I'm not sure. I am observing that we tend to rely on a leader to absolve ourselves our own responsibilities, we also prop them onto pedestals and then berate them for human frailties.
On a completely different subject, Is particle spin observed in three spatial dimensions a reflection of momentum of saId particle in a fourth?
Many years ago I was sitting in a college classroom, where a quest lecturer was providing the assembled students with the contents of her editorial experience. During this lecture, I was busy with pen and paper, scribbling without cease. The guest lecturer was much impressed with my fascination with her great learning, and effort not to lose one morsel of it. She crept a little closer to where I was sitting, perhaps so that I would not miss a single syllable.
But something was amiss; why was the student sitting next me gazing at my handiwork with at first a quizzical look, then recognition, followed by silent laughter? Because, it seems, that I wasn’t exactly engaged in studious note-taking, but something I often did when I was bored in class: rotisserie baseball doodling. Ever since I could read a box score, I was fascinated with the numbers and statistics involved. I was no good at geometry or algebra, but I sure was a wiz at figurin’ batting averages, slugging percentages and ERAs in my head.
At my current place of employment, it is also important to be know basic math, mainly adding and multiplying. It seems however, that the people who are supposed to be most proficient at it only pretend to be, or someone thinks they are supposed to be. You have these “smart” people (i.e. pallid-complexioned) propped in front of computer screens and attempting to tabulate how much weight goes where on an a/c, which is not that difficult, but the people who do that make it seem so, either out of pretense, or their amateurs. I tend to think the latter, because the gate sheets I need to make deliveries are only fit for the trash can an hour after they’ve been printed out. “Musical Gates” is a game that is only “fun” for those “superior” people sitting in front of their computer terminals, apparently because correcting math errors only means moving this number to here, and that number to there, without having to bother what effect their constant mistakes have on the people outside who have to transform those mistakes into corrective action. I figure I could do just as well or better, but then again, that would mean they are not better, as they wish to think.
In keeping in this vein, it would seem that a working knowledge of simple addition and subtraction would be a prerequisite for being a banker. If you were a banker who gave away all the bank’s money for nothing and no questions asked, with no stipulation that it ever be paid back, should you be allowed to continue in that fashion—let alone even keeping your job? Well, apparently that is what Ben Bernanke and the Republicans think. Bernanke and the FED have given away trillions of dollars with no clue where it went or why. Most of it is fake money, of course, but what’s a few trillion in phony money between friends? With the CBO reporting that most of the TARP money will be paid back, the current adminsitration seems to be a better banker than the real ones. And yet Bernanke and the Republicans would have you and me cover for their own wretched bungling, having the absolute gall to advocate covering this private debt by doing away with public services like Social Security and Medicare—and replacing them with what? TIME magazine had a cover story recently that advocated “retiring” the 401k, because of its volatility; pension plans are increasingly becoming extinct, and we all know about the monstrosity that is private health insurance. The rich, of course, have not the slightest idea of the suffering of those at the other end of the wealth spectrum, so we can expect such insensitivity.
It is interesting to note that the U.S. has the lowest tax rate in the civilized world, which Republican math calculates is the reason why the country’s economy is in such “great shape” despite double-digit unemployment. It’s always nice have friends who are also rich to remind you of that.
Abbie Hoffman once observed that "we are all quarterbacks," and we tend to Disney-fy leaders and history, anyway. Consider MLK, the media would have you believe that he had a dream, won civil rights and then turned over and went back to sleep, not gone on to denounce Viet Nam and economic issues.
What do all movements have in common? Is it that there has been someone to get out in front of the parade? Do we need a "leader?" If so, where IS that person?
You echo my sentiments. Millions of people out in the streets around the world didn't make any difference. I don't think protests are useful to anyone except FOX Noise. Logistically, what else can be done, though, I wonder? Thom talks about "movement politics." How, exactly, would this work (or would it?)
THREATS AND RESPONSES: NEWS ANALYSIS; A New Power In the Streets
By PATRICK E. TYLER
Published: Monday, February 17, 2003
The fracturing of the Western alliance over Iraq and the huge antiwar demonstrations around the world this weekend are reminders that there may still be two superpowers on the planet: the United States and world public opinion.
In his campaign to disarm Iraq, by war if necessary, President Bush appears to be eyeball to eyeball with a tenacious new adversary: millions of people who flooded the streets of New York and dozens of other world cities to say they are against war based on the evidence at hand.
One of my largest frustrations, and my first anti-war street demonstration was in '67 with my folks, is that the Bush administration managed to completely overwhelm demonstrated public anger.
