was in the military, it was up to the leader to keep moral up.
Can these Republicons be deported? they are criminals, trying to undermine the majority of the population of the United States, -----send them to the Cayman Islands, no return visas, ever! ---just saying!
KOCH BROTHERS' CAMPAIGN BRIBES IS BEHIND ALL THOSE POLITICIANS WHO SAY SOCIAL SECURITY IS GOING BANKRUPT. LAST I HEARD, SOCIAL SECURITY HAD 1.6 TRILLION DOLLARS IN AVAILABLE SAVED FUNDS, THAT'S NOT COUNTING THE ONGOING AMOUNTS DEDUCTED FROM EVERY WORKER'S PAYCHECKS.
THE LIE OF S.S. LOOMING BANKRUPTCY FIRST STARTED WHEN EX-PRESIDENT BUSH STOLE MOST OF OUR SOCIAL SECURITY'S MONEY CLAIMING HE SPENT IT ON THE WAR IN IRAQ, WHICH HAS NEVER BEEN PROVEN. SINCE THEN SOCIAL SECURITY DOUBLE- DOWNED ON TAX RATES AND REFILLED THE SOCIAL SECURITY COFFERS .THEY SHOULD NOT RAISE THE AGE FOR FULL OR PARTIAL SOCIAL SECURITY BENEFITS AT ALL, OR CUT BENEFITS AND THERE IS NO JUSTIFICATION FOR SO DOING..WE THE PEOPLE NEED TO LEGISLATE THAT IF MONEY IS EVER AGAIN STOLEN FROM OUR SOCIAL SECURITY FUND FOR ANY OTHER PURPOSE, THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT MUST REPAY THE FUND IN FULL, WITH HIGH INTEREST, AND IF NECCESARY REPAY IT OUT OF MILITARY MONEY OR OIL COMPANY SUBSIDIES
I think the Democrats will call their bluff. They don't dare do it again. Not with their owners -- I mean business community telling them they have to settle this or the country slides into another depression with a small d.
This made no sense before, and I think more Americans know it makes even less today.
No Fraud - There is one very important part of this whole Manning case that most of us leave out, that aid to the enemy does not have to include specific details that could hamper our ability to wage war such as when an operation will take place or the type of aircraft we will be using on a specific mission. It goes further than that in giving aid to the enemy. The information released by Manning and Aussange could have very well affected the operational readiness or the ability for our troops to wage war with 100% reediness. Whether it is the Grunt or Marine on the ground or an Aircrew in the sky to Sailors on a navy vessel their state or mine is an essential part of a warrior. And it does not only affect the combat troops but also the support personnel in every unit of the military. They unwittingly could have had a strong and adverse effect on the MORALE of all troops after hearing information that could affect the way they view their commanders or even the Commander in Chief in the White House. This as we know is a very effective way to diminish the reediness and ability of all troops. In WWII the Japanese had Tokyo Rose who was an American citizen working for the Japanese Military. She had a great effect on the morale of all the fighting men in the Pacific Campaign. She was hung after we had won the war. Jane Fonda had the same effect on our Troops and Airmen in the Vietnam theatre and those in countries we had our air bases located. Thailand was an area where our B-52's flew from and it had an effect on these troops as well, it also affected all the sailors on the carriers and support ships. She went to N. Vietnam to embrace the Communists and to tell our troops they were fighting a losing war and were killing children, just to mention a few things she said to the World news organizations. Both of these women gave aid to the enemy as American citizens. Fonda was never charged. So if Manning or Assaunge helped to demoralize American Troops they did in fact give aid to the enemy. Aid and I do not believe I am pushing the limits when I say they very well have given aid to our enemies while at war with them. Manning has been treated in a way that is wrong and should be looked into if he is found guilty or acquitted. If convicted he should serve a short prison term and be stripped of his rank and all pay. Again I believe the Marines who have guarded him since his arrest should be investigated for mistreatment of a prisoner. Unfortunately the Marines guarding him hold him in great disdain and see him as a traitor to the United States and our Military. If it is found that Aussange is found to be guilty of the same crime by a court, he too should be incarcerated for a short period. My point is giving aid to our enemies can take on various forms and we should not dismiss the MORALE of our fighting men as trivial. Whether or not they have indeed given aid to the enemy is something for the Military Courts or the Federal Courts to decide.
Time for T.H.U.
It IS time for the official opening of Thom Hartmann University!
Business owned schools
also get to (more or less) control curriculum and course content.......
-- history of human rights and labor rights....?
-- environmental studies?
-- global warming...?
Will schools just be training camps for the next wave of obedient and brain-washed "perfect" employees for the corporate consortium?
