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The President is grand standing again on an issue he has very little control over. The real power for changing the gun laws lies with Congress. The NRA owns the Republicans in the House of Representatives. There is little to no hope of getting these people to ban weapons they believe are covered under the 2nd. Amendment. Even if they believed they would be doing the right thing by endorsing the Presidents requests, they would not go up against their own party and the Corporations that make billions on gun sales. They know that the RNA, Tea Party and others on the right would run a new Republican against them in their next primary to teach all the other Republicans who actually runs the Republican Party. Banning clips that hold more than 10 rounds is ineffective when trying to curb the amount of ammo that a gun can disburse at one time. Anyone who has had military training can fire off the whole clip and reload within seconds. And those without military training can learn and practice to reload their weapon within seconds. Mental health checks for buyers and insurance that would cover people who were assaulted with these weapons is a good idea, but that will not stop anyone from purchasing insurance at the time of purchase from simply not paying future payments. As we have seen in California, not having insurance while driving after the initial coverage runs out has not stopped those who would drive without coverage. Having police at the schools is a good idea, but there are always ways around this, for example; by entering the school as a person delivering goods, than pulling out his AR-15 and spraying anyone he sees. My daughter is a school teacher who hates guns and will not allow her husband to have a weapon in their house, ( which I think is a silly choice) thinks it is a good idea to have some people who are authorized to carry a weapon bring them on campus, such as teachers and administration personnel. She works in a high crime district and they have lock downs when someone is being pursued by the police near the school. Problem with that solution is what if the police are not notified about a threat in the area which means no lock-down, they are a reactionary stop gap that only arrives after the crime is committed. I think every school should have armed personal on campus and fences and monitored access points to get into the school. We have 3,000,000 weapons in the control of civilians all across the U.S. At this point only the most radical laws to take away weapons from citizens across the nation might have an impact on these horrific crimes. Turning in the people who make threats against others indicating they will use a weapon to get even or whatever, sounds good, but where is the money coming from for the extra personnel needed to check out these claims or reports. I am well versed in firearms and it takes only seconds to reload any weapon whether it is a revolver, semi-automatic hand gun or semi-automatic assault weapon. A high powered rifle with a scope and a magazine with limited capacity can be used by someone who is familiar with hunting, can do as much damage as a Ar-15 if you have the advantage of being on the high ground. Stopping the wide spread sale of graphic and violent computer games might be helpful, but there is not enough evidence that there is any correlation between these games and going out and killing people. We can pass all the laws we think will prevent mass murders from happening, but you cannot stop a person from committing these crimes if they are intent on killing as many people as possible, As far as protecting ourselves from a tyranical government by owning assault weaponsis a red herring. No well-armed country can stand up against our military power, how would a band of civilians across the U.S. stop the U.S. Military? If a person is willing to give up his or her life for what he or she perceives is the right thing to do, you cannot stop them. If they cannot find firearms to carry out their crime, they will just make car bombs as the American terrorist Timothy Mcvaey(spelling is wrong!) did in Oklahoma against a Federal building years ago! We need to realize this is something we will have to live with and be more cautious and aware of the people around us at all times. A sad scenario for any country in this time in history...If we can pass the laws to outlaw these weapons that wouid be a great thing to due and a step in the right direction. But it will not stop those who are determined to wreak havoc in America. The days of being free of fear from someone committing this type of crime is sadly long gone.
Democratic Presidents that had 2 full terms in the 20th Century: Wilson, F. Roosevelt, Clinton. (Truman's 1st term was a fill-in for FDR, Johnson's 1st term was a fill-in for JFK, Carter wasn't re-elected.)
Republican Presidents that had 2 full terms in the 20th Century: Dwight Eisenhower, Ronald Reagan. (McKinley died in office, T. Roosevelt's 1st term was a fill-in for McKinley, Harding died in office, Coolidge's 1st term was a fill-in for Harding, Hoover wasn't re-elected, Nixon resigned, Ford's only term was a fill-in for Nixon, G.H.W. Bush wasn't re-elected.)
Wow, those lists are surprisingly short, even when allowing McKinley and Clinton, whose times in office extend outside the 20th Century.
An interesting fact: 1928 was the last time the Republicans won the White House without a Nixon or a Bush on the ticket.
tfs6755: Expensive insurance would then allow only the very wealthy and the criminals (often one in the same) to own these weapons. Expensive insurance would be just like expensive pot...driving most of the weapons trade underground (and harder to track) and driving up the prices...something a lot of rich people and criminals don't mind at all. You're only hurting those of us who won't be able to afford high priced insurance and high priced weapons. You would also be ensuring that the rich will be even more oppressive...they would have no worries about the masses conducting an armed rebellion.