And I didn't see Barack Obama as the leader of the anti-war movement. (He did give an anti-Iraq invasion speech.)
What happened? We saw the Bush administration launch pre-emptive arrests of protest groups and leaders, free-speech zones, TV media freeze-outs, etc. Would any news analyst today argue that public opinion represents a balance to corporate/military power?
Randy Shaw on Common Dreams lists the reasons many liberals and activists set the bar so low for the goals Obama would be able to achieve and why that's hurting us now. http://www.commondreams.org/view/2009/12/07-11
I bought into the idea that we needed to defend President Obama too, feeling that he wouldn't get elected if we criticized him too much. And after the election, I felt that we needed to defend him so that he could get the progressive agendas he had promised us passed. He kept telling us to be patient, that congress moves slowly...
In the meantime, Thom and so many other progressive leaders have been telling us that we MUST keep pushing him to the left or he will be pushed to the right.
I think the problem is that President Obama led so much of our movement over the last few years, and now that he is "selling out" in so many ways, we don't have a leader any longer. We are going to have to choose a new leader for our progressive movement.
Thom---we need you to do this! What do you say?
I think you will have to start organizing huge protests now along with doing everything else that you do. We need another bus tour with you, Michael Moore, Ed Schultz, Katrina V, Rachael Maddox and others gathering everyone up and leading them to Washington together for the biggest f.... revolutionary march the world has ever seen.
"Although most Americans remember that Harry Truman was Franklin D. Roosevelt's Vice President when Roosevelt died in 1945 (making Truman President), Roosevelt had two previous Vice Presidents - John N. Garner (1933-1941) and Henry A. Wallace (1941-1945). In early 1944, the New York Times asked Vice President Henry Wallace to, as Wallace noted, 'write a piece answering the following questions: What is a fascist? How many fascists have we? How dangerous are they?'
Vice President Wallace's answer to those questions was published in The New York Times on April 9, 1944, at the height of the war against the Axis powers of Germany and Japan.
'The really dangerous American fascists," Wallace wrote, "are not those who are hooked up directly or indirectly with the Axis. The FBI has its finger on those. The dangerous American fascist is the man who wants to do in the United States in an American way what Hitler did in Germany in a Prussian way. The American fascist would prefer not to use violence. His method is to poison the channels of public information. With a fascist the problem is never how best to present the truth to the public but how best to use the news to deceive the public into giving the fascist and his group more money or more power.'
In this, Wallace was using the classic definition of the word "fascist" - the definition Mussolini had in mind when he claimed to have invented the word. (It was actually Italian philosopher Giovanni Gentile who wrote the entry in the Encyclopedia Italiana that said: "Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power." Mussolini, however, affixed his name to the entry, and claimed credit for it.)
As the 1983 American Heritage Dictionary noted, fascism is: "A system of government that exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent nationalism."
Mussolini was quite straightforward about all this. In a 1923 pamphlet titled "The Doctrine of Fascism" he wrote, "If classical liberalism spells individualism, Fascism spells government." But not a government of, by, and for We The People - instead, it would be a government of, by, and for the most powerful corporate interests in the nation. "
Quark, more of my comments and quotes are being screening for moderation. I do not know if my comments and posts will be seen. For example, I have had several articles screened for moderation. Most of the articles I share are pertinent.
This year has been pretty tight, and I have some holidiay cards, tea towels and inexpensive pretty photos at my etsy store in case you need to find some inexpensive little items for the holidays.
I would like to propose that the U.S. and Canada build a VERY tall fence on their border. It's getting cold here in Minnesota and it would be nice if some of that Arctic air wasn't allowed into our country!
There seems to be lots of info. on the Tea Bag Parties on the Huffington Post website. Maybe we could follow up and try to contact them to see where/when future protests, etc. will be held:
I still think it is delusional to believe that tea baggers can be “co-opted”—especially when their motivational basis is cultural and racial; the rest of their ranting is about the “theft” of America by these “others,” and their tax money being used to “support” them. And this conversation with Chris Hedges who claimed that NAFTA was what broke the liberal camel’s back may not be delusional, but he is a hypocrite. I have pointed out many times on this page that official trade statistics point out a very different reality than the horse that Thom has repeatedly beat on; overall, our trade with our New World neighbors is much closer to being balanced than most people are led to believe, while our trade with Asia and Europe is far, far out of sorts. High ticket items—and with them high earning jobs—are produced in those regions; when was the last time you saw an electronics item without a “Made in China” label? Hell, when was the last time you saw anything without a “Made in China” label? It is interesting to note that in regard to NAFTA, Thom isn’t particularly worried about Canada—he has stated so; it is only Mexico that he is concerned about. Why? Is it some visceral, gut reaction he may have?
i just sent an email to Thom, but only After I read the print saying any thing to do with politics is put through the spam filter. Mine was sort of about that, but it was about asking for a list of movement meetings in my area. Basically, I was asking how I personally and in a more complex manner can get involved in any various movement/s.
