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How disgraceful that "We The People" in 2011 still have to "fight for the idea that our political structures should serve us."
I wonder if the NYC police realize they are doing the dirty work for those who given the chance would not hesitate to privatize and downsize the entire police dept.
I got word that Thur. the 99% will mobilize all across the country in order to show that evictions only strengthen our resolve......more to follow......I'm on board!
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/-occupy-congress/
Strength in numbers and peace!!!! I support OWS and will continue to support OWS until we see long over due change!!!! OWS is the only way change will happen!!!! Stop all of the far reaching systemic social injustices and corruption occuring in the US and the social injustices the US has taken to other countries for lower wages to gain more wealth. GREAT WORK OWS!!!!! Replace congress with OWS the 99%. Ocuppy congress!
In the sixties, the Bull Connor types thought that they could beat and intimidate people into obeying, but in the end, they were fanning the flames. The civil rights movement became stronger as people saw the polices' brutal attacks on nonviolent protesters. New York and other cities are spending hundreds of millions trying to find something to pin on the protesters. We should continue to try to direct the attention to the real criminals; not the people in the streets, but the ones inside the Wall Street bank buildings, the ratings agencies, hedge funds companies,etc. Law enforcement should be seizing bankers' files, not protesters tents.
There was a time, not long ago, when it was quite conceivable that, even though they were greatly outnumbered, the few would get away with doing things like hijacking an airliner (perhaps, only armed with "boxcutters?") And I highly doubt that is what happened anyway. But that last airliner that went down in the fields of Pennsylvania was hyped up by the media to be "heroic" passengers who overcame the attempted hijackers and foiled the hijackers attempt at striking yet another building full of people.
Would violence against the (alleged) hijackers, in such a case be warranted...expected? Would there really be a handful of passengers, out of that many, who would get up the courage to resort to violence to prevent the plan from being carried out? They were all going to die anyway...I suppose that once one realizes that that is the likely scenario then one, all of a sudden, dispenses with any ridiculous notion of being "civilized". Violence just comes, and is necessary, and even praised by those of us who abhors the bully boys among us...especially if there is no one else that will protect us.
I think that America is on such a hijacked airliner that is in the process of crashing. Many of us will die, even if, or especially if, we do nothing but think about voting for Obama yet again in 2012. The wealthy will continue squeezing us and murdering us by the thousands...or even millions over time as we die of poverty, hunger, exposure, and lack of medical care. Our loved ones may die first and then we may find life not much worth living anyway. I don't know...violence? Maybe we should all just let the terrorists (the financial terrorists) win and die quietly.
Cygnus1: I wasn't being serious when I proposed forming another movement..just trying to be funny...I guess. Anyway, you are right...we sure don't need the current OWS movement to be diluted in any way...especially with Tea Party members who would just be compelled to try to subvert and control the OWS movement.
You know it would be nice if the military or the police were really on our side to the point where they would break ranks and refuse to take orders but I think that it is wishful thinking...you may know something I don't...which is very likely...As old Shultzee used to say: "I know nooooothttthing!"
But I think that it is really hard for someone in such regimented organizations to do anything but to take orders...unfortunately. Even people in the civilian world, who would be risking their jobs, would have trouble making waves for fear of losing his/her job. It's one thing for a few ex-military who may not even have a job to worry about ticking off their employer attending these demonstrations, but for active duty people it would take a very brave person to stick his head on the chopping block....like Bradley Manning did. Bradley Manning was/is a hero!!! One thing is pleasant to think about, however, is that it was discovered that in many of the wars...since WWII anyway that many soldiers, instead of aiming to kill, actually fired over the heads of "The Enemy". I guess that's where Jesus comes into the picture...at various military outposts that is where they have been indoctrinating the soldiers into believing that they were killing for Jesus...so it was alright. Jesus really does want the Muslims dead because they are the enemy of Jesus....or something like that! Of course, I suppose they don't also teach them that Jesus was also one of the "prophets" (I almost typed "profits"..which wouldn't have been too far off) that Muslims worship.