There may very well come a time when we all will regret giving up our 2nd Amendment rights. It was put there for a reason..to protect us against tyranny by the few. And the more you give up your ability to defend yourselves against tyranny, the more easily it is for any tyrant to run roughshod over us all.
I consider myself a progressive liberal but I also know that the ruling elite won't care about the whining masses screeching "unfair, unfair" if they manage to take away all of our weapons. And I believe that many of the Democrat leaders are doing just what their wealthy taskmasters require of them....pretend to be looking out for the people, but covertly working to undermine our ability to stave off tyranny. They are part of the deception.
The Republicans are also being very deceptive...they are pretending that they are all for the NRA, and everyone in America, to have weapons...but they are really not for that...they are lying so as to not loose the NRA backing. Yes, they are playing groups like the NRA and their members because they pretty much have exclusive support from these groups and people. There is big money in the gun lobby. And the Republicans are latched on to that hunk of money. But the ruling elite doesn't want the majority of Americans to own guns because that could someday represent a challenge to their exploitation and oppression. As long as those Americans, with all the guns and all supportive of the NRA, are siding with the Republicans. The Republicans are just fine going along with the ruse. But if many more Americans, say liberal progressives, had all the guns....the Republicans would be against guns...because then they would be like the Democrats are now..not getting any backing ($) from the gun lobby and still having to worry about their taskmasters, the ruling elite, being very afraid that they couldn't exploit and oppress us.
Look what happened after the French Revolution..many wealthy elite heads rolled in the streets.The end result...after the dampened oscillations of various powers since...the wealthy in France and their politicians were always very respectful of the possibility that it could happen again. Mostly, till the present day, the ruling elite in France had to weigh carefully their actions so they wouldn't upset the people again.
Hi Thom,
Ronald Reagan was surrounded by armed men and still got shot. Were there not enough guns surrounding him to protect him from one lone attacker?
The debate should be how many murders per minute is acceptable for a weapons system?
Thom,
A couple of days ago I heard a caller suggest making assault weapons available in vending machines. You probably naturally assumed he was being irrational. You are right!
I submit that it is the use of these Labels that offended and generated that incredibly good example of the type of irrational thought in that caller that I'm talking about in my previous post.
I respectfully submit that his response was one more of self defense than rational thinking.
I also respectfully submit that using these Labels, though good for ratings by stirring up emotions like Rush Limbaugh routinely does, are not doing our Country very much good.
Perhaps you can discuss this topic on your show sometime?
PS. I apologize for comparing you to Rush Limbaugh.
OK Aliceinwonderland, you may have a valid point. Perhaps a complete ban of the words "Liberal" and "Conservative" would be impractical and unhelpful.
However, I still cringe anything someone tosses out these Labels with hostility and blanket negative statements. No two people are created alike and all people are created equal.
Personally, I might be considered by many as being left of left. I don't consider myself that way. I refuse to allow anyone to pigeonhole me into any category or label. Once there I know I become a target for slander and ridicule. I refuse to allow it to happen to myself and prefer not to inflict or take advantage of anyone else that way whom I disagree with. I've met far too many people from the far right that I like and respect too much to call a name of any kind other than the one their parents gave them.
I believe everyone deserves equal respect; especially, those who we completely disagree with. After all, none of us is always right. If it wasn't for people who disagree with us, our mistakes would go undetected and never corrected. Wouldn't that be a tragedy? If anyone ever disrespects you because you're a woman--or for any other reason--they are a Jerk. Don't blame an entire ideological entity for the actions of a few. I assure you if you look long enough you will find a bigger Jerk amongst the ranks of the other side. Why alienate an entire group for the actions of a few or one?
I work in the field for clients of every sector, Bankers, Doctors, Lawyers, Realtors, Architects, Designers, Investment Brokers, CPA's, as well as for Auto Mechanics, Teachers, Warehouse Workers, Bus Dispatchers, Contractors, Building Material Vendors, and even Sweat Shop Workers. I can assure you that no matter what field or economic level, once you get any one of these people alone in a room they are all quite human, kind, gracious, understanding, and reasonable. I've made a career out of learning how to work with anyone to resolve problems that have far more complexity than any discussed in this forum.