Re: "I wish Thom would give Ravi a homework assignment to determine the cause and effect relation of Larry Beinhart’s empiracal correlation between higher taxes (greater than 50% after loopholes) on those making more than 2 million and the positive effects on the GDP, the DOW, number of jobs and the average wage (for wages I think the median and the average are close to the same) of those jobs. Larry’s work empirically shows a correlation. I would like Ravi, an economist, to show the causation.
Everytime I mention this study by Larry Beinhart, a novelist, they say it must be some cause other than tax increases."
I agree that this would be important information to have. Not a day goes by that I hear some corporate blow-hard (usually Republican) state that lower taxes would HELP the economy. I wish I had a study to point to.
I do remember hearing that Florida under Jeb Bush raised taxes and its economy improved. I don't know if anyone did a cause-effect study on that.
Minnesota, where I live, has historically had high taxes along with a good/progressive economy. It took Jesse Ventura and most especially Republican Governor Tim Pawlenty to reverse the trend.
Quark,
I'm not sure. I am observing that we tend to rely on a leader to absolve ourselves our own responsibilities, we also prop them onto pedestals and then berate them for human frailties.
On a completely different subject, Is particle spin observed in three spatial dimensions a reflection of momentum of saId particle in a fourth?
Many years ago I was sitting in a college classroom, where a quest lecturer was providing the assembled students with the contents of her editorial experience. During this lecture, I was busy with pen and paper, scribbling without cease. The guest lecturer was much impressed with my fascination with her great learning, and effort not to lose one morsel of it. She crept a little closer to where I was sitting, perhaps so that I would not miss a single syllable.
But something was amiss; why was the student sitting next me gazing at my handiwork with at first a quizzical look, then recognition, followed by silent laughter? Because, it seems, that I wasn’t exactly engaged in studious note-taking, but something I often did when I was bored in class: rotisserie baseball doodling. Ever since I could read a box score, I was fascinated with the numbers and statistics involved. I was no good at geometry or algebra, but I sure was a wiz at figurin’ batting averages, slugging percentages and ERAs in my head.
At my current place of employment, it is also important to be know basic math, mainly adding and multiplying. It seems however, that the people who are supposed to be most proficient at it only pretend to be, or someone thinks they are supposed to be. You have these “smart” people (i.e. pallid-complexioned) propped in front of computer screens and attempting to tabulate how much weight goes where on an a/c, which is not that difficult, but the people who do that make it seem so, either out of pretense, or their amateurs. I tend to think the latter, because the gate sheets I need to make deliveries are only fit for the trash can an hour after they’ve been printed out. “Musical Gates” is a game that is only “fun” for those “superior” people sitting in front of their computer terminals, apparently because correcting math errors only means moving this number to here, and that number to there, without having to bother what effect their constant mistakes have on the people outside who have to transform those mistakes into corrective action. I figure I could do just as well or better, but then again, that would mean they are not better, as they wish to think.
In keeping in this vein, it would seem that a working knowledge of simple addition and subtraction would be a prerequisite for being a banker. If you were a banker who gave away all the bank’s money for nothing and no questions asked, with no stipulation that it ever be paid back, should you be allowed to continue in that fashion—let alone even keeping your job? Well, apparently that is what Ben Bernanke and the Republicans think. Bernanke and the FED have given away trillions of dollars with no clue where it went or why. Most of it is fake money, of course, but what’s a few trillion in phony money between friends? With the CBO reporting that most of the TARP money will be paid back, the current adminsitration seems to be a better banker than the real ones. And yet Bernanke and the Republicans would have you and me cover for their own wretched bungling, having the absolute gall to advocate covering this private debt by doing away with public services like Social Security and Medicare—and replacing them with what? TIME magazine had a cover story recently that advocated “retiring” the 401k, because of its volatility; pension plans are increasingly becoming extinct, and we all know about the monstrosity that is private health insurance. The rich, of course, have not the slightest idea of the suffering of those at the other end of the wealth spectrum, so we can expect such insensitivity.
It is interesting to note that the U.S. has the lowest tax rate in the civilized world, which Republican math calculates is the reason why the country’s economy is in such “great shape” despite double-digit unemployment. It’s always nice have friends who are also rich to remind you of that.
Zero G.,
I think the sentiment for reform is THERE, on both the left and the right. Who will head the parade?
