Recent comments
ADHD: Hunter in a Farmer's World
Thom Hartmann has written a dozen books covering ADD / ADHD - Attention Deficit Hyperactive Disorder.
Join Thom for his new twice-weekly email newsletters on ADHD, whether it affects you or a member of your family.
Thom's Blog Is On the Move
By webmaster
Hello All
Thom's blog in this space and moving to a new home.
Please follow us across to hartmannreport.com - this will be the only place going forward to read Thom's blog posts and articles.
Aliceinwonderland ~ In support of women's rights--not proselytizing--here are a couple of scriptures you might want to tuck under your bonnet for the right occasion. You won't hear the Church utter these but they are soooooo relevant. Enjoy!
The truth is out there!
Not only do we need to rid ourselves from Reaganomics, but we also need the Koch brothers and Sheldon Adelson to dry up and blow away.
ChicagoMatt ~ Now we are in complete agreement. I certainly second and third that motion.
ChicagoMatt ~ That sounds very hard to believe from a former McDonald's employee like myself. Was there really any job you ever had that was more difficult that that summer job? The only job I can think of was clearing out poison oak from a vacant lot. Exploitation is ugly no matter when and where it occurs. Please don't try to defend it. It doesn't become an educator.
ChicagoMatt ~ If not the government, who else? Santa Claus? Certainly businesses have proven themselves to be incapable. At that point it is the government's responsibility.
ChicagoMatt ~ I would counter with this...
First, the Gospel must be publised in all nations, not inflicted on all nations.
A well thought out documentary type show on CNN msnbc and any other channel exhibiting that side of the story would not make things worse.
I think each and every fighter is important and keeps an important role. We need to take part in the activism which can change everything!
Matt, if you can't tell between a belief and a fact, I feel sorry for you. Have a lovely evening. - AIW
You're making a value judgement that one is more important than the other. You make that judgement for your kids, and let me make the judgement for mine. Your scientific beliefs may seem antiquated and simple-minded one day. That doesn't make them wrong.
No. I hope people can see my sarcastic hyperbole. Just trying to prove a point that it's impossible to have a complete separation of "church" and state. Someone will ALWAYS be offended or have someone else's beliefs put on them. Saying an invocation at a town council meeting for anyone who wishes to participate (and anyone else can ignore it) seems reasonable.
Matt, if you don't see the "elites of the world" cracking whips over the backs of low-paid workers, you're not paying attention. Or like other conservatives, maybe you just don't give a rat's ass.
I always hated that phrase, "the least among us". It is so bloody condescending. Why must we always define each other according to what we have, rather than who we are?! Even progressives use that kind of language. What a myopic, belittling way of characterizing those who have the least!
There is such crazy bullshit woven through this culture, at every level, I often feel like I don't belong here. On a daily basis i experience culture shock, in the culture I was born into. It's exhausting. I think that when my time is up, it will come with some sense of relief. - Aliceinwonderland
The parochial schools may be a little different there than in Chicago. Here, all grammar schools, not just the private ones, are K-8. No middle schools. All one building. And every church has a school attached to it. Well they all did in the 60s, when the schools were filled. at its height in the early 60s, my school had about 600 students. It's been in a decline ever since then. Now we're down to just over 200 students. That's more of a reflection of the rise in tuition because of the need to pay lay teachers, since there aren't enough nuns anymore, than a reflection of people's lack of faith.
Part of the problem is most of the Catholic schools are still open, so we're competing against each other for the same students. The latest movement has been to combine several schools into one building, to keep costs down, but then people get mad because they want their neighborhood school that they can walk to.
Besides the fact that I just scan everything in my room, I also don't use the copier because it's in the teacher's lounge, and I don't like to go in there. I go straight to my classroom in the morning, eat my lunch there, and go straight home in the afternoon. With the exception of a friendly "hello" in the hallway, I don't see much of my coworkers, and that's just fine with me. Probably my anti-social right-wing I-can-do-better-on-my-own side rearing its head again.
Palin, where are you? I'm beginning to miss your religion-bashing rants. - AIW
Matt, equating science with religion as merely a "system of belief" is a lame argument. Science is based on empirical evidence and the pursuit of evidence via tried-and-true methods adhering to strict standards and relentless scrutiny, having not the vaguest resemblance to antiquated, simple-minded beliefs based on nothing. Are you serious in suggesting that science has no more legitimate a place in schools than religion?! Holy moly…
Why don't we simply declare that stupidity is a religion? Because these arguments are flat-out fucking ridiculous. Let's just go back to teaching Bible shit in church, and science in schools, and move on to other topics more relevant to the 21st Century. THAT is where the silliness should end. - Aliceinwonderland
Matt says "let someone accuse a priest of molesting them 20 years ago, and it's front-page news." Is there any issue of consequence that you haven't seen fit to trivialize in some way?! The sexual abuse of a child is a very big deal.