I've made a living out of resolving these problems quickly and I think I know how to effectively deal with all sorts of people. Trust me when I say, using Labels in essence insinuates blame for various "predetermined world views" that are out of the control of the very people being Labeled. It instantly causes a reaction of distaste, places the other person on the defensive, and prevents the use of critical thought to resolve a problem. It's the same as refering to black people as black and white people as white. It's a natural reaction when you blame the victim for their problem; even, when it is their fault. No one wants to be perceived as belonging to a group that is looked down upon!
"World Views" or perspective as I prefer to call it is a gift not an liability. No one, be they "Liberal", or "Conservative" are responsible for any of our problems. Money and greed is responsible. "Liberal" and "Conservative" are terms we've been brainwashed into using to identify the Scapegoats who we waste our time blaming for the actions of the Greedy 1% few who have, and are, stealing our money. We are a society programmed to blame other victims rather than launch organized efforts of the majority to effect change.
You are more than right, Alice, in defending your right to use "Liberal" and "Conservative" in your opinions. I recognize and defend your right; and, everyone else's right to do so. Just keep in mind that every time I see these Labels used to condemn, ridicule, or generalize any group negatively I can't help but perceive the Label user as a Puppet.
And yes, that goes for Thom as well!
Our justice system is inept: Eric Holder is one of the worst appointments Obama has made, and Obama has made plenty of terrible appointments.
The fiscal cliff tax deal - hatched by the 'Democrat' Obama, written by the 'Democrat' Senate, and voted for by almost every 'Democrat' we just elected - probably played a part in Aaron's suicide.
The permanent 40% marginal estate tax rate 'our guys' gave to the 1% was 15% lower than the 55% rate that the 1% would have paid if 'our guys' had done nothing.
That 15% tax cut - worth about 3 trillion dollars - will now be offset by cuts to programs for people that Aaron was trying to help. At this point just the sight of Obama or any of our 'new Democrats' makes me physically sick. It's hard to live with no hope for change in the society we have become.
Dear Thom and Louise;
I appreciate your views on the need for insurance, registration and licencing of firearms.
I believe that insurance is the real key, and if you think about it a bit, having to have insurance on a bushmaster military rifle would be prohibitively expensive, compared to owning a 30.06 hunting rifle.
We would likely not even need a law to ban, because the insurance companies (perhaps aside LLOyds of London) would never even write a policy for that model, or any others with high capacity to kill lots of people!
Keep up the great work!
Sincerely;
Timothy F Sharp
Missoula MT
DAnneMarc said "There really are no Conservatives or Liberals. They are made up fictitious titles that the establishment dealt out so we can get mad and call each other names". I've heard this sentiment before and respectfully disagree.
We are living in an ideologically divided society, like it or not. Thom has identified two distinctly different world views and philosophies that fit these labels to a T. Conservatives operate under the assumption that all people are inherently evil and must be controlled under a "strict-father", authoritarian socioeconomic order or status quo that keeps women, poor folks and minorities "in their place". Progressives reject the notion that people are evil and believe in a social order that is much more inclusive, that offers an even playing field giving everyone a fair shot at upward mobility. There might be variations of this theme among individuals and their philosophies but I still think these labels have a legitimate place in our language.
I do agree that toxic media uses various tactics to keep us distracted and divided. It benefits us to minimize its negative impact on our thoughts and actions by exposing it to the light of day. But I can't dismiss those two particular categories as simply a product of divisive propaganda. - Aliceinwonderland
I would love to see just one day where everyone who makes under $50,000/year doesn't go to work. No waitresses, garbage pick up, housekeeping, bus drivers, check out clerks, the list goes on...
Kenw, Thom was trying to make it sound like these poor bus drivers only make $14,00 / hr and although that is true in a few short years thier wage doubles. $29.00 isn't bad is it?
The despicable NRA ad re Obama's children does something I haven't heard comment on. In the middle of their screed they throw in a comment on taxing the rich. Can someone possibly offer a logical link for me?
Shame on our government!
Will the True Leaders of Justice please stand up. (crickets)
One more nail in yhe peoples right to work in groups for mutual benifitt coffin.
With regard to CO2 increase in the atmosphere: Human hemoglobin cannot handle too high CO2 concentration. 30 minutes at 5% Co2 is probab;y fatal (Needs confirmation as to LD50 rate). Turtles can exist 20 minutes under water and other existing reptiles can exist for similar periods but humans will lose conscuoisness in about 3 monutes or less.