Zero G.,
Personally, I don't see any person(s) galvanizing the populace the way the people you mentioned did.
Zero G.,
You bring tears to my eyes...
But are you saying that we don't have leaders, we need leaders, or we can force change without a leader?
Thinking back to the day I saw John & Yoko Lennon w/Elephant's Memory play to the crowd @ Bryant Park NYC during an anti-war rally.
All we are saying...
Abbie Hoffman once observed that "we are all quarterbacks," and we tend to Disney-fy leaders and history, anyway. Consider MLK, the media would have you believe that he had a dream, won civil rights and then turned over and went back to sleep, not gone on to denounce Viet Nam and economic issues.
What do all movements have in common? Is it that there has been someone to get out in front of the parade? Do we need a "leader?" If so, where IS that person?
Zero G.,
You echo my sentiments. Millions of people out in the streets around the world didn't make any difference. I don't think protests are useful to anyone except FOX Noise. Logistically, what else can be done, though, I wonder? Thom talks about "movement politics." How, exactly, would this work (or would it?)
Lorreta, remember this?
THREATS AND RESPONSES: NEWS ANALYSIS; A New Power In the Streets
By PATRICK E. TYLER
Published: Monday, February 17, 2003
The fracturing of the Western alliance over Iraq and the huge antiwar demonstrations around the world this weekend are reminders that there may still be two superpowers on the planet: the United States and world public opinion.
In his campaign to disarm Iraq, by war if necessary, President Bush appears to be eyeball to eyeball with a tenacious new adversary: millions of people who flooded the streets of New York and dozens of other world cities to say they are against war based on the evidence at hand.
from: http://www.nytimes.com/2003/02/17/world/threats-and-responses-news-analy...
One of my largest frustrations, and my first anti-war street demonstration was in '67 with my folks, is that the Bush administration managed to completely overwhelm demonstrated public anger.
And I didn't see Barack Obama as the leader of the anti-war movement. (He did give an anti-Iraq invasion speech.)
What happened? We saw the Bush administration launch pre-emptive arrests of protest groups and leaders, free-speech zones, TV media freeze-outs, etc. Would any news analyst today argue that public opinion represents a balance to corporate/military power?
Randy Shaw on Common Dreams lists the reasons many liberals and activists set the bar so low for the goals Obama would be able to achieve and why that's hurting us now. http://www.commondreams.org/view/2009/12/07-11
I bought into the idea that we needed to defend President Obama too, feeling that he wouldn't get elected if we criticized him too much. And after the election, I felt that we needed to defend him so that he could get the progressive agendas he had promised us passed. He kept telling us to be patient, that congress moves slowly...
In the meantime, Thom and so many other progressive leaders have been telling us that we MUST keep pushing him to the left or he will be pushed to the right.
I think the problem is that President Obama led so much of our movement over the last few years, and now that he is "selling out" in so many ways, we don't have a leader any longer. We are going to have to choose a new leader for our progressive movement.
Thom---we need you to do this! What do you say?
I think you will have to start organizing huge protests now along with doing everything else that you do. We need another bus tour with you, Michael Moore, Ed Schultz, Katrina V, Rachael Maddox and others gathering everyone up and leading them to Washington together for the biggest f.... revolutionary march the world has ever seen.
I feel we need to do this very soon!
Sorry I offered the wrong link to Thom's article. The one I gave you was a re-post.
http://www.commondreams.org/views04/0719-15.htm
There is Obama-mania in Europe. My consult to Obama is that he should run to be the president of the European Union.
This terrific 2004 article by Thom on American-style fascism is being passed around Facebook right now.
http://boards.history.com/thread.jspa?threadID=300021037&tstart=0&mod=10...
"Although most Americans remember that Harry Truman was Franklin D. Roosevelt's Vice President when Roosevelt died in 1945 (making Truman President), Roosevelt had two previous Vice Presidents - John N. Garner (1933-1941) and Henry A. Wallace (1941-1945). In early 1944, the New York Times asked Vice President Henry Wallace to, as Wallace noted, 'write a piece answering the following questions: What is a fascist? How many fascists have we? How dangerous are they?'
Vice President Wallace's answer to those questions was published in The New York Times on April 9, 1944, at the height of the war against the Axis powers of Germany and Japan.
'The really dangerous American fascists," Wallace wrote, "are not those who are hooked up directly or indirectly with the Axis. The FBI has its finger on those. The dangerous American fascist is the man who wants to do in the United States in an American way what Hitler did in Germany in a Prussian way. The American fascist would prefer not to use violence. His method is to poison the channels of public information. With a fascist the problem is never how best to present the truth to the public but how best to use the news to deceive the public into giving the fascist and his group more money or more power.'