And from what Alan Lunn said about what Blankfein said it just fits in with their warped belief system....they are all insane to tell you the truth! Quick, someone put these people on their meds before they really go berserk and kill us all!
Have we ever thought of anything better? What do you mean by "better"? What works? So how is our system of Democracy working out? When has the world ever been so criminalized by so few? And when has the world ever been so controlled by so few...like it is now...with technology so advanced that those few can so control the masses and demand we march to their drums..or else?
Until recently, they have herded people's minds to the watering troughs of Jim Jones' favorite flavor of cool-aid.
One exception, maybe, is the internet. But this scares them because when people can convey ideas so broadly and instantaneously it will be hard for the fascists to control what we think and believe. It will be harder for them to control our actions. They are very afraid of this and have tried very hard to control it. We have to be vigilant and guard against their attempts at controlling the internet.
Technology is such that the few can monitor what we do and how we think. They have cameras everywhere with facial recognition and facial expression analysis software that can determine not only who you are but what you are about to do. This is fine for detecting criminals but who are the criminals? What if one day the ruling few decide that they will round up all the Christians and Jews and Muslims and throw them all into concentration camps and then send them to the gas chambers like the Nazis did?
Many Germans poo-pooed the idea when they heard rumors too. They, too, thought they were too civilized and too modern to do anything so horrid. And if the holocaust was the only atrocity, and mass murder, that is one thing, but it has happened many times since. Not here in the US...yet! Except what they did to the Indians..which was mass murder on a genocidal scale as well. But don't think it won't ever happen here....again.
I'm not so worried about being incarcerated and gassed for being an adherent of one of those religions...I'm more likely to be singled out because I am an atheist. Many "good" Christians would love to see people like me "burn in hell"...or thrown into a gas chamber. The ruling elite would find the masses more malleable and controllable through the manipulation of their superstitions as they have done for thousands of years. It would be the ones who reject any kind of ridiculous dogma that would be troublesome to the ruling elite. And one dogma I have rejected is that of a democracy that is for and by the people because it is corrupt and nothing but a lie used by those corrupt politicians and their puppet masters who pull all the strings...and expect the masses to believe in their hocus pocus fibs and fables.
Yes, it would be nice if we really had such an honest democratic system that works for the people instead of cards stacked in favor of those pulling the strings but it only has a chance of returning to what it is hyped up to be if the ruling elite are scared sh!tless that they will not only lose their wealth but also maybe something more precious.
And yes, that is a very good question....why didn't we step in to rescue the Jews? Many in high places in the US government knew what was going on. In fact some of the ruling elite and famous personalities of the day, like Lindbergh and Henry Ford were very antisemitic and many believed they secretly supported the Nazis. It sure didn't stop old Prescott Bush from trading with the enemy while Nazis were killing US soldiers...nor our banking system from trading with the enemy when plotting and conniving with German Banks on how to profit from the war. And the list goes on..ball bearings, chemicals, oil!
And if you have ever read books by Edwin Black you know that the Nazis were not the first to do some very horrid things to their own people (or at least the people living among them..as I'm sure the Nazis and many of the German people did not consider the Jews or Gypsies...their own people).
In fact the Nazis got some "ideas" from what US authorities were doing to it's people in America...although I doubt the highbrow ruling elite would consider southern peasants their people. The US thought of, and practiced, a form of ethnic cleaning that inspired Hitler to do the same...although Hitler took it to a higher level. And one has to realize that Christianity had long used the Jews as a scape goat... blaming them for Christ's death...so the Germans and the Americans had a lot in common in that respect.
Edwin Black also wrote a book about how IBM was complicit in assisting the Nazis tabulate people which made the mass killing machine even more efficient. A number of well known, wealthy, and influential (one might even say...part of the ruling elite) in the US today were selling out their fellow Americans to the Nazis.