The Catholic church likes to present itself to the world as some sort of moral authority. They love telling women what they can and can't do with their bodies. How many have been excommunicated, expelled from the church, for using birth control or having an abortion? Those guys will go ballistic over abortion. Yet over the past decade or two, I've caught wind of a virtual epidemic of child molestation incidents involving priests as the culprits. How sick is that?! Yet the moral outrage over these incidents, coming from the church, is nowhere near their outrage over birth control and abortion. They've even tried covering up some of these molestations to protect the perpetrators. How hypocritical is THAT? Like Republicans, they seem to care most for the unborn.
I agree with Marc to a point. Yes, in certain ways Pope Francis has been a "refreshing breeze"…. until it comes to matters pertaining to women and women's rights. In that department, Pope Francis dishes out the same pap as his predecessors.
My favorite quote on this subject: "If men got pregnant, abortion would be a sacrament." Amen. - Alice IW
ScottFromOz says "Like the aircraft carrier named for him, Reagan was a weapon of mass destruction aimed at the American economy by the rich elites and set to automatic fire." Very well stated! And I agree with you that without a major rebellion, nothing is going to change regarding economic & regulatory policies Reagan created, reducing America to this banana-republic shit hole we have now. Still, I think Thom serves a useful function simply by pointing out what's amiss, and what is needed to fix these problems impacting our lives. - Aliceinwonderland
ChicagoMatt ~ In the past I've also worked in several parochial schools. I've never seen one where they only had one analogue copier and couldn't afford to upgrade. Most schools have several copiers--one in the library, one--or more--in the teacher's lounge, and at least two in the main office. One of our best customers is such a school, a Catholic parochial grade school as a matter of fact, that has bought sets of two of the highest end, and fastest, monocolor digital machines at least three times in the last 15 years. They ugrade about every 6-7 years and have full maintenance agreements that includes toner and staples. I hate to say it but I personally think the management of your school is screwing their teachers and students big time.
Another note. Our company often get's right offs for donating equipment to churches and schools which we do frequently just to make room on our shop floor. They aren't the latest machines; but, we always check them out and make sure they are in good shape before going out. Of all the travesties I've seen in the various schools I visit I've never seen a school with just one obsolete copier. There really isn't any excuse for it. You need to call around. You'd be surprised at what you can find. However, I'd avoid buying anything off the internet. I've seen horror stories. Typically those boxes come from lease returns. Dealers swap out the innards before they go back to the lease company who sells them to online vendors who sell them in new boxes. The meters say 0 but the innards say 1 million +. The prices are incredibly low. However, you get what you pay for. Only deal with an authorized reputable dealer in your area... Someone you can take the thing back to easily who has a phone number as well as an address.
My point was, where does it stop? All of the things I listed sound silly, but they also muddy the lines between church and state.
I could go further, and ask what defines a "religion" or "church". Is it a system of beliefs? In that case, science becomes a "religion" - it's a system of beliefs. So no more teaching that in schools. The Gospels are stories about one man's journey long ago. So is "Origin of the Species" (Darwin's book, in case some people don't know). Why should one be allowed, and the other not? They are both just writings about a set of beliefs.
I've also heard compelling arguments that equate environmentalism as a religion. So no more "Earth Day" celebrations in school.
Do you see how this silliness needs to end somewhere?
I wonder, seriously, if the plaintiff in this case every asked the city council to stop praying. Did they ever voice their concerns, or did they go straight for their lawyers? I wonder if they were genuinely offended, or just wanted to make some waves.
I agree that some people just can't be educated. I used to be an aide for autistic students and those with cerebral palsy. These were people who would never live on their own, much less hold a job.
I think the problem lies in the dismantling of the manufacturing sector. I support higher tariffs on imports to compel companies to bring back those middle-income jobs. That is way different than trying to turn a teenager's summer job, like flipping burgers, into a middle-income job.
Here in Chicago, we used to have two big chain grocery stores: Dominicks and Jewel (owned by Albertsons). Both hired workers with disabilities. Dominick's hired more, from what I could tell. Both were unionized.