At least those bus drivers, at $35,000 a year, do way more work than those conniving sinecure CEOs and other top executives making $35 million a year (a thousand times more). You could dump all those top execs and put their underpaid secretaries in their slots and they would do just as well or even better in many cases. The more the rich yell about those at the bottom making peanuts for pay the more they have us on the defensive. We need to be more on the offense about how much these top execs get paid. Keep the pressure on making them pay their fair share of taxes...progressive taxes..the more they make...the more they have to pay.... and stop them from evading taxes using their offshore accounts and other tricks they use.
With all due respect gang I do truly believe we should refrain from using divisive language. By this I mean the words "Liberal" and "Conservative". In fact, I do believe we can all make much more progress and agree if we eliminate any other group label that comes with corporate assigned ways of thinking. We can do this friends. We are all intelligent and disciplined enough to brake out of the programmed box the media has built for us.
In my ideal, improved paradigm no one considers themselves or anyone else a Liberal, Conservative, Republican, Democrat, Black, White, Right, Left, Up, Down, Progressive, Communist, Socialist, Marxist, Blue, Red, Green, or Polka Dot. Everyone should consider themselves US--We The People--and depending on the issue or question--Right or Wrong. Oh, I'll even approve of Smart and Stupid. They are far less insulting labels; and, in more situations than not more accurate descriptions of people.
Ginning up emotions by giving into idealistic labels prevents us from thinking clearly and resolving issues. I'm sure all of you know a very Liberal thinking Conservative or a very Conservative thinking Liberal. Hell, you might even be one of these yourself. Why? BECAUSE THESE LABELS MEAN NOTHING!! lol
All I'm suggesting is that maybe we can make a little faster progress if we avoid the pitfalls the real adversaries set before us to make us trip over each other rather then move forward together. There really are no Conservatives or Liberals. They are made up fictitious titles that the establishment dealt out so we can get mad and call each other names. Controlling us demands that we waste energy fighting and hating each other.We fall for it because it is easier to blame each other than it is to work together; yet overcoming our Corporate Masters demand that we work together.
My suggestion--loose the labels. Please!
Just a little idea!
It is as if the Conservatives live in a parallel universe to the progressives where employers feel they have the right to pay the lowest wages they can to increase their profit margin, with no regard for the worker. I will not start name calling, especially those like Kend. As he has reminded me he has a heart, a brain I am not so sure of. Too start with the vast majority of the children on these buses have special needs. The vast majority of the kids with no handicap take alternative means of transportation. But like all good CONservatives they cry foul without knowing all the facts. Does anyone out there that actually works with his or her hands believe after 6 years of driving children around New York, that $29 hour is is excessive? I suppose if you run a sweat shop manned with illegals you would think this is an outrage that someone should make a living wage when entrusted with the safety of our most vulnerable asset, our children! Then again those who would complain are actually against any UNION JOB! Every CONservative Republican I have ever met has stated they have the right to pay their employees whatever they want, so as to make the most profit from the workers work. So typical, it sounds like Kend and other Neo CONservatives that have left their comments here. Ask the parents of the young and handicapped children if $29. an hour is to much, to make sure their kids are safe traveling to and from school and I think we already know the answer to that question. If any idiot out there thinks busing children around N.Y. or here in S. Cal. is an easy kick back job for a starting wage of $14 an hour, you obviously know less than I give you credit for. Hell, most parents have a hard time driving just their own brats around town. Why is it the CONservatives always see labor as an easy mark to criticize and feel the UNION WORKERS are always making too much. Why, because the unionized workers generally vote DEMOCRAT in elections and that pisses off the CONservatives in every way imaginable! I doubt you would hear one word from the CONservatives if the workers were non-union and making $8 an hour! I really do not think an increase of $2 an hour a year for driving children around N.Y. is unreasonable. The buses we see hauling adults on their routes around S. Cal. make about the same amount after 6 years of service. I guess if your use to paying minimum wage in a sweat shop, paying more than $8 an hour like Wal-Mart is an outrage! I get so tired of the CONservatives decrying the wages the blue collar workers make who are in a union is to high! How much do Canadian bus drivers make? Of course if they are civil servants or union workers you would think minimum wage is too high of a wage! And your calculations for a family of three are not even based on any factual statistics, like most CONservatives you grab figures out of your, well I guess you can imagine where I think you pulled these stats from. And to make a statement like Bain Capital could do it for less, leaves no doubt that you are as greedy as Rummey's partners at B.C. are, when it comes to the American Worker. Stay in Canada they obviously appreciate you more than we would if you were down here in the States. And after your remarks please do not give me the line that you take good care of your employees and they really like working for you! Ha! And to think they actually get benefits for themselves, that must drive people like the CONservatives crazy! Hell, what ever happened to good old slave labor like they have in China where good ole' Bain Capital sent most of the jobs from the companies they shut down for greater profit in their pockets! Nothing like a two tier society where you have the people who are doing well off the sweat of the workers and you have the poor class of the working class. Must sound like a great society for people like yourself and the rest of CONservatives who comment here.