So, if you thought WWII was worth fighting and worth every violent thing we could throw at the Nazis then you should be thinking about the Nazis, who by any other name, still thrives and controls us all right here, today, in the US. They are the ruling elite. And remember both Hitler and Eichmann were both part Jewish as well so I am not saying that the American ruling elite are all German Nazis but are of the same mind set. And I am not saying that all America's ruling elite are Jewish. It really transcends ethnicity or religious belief. They are selfish, vain, greedy and.....evil!
So, I am not convinced that these cockroaches who have managed to amass money and power, who are manipulating the economy, and own and control the political process in the US are to be trusted not to do something like what the Nazis did. It is not beneath them nor beneath their power to do this right here in the US. I believe they already willfully murdered thousands of people in the WTC towers and then over the next, almost, 10 years, "sacrificed" many thousands more soldiers in an illegal and immoral war in the Middle East....not to mention the many hundreds of thousands of innocent men, women, and children our troops butchered over there.
Violence is not to be idolized or preferred...but when all else fails...there is nothing left. When backed into a corner, and we realize that we are going to die from starvation, or lack of medical care, etc. then what do we have to lose but our dignity if we cower and cringe and aimlessly plead for mercy. The trick is to be able to recognize, before one is too weakened to fight back, when there are no other viable options. There are strength in numbers unless those numbers are emaciated and even, perhaps, herded into prison camps to await their fate.
One might look at the example of the Jews in Nazi Germany and wonder why so many just obeyed so few. There could have been strength in numbers if they had not been so pliable. More widespread rebellion may have made a difference. The small rebellion that did occur by a few made little difference and it was too little too late. I hope the citizens in the US don't make the same mistake.
So don't fool yourselves into believing that all you have to do, or then only thing you can do, is to vote Democrat in 2012. It is not going to make a difference one iota in your favor if you do. You will only be casting a vote for the continuation of the myth that we still have a democracy in America.
If you don't vote, or if you vote for someone other than Republican or Democrat you will be casting a vote against the corrupt system of Republican/Democrat two-party rule.
Palindromedary, this is what the Military under the Constitution of these United States of America are to do (preparing themselves) in upholding their role of protecting the people and overthrowing corrupt internal regime, such as the one in Washington, D.C.
If the 1% and their worker eyes no longer can control the U.S. Military, then who are the 1% going to fight the people with? The militarized police forces? You know that will not work. The police would not stand a chance against the U.S. Military in full fatigues, with grenades, heavy gunfire, smoke bombs, night gear, and every other piece of equipment which they use in war overseas. This is one segment of power which DOES BELONG TO THE PEOPLES OF THE CONSTITUTION OF THESE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA!
If you begin another movement, you only fragment what is already there. Fragmentation brings about dissention and weakness, that is one reason democracy never works. You have too many whose minds differ from the other. And noone really knows properly how to run anything because nothing good can be guaranteed under the system and power of the economic and Militarized force of the 1%.
Historywriter, Palindromedary is correct. If the OWS movement or any Occupied movement throughout the world of a healthy nature and for the right causes just protest in a peaceful manner without soon their Military joining them in full force, in fatigues, and regalia, the 1% and their worker eyes will continue in pushing the demonstrators around. But with the Military taking the front lines as it would in any war, then the elite will have nobody left to fight the protesters with, save that of the police, whom, by that time will join forces with the winning side, joining in on the upcoming quantatative easing on their families as well, as the transition is made to the Paradisical system.
Be careful that you do not mistake "history" for facts, for the facts have been long hidden from the people, but one day, these facts will be made clear and come out for all to read and learn what really happened to cause WWI, WWII, and how Israel was born.
Information is power. But right now such writings cannot be read due to the fact that the 1% either murders the authors, locks them up or just forbids the media from printing anything contrary to that which has been written in history books, school books, and on the sites of the 1% and their accompanying worker eyes. - Cygnus1
Alan Lunn, I have copied a portion of your informative post: "....Goldman-Sachs has occupied Washington. As Blankfein said, they were "doing God's work." God's work was apparently destroying democracy and ruining the middle class."