On the young man from Towson State on the white race; What he does not see is that what is oppressing him is what has been used succesfully against people of color, divide and conquer. Income inequality is a major part of divided and conquer and knows really no bounds, race, creed, gender etc. although cases can be made within thst discussion, income ineqaulity that can prove discrimination, I am pointing towards the overall or macro if you will effect. The 1% are that tiny tiny number, 9.9 out of 10 of us are not in that group and that number gets tossed around so much, I feel that many do not pause and actually see that as THE problem. Yes, whites are having problems, but not from any color groups looking to out them into chains, that is more a function of guilty conscience imho, the reality of their situation traces to that tiny .1, 1%. That small group will play one off against another, I feel this is at the heart of the energy that drove the creation of the Tea Party; whites can clearly now see the same tidal wave approaching them that has consumed people of color and are trying to head that off but they mistake the source of that wave. It is NOT from people of color. The progression, success of people of color is patterend off of the template of whites, is it not ? Education, religion etc., so there will be a degree to where those who had less now have more and this young man sees that, imho, as the threat when that threat IS the 1%, pulling the strings willing to sacrifice a few million here and there, of any color, of any creed or gender to protect and further their 1% intertests; Again, it is time to take that number, 1%, not as a semantic thing but as the reality and the source of many of our problems.
The Chalice and The Blade..
- I urge Listeners to read Thom's books
and to check out Riane Eisler's book,
The Chalice and The Blade.
"Whites Only".........................
Thank you for raising the question of societies that value predatory function vs. the cooperative model.
Brilliant Rebuttal.
Water Babies?
No one has ever really explained those fetal gills either, as far as I can tell......
We need to change the conversation on the SSN (Social Safety Net) loudly to one thing.....a Bankster Transaction Tax to be dedicated entirely and in perpetuity to helping fund the SSN. After all, the criminals should be reminded forever what they did to this country.
Adventure through the rabbit hole, with smiles cheerful thoughts in a time past that was not always fun. Here am I to offer my opinion of language in today’s electronic mainstream journalism can be defined as warped timed deception and completely biased beyond what is good for America. Those within this blog see it and like me want to rid of it.
The Indian stuff strikes a accord that resonates found memories, personal or other. Also, recall from a book by Ruth Beebe Hill, “Hanta Yo”. Very interesting about the Plains Indian during the 1800’s sometime just before Lincoln signed the land act to preserve the union and created the Union Pacific Railroad. There is a whole lot of history there. A Republican railroad?
For me words and feelings are unusual with this message. As a Vietnam veteran finding out the Navajo language was used during WWII helping to defeat the Nazi tyranny. Knowing war, now plus understanding giving total respect for an Indian nation language that baffled the Nazi. One of my favorite Navajo Chants is “Yeha-Noha (Wishes of Happiness & Prosperity)”
If you have chances try to find it. It is video combination song with what sounds like an old man done in a popular style. In my weirdness sometimes study the mathematics of greats like Laplace, Fourier, and Gauss while listing to Yeha Noha, weird eh?
For me, summing up Thom’s theme in the message; Republicans are giving in Michigan what is simply constitutionally antithetical.
Sure the first amendment has free speech so the door is open for debate to support or oppose the constitution but when one is elected and taking or making oath to both the States constitution and the national constitution but failing to support the national constitution the media is a total failure in calling these political persons out that make and take both sides.
What’s worse the Democratic Party lets it happen. For years, besides, legions of academic individuals and institutions play theater with journalism royalties in appearance interviews and book selling all the while Middle America is in a depression of more than just spirit. Yes, since those in the know, like BDO, know America is in a depression not a recession. America is on the cliff going to fall to economic hell. Quite an extraordinary display of language in fear mongering day after day while cable can also broadcast miracle on 34 th street to determine if Santa Claus is insane or exists. Likely leading to the proposition that Jesus does not exist too. Who knows maybe the movie was funded by Richard Murdock and the Wahhabi decades ago. LOL.
The most antithetical Constitutional position is secession. But the real kicker is all those states that want to part from the union, from what I understand do not participate in a fair tax to the commonwealth of the system. In many discussions it is acknowledged Red states have a history of being the taker of taxes rather than the makers of taxes.
This all begs the question. When will these states go so America can finally have another party that is competitive? They will certainly just diminish. One thing is for sure, in one signature, Lincoln created a whole lot of jobs.
Soo oh oh the government without question can create jobs.
You who, Republicans did you get that. Laughter giggle yowee. Like the Geico pig, Maxwell shouts in those commercials I keep switching off. Is there a way to rid of that lizard???