Dominck's went bankrupt about two years ago. A new chain moved in - Marianos - which is not unionized and does not hire disabled workers, from what I can tell. If it does hire them, they only work at night. Anyway, I often wonder what happened to all of those disabled people who got laid off from Dominicks.
I agree in principle, but who determines the "fair" amounts? The government? The same government that thinks it's "fair" that my daughter be held to a higher standard to get into the best high schools because we live in a wealthy neighborhood? That doesn't seem "fair" to me.
It doesn't. I don't see the elites of the world as cracking whips over the backs of the lowest-paid workers either. Like I said before, my Bible tells me not to judge people. So I'm not judging those who have more than me, nor those who have less.
Then again, the Bible also says that whatever I do for "the least among us", I do for Jesus. That's why I volunteer and donate to the handicapped. It goes well with both the "not judging" and "helping" parts of the Bible.
Since we're talking religion, I often wonder what other members of Abrahamic faiths envision God as - like a boss who is keeping score of your good and bad deeds, or more like a father to a child, correcting you for your own good. I prefer the father/child scenario, where, like my father was to me and I am to my son, I correct him if he gets way out of line, and use it as a teachable moment. And no matter what he does, I won't love him any less. I may be disappointed, but never unloving. Que the peaceful violin music...
Again, do you think there is some memo that goes out to people who have employees that tells them all how they are going to screw over their workers that day? Some secret handshake and password the "elites" have? Do you think the CEO of McDonalds really hates the low-wage employees? Or, more likely, he or she doesn't give a damn about them. They aren't out to get you, they just don't care one way or the other. Not very Christian of them, if they claim that as their faith. But it's not my place to judge.
For what it's worth, I voted with my wallet today and skipped McDonalds for lunch. Mostly because I skipped lunch altogether. But that was my choice.
Apropos to # 205 ~ Another mistake in judgement most right wingers make is that everyone is capable of being trained and having an education. Some people just aren't born that way. Some people can't be trained. Some people have learning disabilities and simply aren't that bright. What many of them share is the willingness to work hard and do their best. That is a very worthy characteristic that I personally respect a great deal. The least we owe these people is a living. That begins with a living wage.
In college I tutored people with learning disabilities. They fall short on the skilled labor side as no fault of their own. Just the other day I was in line at the supermarket. The new checkout girl stopped to count three stacks of cat food I placed next to each other. There were three stacks and 6 cans in each. She counted them one at a time much to my amazement. To my further amazement near the end she lost count and had to start over again. With $1B of financial aid and 30 years of education that young lady would never qualify for any other job. She barely qualified to be a checkout person.
Common sense is not as common as the name implies--not everyone has it. Without common sense an education and training isn't going to help you. Nevertheless, everyone has human dignity. Everyone is entitled to a fair living wage for a fair amount of labor. Anything else is playing right into the oligarchical plan to maximize profit at the top at the expense of a disposable labor force at the bottom. There is nothing more obscene and immoral than one person taking advantage of another; and, this system is just that on steroids.
I certainly hope that these are not the values you teach during your 45 minutes of religious teachings. If so, God help us all.
Matt, once again you're missing the point. The separation of church & state is there for a REASON. The affairs of church & state don't mix. History proves it. That combination has brought nothing but trouble through the ages, not the least of which is how it tramples on the rights of the non-religious. Seems to me we've got enough troubles to deal with already; why invite more?
I just don't get it. Since when was "In God We Trust" an appropriate message to have printed on paper money?! I always thought "one nation under God" was sanctimonious horse crap. So what are all the other nations; chopped liver? On our fridge here is displayed a magnet with the message: "God bless America shouldn't mean god damn everyone else". AMEN to that!
I don't know about the rest of you, but quite frankly I'm troubled by how the Supreme Court keeps chipping away at the separation of church & state, one paper cut at a time. A city council chambers (or courthouse) is not a goddam church. A school is not a church either. What the fuck. Are Americans so hooked on religion that they can't set it aside long enough to deal with other matters in life, having nothing remotely to do with religion?! Reminds me of a baby who can't let go his pacifier; pull it out of his mouth and he starts screaming bloody murder. Maybe I oughta go into business making & selling adult-size pacifiers with Jesus's face printed on them… or Pat Robertson's! (Yuk-Yuk)
Is there another developed country anywhere else in the world where people are so addicted to religion?! Seriously… - Aliceinwonderland
ChicagoMatt ~ Some solution! What your inner right-wing asshole fails to see is that if this solution were ever enacted it would quickly result in every minimum wage worker walking out on the job and applying for welfare. There is a limit to how far people can be logically pushed and it would appear that the real right-wing assholes have already determined that their little wage slaves need to eat to work. They just don't think it is their responsibility to feed them. Therefore, they are far more content at extorting tax money from you and I in order to keep their little cogs alive. The only rational solution is to raise the wages so these people are self sufficient. Even Pharaoh knew enough to feed his slaves. The pyramids are testimony to that.