"...This is not a conspiracy and it has happened before. But the populist movements of the past didn't go far enough in removing money from government. This is not hatred for those who make money through honest means." end quote
We, the Peoples of these United States of America do not have to look far to see who it is exactly who yell "hate, hate, hate," all of the time, when the Peoples try to point the finger at them and their money trick. They have no intellectual way to defend themselves, so they yell "hate" and manipulate the courts against the Peoples.
Which god of many does Blankfein speak of? Find who these people are and which god they attribute their wickedness to, and the Peoples can become of themselves all the wiser. - Cygnus1
there isn't enough space in the jails or prisons for all who will come out to support the OWS movement. We will grow untell every person who is in the 99% is on the streets and the walls of the 1% tremble. We are awake and in it for the long haul through police crack downs and winter blizzards. We will win in the end
The idea that can't be evicted -- especially there in the land of Wall Street -- is that the people are rising and making their collective voice heard even as representation erodes in Washington due to the usurpation by the 1%. Goldman-Sachs has occupied Washington. As Blankfein said, they were "doing God's work." God's work was apparently destroying democracy and ruining the middle class.
This means they will proceed no further with their plans of greed and extraction or with their subterfuge in the 600 trillion dollar derivatives market where they hide what they do as they transfer wealth into their offshore tax havens. This is not a conspiracy and it has happened before. But the populist movements of the past didn't go far enough in removing money from government.
This is not hatred for those who make money through honest means. This is a movement of morality and justice. This is a movement of reclaiming America and her government for all of us. And the #1 thing we have to do is a separation of business and state. That isn't anti-business: it's pro-business. When monopolies control government, there is no capitalism. We're going back into the monopoly-busting business with the help of a government we have taken back for all of us. And the hidden tyranny is facing the music, finally.
"My administration is the only thing between you and the pitchforks." -- Obama to 13 bankers in 2009
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ar0_zA6xTco
Nobody can stop Occupy. Occupy is the only solution to a system of government that is broken completely. I live in a sleepy city but we do occupy: http://treegrower.org/Occupations/DC%20Occupation.html
In what way does violence work? In what situations has it been successful? What kind of violence--war or swinging batons or guns? Most important, what were the outcomes?
World War II supposedly was the "last good war." Maybe. But why did we not step in and try to rescue the Jews and the disabled and the Gypsies? We knew about them. At the end of the war, we gave them help, but both Britain and the .United States knew about the camps, and did nothing to help.
Why not? If it was a "good war," why didn't we rescue them?
What was the cost of this war? How many lives were lost throughout Europe and in the United States? We know those figures, we know the amount of money. Is violence and fighting the ONLY to tackle a huge governmental problem -- like war, killing citizens, ruining countries?
Haven't we, in several thousand years, thought of something better?
Con Reagan Bush 1-2 GOP Supreme Court majority decides on Health Care ... oops
People power IS working OWS We beat GOP Bagger Gov Kasich & Kochs Bros millions in Ohio last week ! Fla Kentucky Mississippi too. Wis recall ALL on board ! Finally people have awaken to Goldmans Sachs Wall St / GOP Bagger Cantor McConnell Boehnr scam on US economy & its people ...
I have high hopes that this will strengthen the movement.
I am still trying to figure out what judicial procedure allowed the NY Supreme Court to throw out both the restraining order that upheld the protesters' civil liberties and the judge who granted it! Travesties like that will spur more people to take action!
I do not advocate violence...but...violence does work and has proven that it is what is necessary to invoke real change. The ruling classes all believe in violence because they use so much of it all the time...against other countries for power and wealth creation (theirs) and against the demonstrators...when the people have had enough of the lies and trickery of politics as usual.