I salute the bus drivers. Strikes are an appropriate response to the abusive business practices of employers, whether those employers are from the private sector or state or local government.
- Aliceinwonderland
As Ossie Davis said, "Fear is worse than death, because it holds the mind hostage."
Very, very good point!!!!
I also did a little fact checking!
"Between 1979 and 2007 incomes of the top 1% of Americans GREW by an average of 275%."
"Since 1979 the average pre-tax income for the bottom 90% of households has DECREASED by $900, while that of the top 1% increased by over $700,000, as federal taxation became LESS PROGRESSIVE."
"From 1973 to 2011, worker productivity grew 80%, while median hourly compensation, grew by just one-eighth that amount."
A while back I think I heard Thom mention something about worker productivity and wages becoming increasingly out of whack with each other, so much so that the average worker should currently be making about $100,000 a year with a 30 hour work week. Instead the non-union environment we suffer with in this country has made it possible for the very few to build massive fortunes at the expense of the very many. If our Government can't find a way to legislate against this rapidly growing economic inequality, then widespread UNIONIZATION is our only hope, with Democratic SOCIALISM the ultimate answer.
Yes that Flying Spaghetti Monster and the Raptor Jesus are quite a pair. As a devout believer, I have my Ramen noodle soup every Friday...and often in between. In fact, I celebrated the Winter Solstice (Christmas to others) with a nice warm bowl of Ramen. And other noodles are just dandy as well. I know that many other people are going to go to meat loaf hell because they are non-believers. I pity them, of course.
Actually, I was born an atheist (was just kidding about TFSM and RJ), even though my parents...especially my mom (not necessarily my dad..although he had to keep up a rudimentary semblance of being religious...I really don't think he was)..tried to indoctrinate me in some other "pagan" faith...Methodist...then I've met my share of Baptists and Catholics along the way as friends, co-workers, and relatives..many of whom tried to save me..believing that everyone else, but themselves, would go to hell.
Yes, I know that we all have our own experiences that determine what we believe...and not everyone will believe the same way
By the way, I just went to the movies and saw some previews of an upcoming movie that looks really interesting. Called "Mama", del Toro's latest movie is a scary one..like demon possession.
"He cautions it is unlike anything you have seen from him prior." "Mama has an incredibility strong base of reality, and emotional reality," del Toro said.
http://www.moviefanatic.com/2013/01/mama-guillermo-del-toro-talks-terrif...
By the way, I used to live in the Bay Area back in 1989 during that earthquake and I experienced it. Talk about coincidence..I had cut my overseas trip short, unexpectedly, and when I got to SFO I went through customs and as I was extremely tired, I accidentally ran my cart carrying my luggage into the large door upon exiting and knocked it off it's rollers. I thought they were going to call me back and give me problems but I was lucky and went on my way. I was awakened in the middle of the day as I was trying to get some sleep from the long trip. I just thought it was so odd how I was able to get back just in time to experience it. Just lucky, I guess!
Nostradamus, the Bible...all of those sources tend to be very vague (but obviously some people don't think so). Quoting from them doesn't prove anything to me..just because they use a familiar word here and there doesn't mean anything to me. It's like going to a scary movie...it's entertainment..and that's all..and that's how I see it.
I recognize that others read all kinds of meanings into things said or written. What ever turns them on...good for them. Ramen noodles turn me on...but then next week I might shift to something else and not feel like I've committed a sin.
Of course, if I were like many people who see demons, I might look into my bowl of noodles and see a picture, or a word, that I could conjure up in my mind that it has some esoteric meaning. Most other people, upon hearing of my revelation might get a little chuckle. Anyway, got to go...it's Ramen noodle time!
Since Karl Marx lived a lavish life style was his Communist Manifesto a warning to capitalist's or an endorcement of communism. There is a little bit of communism in everyone who borrows a cup of sugar from their neighbor. Old time barn raisings, hravest cooperations, etc. For the coproate beast
to ask the workers to scarifice for the lifestyle of beamer pilots makes little sense and validates communist points of view. The corporate world needs to be shaken down. Anti trust violations need to be enacted. I don't think it is about money, I think the money is a way to control with more absolute power. Money corrupts. Power corupts absolute.