By the way, where in your Bible does it state that is is fair and good to work people to death for profit? If someone puts in 40 hrs a week doing anything they should be able to afford a roof, cloths, food, medical care, and a retirement without resorting to public aid. How does your god--or you--justify anything less?
If you think just sitting there while other people say something that doesn't apply to you is "oppression", then you are a very, very delicate person. I don't feel "oppressed" when I sit in meetings and listen to things that don't apply to me. Bored, maybe. But not "oppressed". Just last year I was in traffic court, waiting for them to call my name so I could see the judge. They kept calling other names - which didn't apply to me - and I was forced to sit there and listen to it. I felt so oppressed that I got out my phone and started playing Angry Birds: Star Wars Edition.
My entire family was forced to listen to someone else's music on the way home today. We were at a stop light and, since it was a nice day, we had our windows down. The other music featured a lot of swearing, and I had my young children in the car. I should have called my lawyer and sued, but instead, I acted like an adult and not a child, and rolled my windows up.
Lets suppose that this really was "oppressive" for the plaintiff in the case. Here are some other things they may find oppressive:
- The easy one: "In God We Trust" on money.
- Serving pork or beef at any taxpayer-funded place, including school. Could offend some people.
- For that matter, serving spagetti. Church of the flying spagetti monster and all.
- Cities named after religious things, like San Diego and Los Angeles. Every time anyone in LA gets something in the mail, it's like having the taxpayer-funded post office deliver something with the word "Angel" right there on it. Very oppressive.
- National cemetaries with crosses, crescents, or stars of David headstones. That's public land! And what about the people who are paid to maintain it? That's using taxpayer funds to mow the grass around a religious symbol. I'm feeling very "oppressed" by that.
- Emergency services that respond to religious buildings. What if a firefighter is an Atheist, and a mosque is on fire? He is being FORCED to enter a building and possibly see a religious symbol he disagrees with. We're practically trampling on his First Amendment rights...
- Closing city streets for relgious parades. St. Patrick's Day is a big one here in Chicago. All of those poor, poor non-Catholics that can't drive down that street at that particular time.
- Decorating public places for Valentine's day. Also a Catholic holiday. My public school forced me to cut out paper hearts and put people's names on them, and I wasn't even Catholic at the time. I demand an apology from the state of North Carolina.
Or maybe, we can act like adults and not get offended at little things that other people do, even if we don't agree with it.
Literally. Jesus’ final instructions to the Apostles in Matthew 28:19 was to “go and make disciples of all nations” by sharing with the world the great things that Jesus has done.
Of course, with about 70% of Americans claiming to be Christian, I can see how that many people telling you "the good news" could get old after awhile. It's kind of like living in a city that is majority Democratic (like Chicago), and not believing their message. You get tired of hearing it after awhile, but they just keep ringing my doorbell.
Like the aircraft carrier named for him, Reagan was a weapon of mass destruction aimed at the American economy by the rich elites and set to automatic fire.
Thom said "...and putting in place the economic policies that will allow the middle-class to grow and thrive." Yeah, well good luck with that. Those who've captured all the wealth will do whatever it takes to retain, and grow that wealth. They will stop at nothing and already have the government in the pocket. As long as the wealthy 1% control the legislature, nothing short of some kind of rebellion will stop them.
I've been a Catholic for twelve years, and have taught at a Catholic school for about half of that time. I average two masses per week - one with the school, and one with my family. I've heard maybe, MAYBE four sermons about abortion. And the priests always keep it vague, like "respect life". I haven't heard a single priest ever say anything about homosexuality. Yet, people who don't know any better and only know what the corporate media tells them would think that after mass the priest leads a line of people to the nearest gay bar to shout at the people inside.
And if you're a product of a Catholic school in the 50s-80s, a lot has changed since then. There are no nuns, all of the teaching is done by regular teachers. The priest rarely comes into the classroom. Because of a priest shortage, they just have too many other things to do. I am supposed to teach religion for 45 minutes per day, but usually we just read a passage from the Bible and chit-chat about it. The church finally got the message, around here at least, that trying to bring people to God with a crack of a yardstick only led to resentful adults.