All throughout history violence has been the thing that has changed corrupt and evil regimes. The smoke and mirrors and hokey baloney democratic system, as it has come to be through massive corruption, will not change things except to further give those who have rigged the game even more power.
We have power in numbers and if we hold our resolve we can get the criminal elite and their puppet politicians to buckle under the weight of what is fair and egalitarian for the majority of people.
It took violence to overthrow the Nazis. It took violence to make this country to begin with. Our forefathers stood up to the ruling powers and that's what we need to remember. If our forefathers listened to a bunch of weak kneed namby pambys preaching "oh, we'll weaken the Democrat Party" or some such rhetoric we never would have become an independent nation. Our constitution even says that we have a right and a duty to overthrow the corrupt regimes who have taken America prisoner....(not exactly in those words, of course). In fact, our forefathers resorted to hit and run terrorism against the British. Being out gunned and out regimented, we did whatever we could to fight the British...even if we had to fight dirty. Of course, what our forefathers did is often not very much talked about because it would make people think about Middle Easterners who are also struggling to fend off occupation as well.
If it were not for those brave Americans at the turn of the century rebelling and even using violence we would not have enjoyed the relative freedoms and benefits of a more equal distribution of wealth that came in the decades that followed.
The two party system is corrupt and it makes no difference anymore...they are still trying to play their games of deception...and many Americans don't fall for it anymore. The ruling elite, by using violence, are trying to break our resolve....and it could escalate if the citizen demonstrators against tyranny push back. The ruling elite believes that the people do not have the resolve or fortitude to strike back. Well, we'll see. Hopefully we can outsmart these gestapo bastards and wear them down.
Maybe we need to create another movement...lets call it: Fight Usurious Corporate Kleptocracy! And we can call it....oh, well, just an idea! Thousands of demonstrators wearing T-shirts emblazoned with Fight Usurious Corporate Kleptocracy! Now!!
Great success story, Pulladigm...thanks...!! Violence...or at least the threat of violence works! And overwhelming numbers are a potential violence that would overwhelm any smaller force of violence. Most of it is bluff anyway.
NYPD raze the #OWS library, throw out over 5,000 books
"The Occupy Wall Street librarians tweeted the eviction all night: “NYPD destroying american cultural history, they’re destroying the documents, the books, the artwork of an event in our nation’s history … Right now, the NYPD are throwing over 5,000 books from our library into a dumpster. Will they burn them?"
"The Occupy Wall Street librarians tweeted the eviction all night: “NYPD destroying american cultural history, they’re destroying the documents, the books, the artwork of an event in our nation’s history … Right now, the NYPD are throwing over 5,000 books from our library into a dumpster. Will they burn them? … Call 311 or 212-639-9675 now and ask why Mayor Bloomberg is throwing the 5,554 books from our library into a dumpster.” end quote source whatreallyhappened.com
Peoples of these United States of America, this destruction of books and documents is warfare against the People, the Constitution, the culture, and the History of America. This is warfare because in every war the books and documents and artwork are taken, destroyed, hidden, or removed out of the country. Then the bombing takes place to destroy the heritage and culture and survival of the nation. This is important to understand.
Information is one avenue of power. Keep the peoples in the dark and in ignorance, persecute those persons who know and tell the truth before it has been disguised, erradicated or defaced, and you have nothing but peons and serfs at your beck and call.
This is why we have repeatedly informed, you, the Peoples of These United States of America, be careful what you believe to be the truth about any historical event, for most of the truth of the event has been overwritten or disappeared, and all you are left with is an historical writing which is as far from the truth as one could possibly imagine. - Cygnus1
Pairadocs, the Democratic party has already damaged itself beyond repair as have the Republicans, no one had to do it for them. We see where you are coming from in trying to prevent a Paradisical system coming into effect for the Peoples of these United States of America. Your comment is a distortion of fact. You are one of the millions of worker eyes, so do not be surprised if you find yourself on the opposite end of the "string." - Cygnus1
Back in pre revolution ary times there was an 'occupy' renters strike in the Hudson Valley of New York Colony.. A Dutchman by the name of Rensaleer Had a land grant from the Dutch crown that covered what is today Rockland, Orange, Ulster, Putnamand Dutchess counties. He had a vision so he rented land to farmers who wanted to settle that wilderness. Only he never colected the rent. That went on for about 40 some odd years.