In this, Wallace was using the classic definition of the word "fascist" - the definition Mussolini had in mind when he claimed to have invented the word. (It was actually Italian philosopher Giovanni Gentile who wrote the entry in the Encyclopedia Italiana that said: "Fascism should more appropriately be called corporatism because it is a merger of state and corporate power." Mussolini, however, affixed his name to the entry, and claimed credit for it.)
As the 1983 American Heritage Dictionary noted, fascism is: "A system of government that exercises a dictatorship of the extreme right, typically through the merging of state and business leadership, together with belligerent nationalism."
Mussolini was quite straightforward about all this. In a 1923 pamphlet titled "The Doctrine of Fascism" he wrote, "If classical liberalism spells individualism, Fascism spells government." But not a government of, by, and for We The People - instead, it would be a government of, by, and for the most powerful corporate interests in the nation. "
I may not be able to post some pertinent articles but you can read many pertinent articles at antiwar.com.
Quark, how do you survive the Minnesota winters?
Quark, more of my comments and quotes are being screening for moderation. I do not know if my comments and posts will be seen. For example, I have had several articles screened for moderation. Most of the articles I share are pertinent.
Quark, I was quoting my brother-in-law, The people with the gold make the rules.
Quark, I was quoting my brother-in-law, The people with the gold make the rules.
hi progressive buddies,
This year has been pretty tight, and I have some holidiay cards, tea towels and inexpensive pretty photos at my etsy store in case you need to find some inexpensive little items for the holidays.
http://www.etsy.com/view_listing.php?listing_id=36242976
thanks for putting up with this one-time self-promotion:-)
Canadian-U.S. Border Fence
I would like to propose that the U.S. and Canada build a VERY tall fence on their border. It's getting cold here in Minnesota and it would be nice if some of that Arctic air wasn't allowed into our country!
Thomas Jode,
There seems to be lots of info. on the Tea Bag Parties on the Huffington Post website. Maybe we could follow up and try to contact them to see where/when future protests, etc. will be held:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/tea-party
I still think it is delusional to believe that tea baggers can be “co-opted”—especially when their motivational basis is cultural and racial; the rest of their ranting is about the “theft” of America by these “others,” and their tax money being used to “support” them. And this conversation with Chris Hedges who claimed that NAFTA was what broke the liberal camel’s back may not be delusional, but he is a hypocrite. I have pointed out many times on this page that official trade statistics point out a very different reality than the horse that Thom has repeatedly beat on; overall, our trade with our New World neighbors is much closer to being balanced than most people are led to believe, while our trade with Asia and Europe is far, far out of sorts. High ticket items—and with them high earning jobs—are produced in those regions; when was the last time you saw an electronics item without a “Made in China” label? Hell, when was the last time you saw anything without a “Made in China” label? It is interesting to note that in regard to NAFTA, Thom isn’t particularly worried about Canada—he has stated so; it is only Mexico that he is concerned about. Why? Is it some visceral, gut reaction he may have?
i just sent an email to Thom, but only After I read the print saying any thing to do with politics is put through the spam filter. Mine was sort of about that, but it was about asking for a list of movement meetings in my area. Basically, I was asking how I personally and in a more complex manner can get involved in any various movement/s.
For "Monk" Lovers:
http://www.popeater.com/2009/12/04/tony-shalhoub-caricature/?icid=webmail|wbml-aol|dl1|link4|http%3A%2F%2Fwww.popeater.com%2F2009%2F12%2F04%2Ftony-shalhoub-caricature%2F
chuckle8,
Re: "I wish Thom would give Ravi a homework assignment to determine the cause and effect relation of Larry Beinhart’s empiracal correlation between higher taxes (greater than 50% after loopholes) on those making more than 2 million and the positive effects on the GDP, the DOW, number of jobs and the average wage (for wages I think the median and the average are close to the same) of those jobs. Larry’s work empirically shows a correlation. I would like Ravi, an economist, to show the causation.
Everytime I mention this study by Larry Beinhart, a novelist, they say it must be some cause other than tax increases."
I agree that this would be important information to have. Not a day goes by that I hear some corporate blow-hard (usually Republican) state that lower taxes would HELP the economy. I wish I had a study to point to.
I do remember hearing that Florida under Jeb Bush raised taxes and its economy improved. I don't know if anyone did a cause-effect study on that.
Minnesota, where I live, has historically had high taxes along with a good/progressive economy. It took Jesse Ventura and most especially Republican Governor Tim Pawlenty to reverse the trend.