When he died his family discovered there was all these unpaid rents. They tried to collect back rent. . From the original renters and from people who had inherited their farms from their fathers. They went to the local Doctor, an educated man, John Boughton. He organized a renters strike.
When the sherrif was sent out with an eviction order. he was greeted with a small army of armed farmers. The sherriff went out with armed deputies and was met with a larger force of armed men.
Ultimately the farmers prevailed. They got title to their farms and the state grew.
~;^}>
If you miss the way it used to be- then tax a millionaire, support a union, and buy American.
The New York Stock Exchange Gambling Casino syphones off cash from circulation so that wealthy 1%'ers can waft it into their own bank accounts off shore. So when the foreign controlled government of these United States of America say they need to bail out Wall Street, not only does Wall Street syphone off the new money into their own bank accounts but the peoples end up with even less than they originally had because of tax increases on each dollar given to Wall Street pirates, and the payoff to Wall Street by the foreign controlled U.S. government falls as another heavy debt to the Peoples of these United States of America. When the money system goes in its entirety with all its diverse factions, then bribary will be a thing of the past. No more leverage there. - Cygnus1
Just browsing today, I found the Occupy Wall Street blog online, and several others. There is an Occupy Tokyo, Occupy Toronto, Occupy all over the world! My daughter has been witnessing Occupy Portalnd (Oregon) and the evictions are also happening there in great force. This movement is bigger than any one city. Bigger than what is being reported or what can be easily recognized. I don't think the powers that be can stop it.
Thom: You are on the losing side of this movement. The violence that is coming out of the few I have heard interviewed on your show display their ignorance. You will find they will do severe damage to the Democrat party in the long run. The general public looks like this as a circus show. As it turns more and more violent you lose more and more supporters. You seem to be promoting this activity and you are playing right into the Rebublicans hands.
I just informed the Mayor of that fine city that I won't be sending any tourist dollars their way.
It is not the politicians who have given the order to evict. It is the long arm and method of Israel, giving orders unto their people in these United States of America. And when they hear that We, the People, are turning our anger against mere puppet politicians, then they have a great time in laughter. Watch the Knesset sometime over the internet and you will always see them laughing after a midnight raid on Palestine, throwing peoples out of their houses and destroying their belongings. They are not smirking. They are actually roaring with laughter. It is sickening.
Taking the people's belongings away in garbage trucks to the local dump after telling the protesters they may claim their belongings, is nothing more than mind games, and divulging to the American People, the long arm's wickedness
The strategy is to clean the protesters out of their effects for surviving the cold in the occupied space. In issuing a court order to allow the protesters back into the park, with belongings, well, the belongings have already been taken, so what belongings are the court speaking about?! They know full well that people out of work can scarcely buy themselves food. This strategy of theirs is to clean the protesters out of their effects and then if the protesters return with more effects gathered for them by other protesters throughout the country, the garbage trucks will come right back in and clean them out again.
This is DISOBEDIENCE TO A COURT ORDER BY MAYOR BLOOMBURG AND THE CITY ADMINISTRATION. THE POLICE NOW NEED TO ARREST THESE WORKER EYES FOR DISSOBEYING THEIR OWN COURT ORDER, FOR THAT IS THE SYSTEM THEY SWORE TO UPHOLD. But the long arm of ISRAEL BREAKS EVERY KNOWN LAW THERE HAS EVER BEEN INSTITUTED. Israel knows no law. They are completely lawless.
Everyone has freedom of choice, to be right or to be wrong. Siding with the 1% and their worker eyes is not a wise choice. - Cygnus1